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On March 10 2011 13:18 Zzoram wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2011 13:15 jalstar wrote:On March 10 2011 13:01 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:00 Clare wrote:
One thing I don't get is why are some people ONLY interested in watching the foreigners play? Even if the foreigners aren't as good as the Koreans, they will stop watching when they get knocked out. It makes no sense to me whatsoever... if the best players in the world are playing in the GSL, then I'll continue to watch. It's the whiteness factor. Many white people want to watch white people win. People rarely admit it, but it's the truth. A lot of the Europeans have mangled English and boring interviews as well, but their whiteness makes them more interesting to many people than a superior Korean player. Don't BS please, lots of foreigners are of asian descent. It's the fact that we know them from small tournaments that Koreans don't know about, streams, and forum posts, much like Korean fans know the lesser-known Koreans. Cella is much more widely known than most Koreans of his skill level because he streams, Select isn't white but he's as well or more well known to foreigners than a lot of white players. Using the race card is just so wrong here. Even in the coverage of GSL qualifiers, Incontrol gets a ton of screen time but Select, who is likely a much better foreigner player, gets almost nothing. Plus when you hear people talk about foreigners in GSL, they always forget guys like Sen and Loner. Why do you think that is?
It's a good point but keep in mind, you're only talking about the English speaking world (that uses TL). Go to a Chinese-speaking forum and there won't be any confusion about whether Sen is a foreigner.
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GSL keeps getting better and better, last season Code A had some real embarrassingly low level play now you got "nobodies" coming out in full force playing like they could make a run at top4 of Code S. Only downside I have with GSL is the time that it's on, really messes with my sleep and I really dislike watching things that aren't live so if I miss a game I almost never go back to watch it unless it gets an insane amount of hype as a great game.
Outside of the GSL the level of play is a lot of the time is far from impressive to watch sometimes its even down right sad and it's like I'm seriously paying to watch this? I'll give NASL, MLG and TSL a shot, but my expectations aren't too high for them. I don't have the standard foreigner fanboi issues, I don't care who the player is outside of the booth I just want to see the game being played at the highest level possible.
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On March 10 2011 13:28 GagnarTheUnruly wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2011 13:18 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:15 jalstar wrote:On March 10 2011 13:01 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:00 Clare wrote:
One thing I don't get is why are some people ONLY interested in watching the foreigners play? Even if the foreigners aren't as good as the Koreans, they will stop watching when they get knocked out. It makes no sense to me whatsoever... if the best players in the world are playing in the GSL, then I'll continue to watch. It's the whiteness factor. Many white people want to watch white people win. People rarely admit it, but it's the truth. A lot of the Europeans have mangled English and boring interviews as well, but their whiteness makes them more interesting to many people than a superior Korean player. Don't BS please, lots of foreigners are of asian descent. It's the fact that we know them from small tournaments that Koreans don't know about, streams, and forum posts, much like Korean fans know the lesser-known Koreans. Cella is much more widely known than most Koreans of his skill level because he streams, Select isn't white but he's as well or more well known to foreigners than a lot of white players. Using the race card is just so wrong here. Even in the coverage of GSL qualifiers, Incontrol gets a ton of screen time but Select, who is likely a much better foreigner player, gets almost nothing. Plus when you hear people talk about foreigners in GSL, they always forget guys like Sen and Loner. Why do you think that is? It's a good point but keep in mind, you're only talking about the English speaking world (that uses TL). Go to a Chinese-speaking forum and there won't be any confusion about whether Sen is a foreigner.
I don't think the fact that people speak English on the forum reduces their capacity to identify who is or is not Korean in any way.
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I think for a lot of people, it's three things:
1) The new car smell has worn off, and like anything, its now taken for granted.
2) Lots of favourites were eliminated early this season. The remaining players (for the most part) were quite uninteresting, or the results of upcoming matches were fairly predictable.
3) Attention is being diverted by other big tournaments with other big names. Some of these events might occur in more convenient timeslots than the GSL, so the focus has shifted.
For me, GSL is still just as awesome, I dont miss a single game. Been buying premium tickets since day 1 and will continue to do so for as long as I have an active internet connection. 
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On March 10 2011 13:18 Zzoram wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2011 13:15 jalstar wrote:On March 10 2011 13:01 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:00 Clare wrote:
One thing I don't get is why are some people ONLY interested in watching the foreigners play? Even if the foreigners aren't as good as the Koreans, they will stop watching when they get knocked out. It makes no sense to me whatsoever... if the best players in the world are playing in the GSL, then I'll continue to watch. It's the whiteness factor. Many white people want to watch white people win. People rarely admit it, but it's the truth. A lot of the Europeans have mangled English and boring interviews as well, but their whiteness makes them more interesting to many people than a superior Korean player. Don't BS please, lots of foreigners are of asian descent. It's the fact that we know them from small tournaments that Koreans don't know about, streams, and forum posts, much like Korean fans know the lesser-known Koreans. Cella is much more widely known than most Koreans of his skill level because he streams, Select isn't white but he's as well or more well known to foreigners than a lot of white players. Using the race card is just so wrong here. I'm not saying it's the only factor, but it's definitely a really big one that people aren't willing to admit. Select doesn't get half the attention that he should, everyone was shitting on his play despite making it to the MLG finals having to play more matches than anyone else at that tournament. Even in the coverage of GSL qualifiers, Incontrol gets a ton of screen time but Select, who is likely a much better foreigner player, gets almost nothing. Plus when you hear people talk about foreigners in GSL, they always forget guys like Sen and Loner. Why do you think that is?
Sen just hasn't done much lately, he was really popular in December, and he doesn't speak English well at all.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=170834
Look at the poll at the end and say TL views all Asians the same.
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completely lost interest in it after season 2. only matches i watch now are the foreigners and the finals.
don't know why. i like the games i watch, but i just don't feel like i have the time or money to watch everything.
i guess i just feel i'd rather spend the time practicing myself. i used to love watching pro matches, but now i feel that time not spent practicing myself is time wasted.
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Skipped a lot of the Code A series even though I said I would watch everything at the start. I don't think I need to explain why that happened. Not amused with a few of the players that have made it into the Ro8 but still enjoying Code S.
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Dao or w/e isn't cutting it and kelly was /meh. They need to keep artosis or tasteless in code A until they find a good established Code A caster. Just do it on a 3 person rotation.
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On March 10 2011 13:31 jalstar wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2011 13:18 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:15 jalstar wrote:On March 10 2011 13:01 Zzoram wrote:On March 10 2011 13:00 Clare wrote:
One thing I don't get is why are some people ONLY interested in watching the foreigners play? Even if the foreigners aren't as good as the Koreans, they will stop watching when they get knocked out. It makes no sense to me whatsoever... if the best players in the world are playing in the GSL, then I'll continue to watch. It's the whiteness factor. Many white people want to watch white people win. People rarely admit it, but it's the truth. A lot of the Europeans have mangled English and boring interviews as well, but their whiteness makes them more interesting to many people than a superior Korean player. Don't BS please, lots of foreigners are of asian descent. It's the fact that we know them from small tournaments that Koreans don't know about, streams, and forum posts, much like Korean fans know the lesser-known Koreans. Cella is much more widely known than most Koreans of his skill level because he streams, Select isn't white but he's as well or more well known to foreigners than a lot of white players. Using the race card is just so wrong here. I'm not saying it's the only factor, but it's definitely a really big one that people aren't willing to admit. Select doesn't get half the attention that he should, everyone was shitting on his play despite making it to the MLG finals having to play more matches than anyone else at that tournament. Even in the coverage of GSL qualifiers, Incontrol gets a ton of screen time but Select, who is likely a much better foreigner player, gets almost nothing. Plus when you hear people talk about foreigners in GSL, they always forget guys like Sen and Loner. Why do you think that is? Sen just hasn't done much lately, he was really popular in December, and he doesn't speak English well at all. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=170834Look at the poll at the end and say TL views all Asians the same.
I didn't say TL views all Asians the same, but part of TL certainly doesn't seem to care as much about the Chinese foreigners. As for the poll, I believe that was still during the time between S2 and S3 when Idra couldn't stop talking about how bad Nestea was and how lucky he was to face MarineKingPrime who Idra also thought was bad. TL latching onto Idra's words and thinking Nestea was actually bad was not a surprise, despite Nestea having a 5-0 ZvZ record in GSL before facing Sen.
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Top 8 I'll watch (unless it's houngun or mkp) but the rest I don't even bother unless I'm feeling down and need a new strat to try bashing newbies. A lot of the games are just so bad before round of 16. (not as bad as before code S, but still bad)
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On March 10 2011 13:35 Count9 wrote:
Top 8 I'll watch (unless it's houngun or mkp) but the rest I don't even bother unless I'm feeling down and need a new strat to try bashing newbies. A lot of the games are just so bad before round of 16. (not as bad as before code S, but still bad)
Why won't you watch mkp?
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For me gsl is getting more fun as I am starting to really have a feel for all the players. I think the gap in skill level between koreans and foreigners just continues to widen as well so the differencei in the quality of the games is really noticeable when I try and watch non gsl.
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It's because the foreigners are part of this community. You see them streaming and posting from time to time on the same website you do, so you've got a connection to them. I have 0 connection to someone like Byun.
Also, foreigners are special. When there 2 foreigners in the GSL, you root for them. In fact I was rooting for the Koreans during IEM, because they were special. It's not because of racism or anything.
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Not really - this season you just don't see some of your favourite players going deep, just saddens me a little.
On the other side, new players have a chance to come out big - look at sanZenith.
All in all I'll get me the premium ticket for the next tourney as well since it is kinda cheap and it's totally legit to pay for things I enjoy.
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On March 10 2011 13:37 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2011 13:35 Count9 wrote:
Top 8 I'll watch (unless it's houngun or mkp) but the rest I don't even bother unless I'm feeling down and need a new strat to try bashing newbies. A lot of the games are just so bad before round of 16. (not as bad as before code S, but still bad) Why won't you watch mkp?
TL doesn't like to watch aggressive terrans win.
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MKP is a pretty great Terran and deserves to be in Code S. People are always bitching about how players don't have style, but MKP certainly does. He has a unique style that nobody else plays, he's hyper aggressive, and he's been pretty successful. You'd think that would make him into a fan favourite, but yet everyone shits on his play.
He lost to MVP and everyone was ridiculously happy to see him go down, but beating tons of great players only to lose to the best in the world in no way makes MKP bad.
I don't think people understand MKP's record. His only GSL Bo3/5/7 losses are to:
MVP
MC
Nestea
Who are probably the best players in the world of their respective races.
MKP is a fucking beast and TL hates him because Idra and Incontrol senselessly hate him on State of the Game.
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Quite the opposite.
Back in season 1 and 2 I used to find it quite boring, all the games would be all ins or just pretty boring games in general. My interest went to a low point around midway through season 4. Then the gstl happened, I decided to watch the finals for the heck of it and was blown away, interest is back up.
But in general I kinda look forward to western events like the MLG. I liked all the MLGs that happened last year.
Maybe because I know the players and teams better, like tl,eg and fnatic, or maybe because the players here dont really do all-ins that much so that leads to macro games more often than not.
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I watched most big us and europe tournaments so far and I have to say, they are not even close to gsl in terms of fun and quality.The only exception was the reddit invitational tournament. That was awesome.
I can only imagine that gsl will get better because the bad players get thrown out and the strategies on the new maps get more refined. On the other hand most european top players seem to stagnate. For example whitera's pvz at IEM is still the same after 3-4 month.
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gsl still has the best players. and with the world thing it could get more interesting. i really dont think foreigners will ever be able to top gsl even nasl probably wont top it.
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No interest lost for me. For the first time we are finally seeing some Protoss players doing well, and some better representation in the top 4 than almost all T's. Plus, my mancrush oGsMC is decimating everyone and making a strong case for the first repeat champion.
And how can anyone deny the powerhouse than is MANzenith?
My only loss of interest is with Code A. The games are far better but the casters can't touch Tastosis and my favourite players Squirtle and Ace dropped out in the first round. Guess it was worth it to let them dominate IEM, but still.
Oh, and lack of Artosis code S interviews sucks.
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EPT
