EPT
Fighting!The Battlecry of the Damned: Imbalance - Page 2
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VoiceOfDecember
Australia206 Posts
Fighting! | ||
KoalaZerg
14 Posts
On January 07 2011 10:42 Gemini_19 wrote: Please....post this on the B.net forums....it might save humanity... I agree with Gemini, I used to go to the B.net forums until just a few days ago, and it is flooded with people crying imbalance. I really liked your post a lot. | ||
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MetalSlug
Germany443 Posts
I think most of the IMBA talk comes from people who transfered over from WC3 and DOTA tho... | ||
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
As it stands right now, SC2 is more balanced than any RTS can hope to be. Perhaps a few values can be tweaked. Perhaps a few units and upgrades could be added in the expansions. Nevertheless, skill will always trump balance. Get owned by too many marauders? Well, I guess I just got out-macroed. Get owned by a 4gate? Well, I guess I should've scouted. Balance is for the realm of statistics and numbers. In the individual game, it gives way to individual skill. Unless someone plays a perfect game, they should be talking more about their own play instead of the overall balance of the game. If you audition for an orchestra and fail, it's not because the other person had a better instrument. It is because you simply got outclassed and/or outpracticed. | ||
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MK4512
Canada938 Posts
If u think BW is better go play it Don't talk about imbalance Lets go back to what Starcraft once was, a fun way to pass the time, and do something we love. And have an entire expanding community of people to interact with while we play. The Starcraft scene should have gotten better with the large foreigner proscene, but it's worse. Anyway that's it. Hope you enjoyed the read. This times 1000, tired of hearing the 'imbalance' of the day in the strat forum... Along with BW players trying to kill SC2 and vice versa... | ||
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Ursad0n
United States523 Posts
okay so: @Oxb: Happy Birthday!!! and I have had problems since I started in BW (and continuing in SC2) with getting my builds going on time, so I'm going to practice the first X minuets vs the AI till I nail it, then I'll do it for X+2 minuets, until I get decent at it I think @eviltomahawk: Exactly! If you lose to a 4gate it's not because it's imba, if you scout it and prepare they're not too hard to beat. and like day9 said in the monobattles, (except we'll use it for all out units) If you're making zerglings and they kill it with mutuas, then u just have to make more zerglings. If you get walked over by a huge army, then you should have just made more. It's easier to just have more shit and win than have to micro, so just find a way to make more shit. @MK4512 Thank you! I feel like "Imbalance" comes up more than "the" if you use the search function | ||
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Shigy
United States346 Posts
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thisblindman
Philippines50 Posts
THUMBS UP! | ||
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Ursad0n
United States523 Posts
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imareaver3
United States906 Posts
Now right now, everyone admits that the big problem is the map pool. You say that we should ignore the fact that some maps are fairly imbalanced, or at least more imbalanced than they should be--and that, even worse, maps are positionally imbalanced in ways--but if we do that, nothing will change. Yes, players can win on imbalanced maps--but the existence of say, close-positions LT/Metalopolis, Steppes, and Delta for Zergs, or (arguably...) Blistering Sands for Protoss, or Scrap Station for Terrans, just makes the game a lot less enjoyable. Some map imbalance is tolerable, but this many biased maps detracts from the game; look at the all-ins in the GSL. And to make things worse, Blizz isn't doing anything to suggest map rotation, or a more open map pool, or community maps. So we need to complain. We need to rant. We need to make sure that Blizz knows that we as the community care about the game, realize the maps are hurting it and its competitive future, and want to change that. | ||
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Phenny
Australia1435 Posts
But yes, excellent thrad! | ||
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windsupernova
Mexico5280 Posts
We should just focus on playing the game and not in being the balance police. | ||
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BLINKOFF
United States79 Posts
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Nalta
United States44 Posts
I 100% agree (as a bit of a Day-ciple i must say people need to learn to be a better game before they call everything imba) | ||
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DougJDempsey
747 Posts
On January 07 2011 11:42 imareaver3 wrote: You're right about how complaining about imbalance won't make you a better player--but it sure is necessary. Remember the old phoenix bug? Where they were stuck after using grav beam? And how almost no one complained about it? Well, it took a month to get fixed. Compare that to the Ultralisk bug, which was fixed in a week after being bitched about by every other Terran in the bnet forum. Clearly, complaining has its results--both of those bugs arguably messed up the game, and the one complained about more was fixed way faster. Now right now, everyone admits that the big problem is the map pool. You say that we should ignore the fact that some maps are fairly imbalanced, or at least more imbalanced than they should be--and that, even worse, maps are positionally imbalanced in ways--but if we do that, nothing will change. Yes, players can win on imbalanced maps--but the existence of say, close-positions LT/Metalopolis, Steppes, and Delta for Zergs, or (arguably...) Blistering Sands for Protoss, or Scrap Station for Terrans, just makes the game a lot less enjoyable. Some map imbalance is tolerable, but this many biased maps detracts from the game; look at the all-ins in the GSL. And to make things worse, Blizz isn't doing anything to suggest map rotation, or a more open map pool, or community maps. So we need to complain. We need to rant. We need to make sure that Blizz knows that we as the community care about the game, realize the maps are hurting it and its competitive future, and want to change that. Those were actual bugs, not "omg i just lost a game because some terran massed op marauders and i did all i could!" | ||
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Ursad0n
United States523 Posts
On January 07 2011 11:42 imareaver3 wrote: You're right about how complaining about imbalance won't make you a better player--but it sure is necessary. Remember the old phoenix bug? Where they were stuck after using grav beam? And how almost no one complained about it? Well, it took a month to get fixed. Compare that to the Ultralisk bug, which was fixed in a week after being bitched about by every other Terran in the bnet forum. Clearly, complaining has its results--both of those bugs arguably messed up the game, and the one complained about more was fixed way faster. Now right now, everyone admits that the big problem is the map pool. You say that we should ignore the fact that some maps are fairly imbalanced, or at least more imbalanced than they should be--and that, even worse, maps are positionally imbalanced in ways--but if we do that, nothing will change. Yes, players can win on imbalanced maps--but the existence of say, close-positions LT/Metalopolis, Steppes, and Delta for Zergs, or (arguably...) Blistering Sands for Protoss, or Scrap Station for Terrans, just makes the game a lot less enjoyable. Some map imbalance is tolerable, but this many biased maps detracts from the game; look at the all-ins in the GSL. And to make things worse, Blizz isn't doing anything to suggest map rotation, or a more open map pool, or community maps. So we need to complain. We need to rant. We need to make sure that Blizz knows that we as the community care about the game, realize the maps are hurting it and its competitive future, and want to change that. Here is what I have to say: There is a difference between a BUG and Imbalance, one is real, one is imaginary, bugs need to be reported but that's not what I mean by imbalance. Yeah they may favor certain things, but what are you gonna do? You DO NOT need to bitch/rant, perhaps calmly and eloquently explaining to them what maps have problems, why, and how to improve it is what's nevessary. Saying "HEY FUCK YOU GUYS CAN'T MAKE MAPS FOR SHIT BLAH BLAH BLAh......." gets you nothing, they're going to ignore that shit. If people spent half the time playing as they did complaining about the map balance they could probably find a solution or at least find a less bad strategy for those maps EDIT: and to above: I think that a 2 hatch mutua build could easily deal with a lot of terran builds (related because people complain about marauders but don't realize air kills them) And it would depend on micro, like it should, like it did in BW. Magic Box and shit >>> thor. | ||
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Lonyo
United Kingdom3884 Posts
But I think most people just don't like the type of gameplay that they promote, due to short distances. It's kind of "imbalanced" towards races which can do early pressure without an economic hit, but more importantly, it's BORING and promotes arguably lame games where you're always going to see the same sort of build/attack. People can defend it, but it's still lame. As far as map imbalances, there are things like Scrap Station which has positional imbalances. | ||
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-orb-
United States5770 Posts
Do you seriously not realize that baller is an alt account? AFAIK it's still pretty much agreed upon that baller is Hot_Bid's alt. Even if it isn't, it's pretty generally agreed that it's an alt of a high post count user that's been here for years. Pretending like he's a new user that just got here with sc2 and yet puts out good quality posts is a joke | ||
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DrBoo
Canada1177 Posts
"Is it really the game, or is it me" | ||
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Ursad0n
United States523 Posts
On January 07 2011 11:51 Lonyo wrote: On the final map point, some maps are imbalanced as a fact. But I think most people just don't like the type of gameplay that they promote, due to short distances. It's kind of "imbalanced" towards races which can do early pressure without an economic hit, but more importantly, it's BORING and promotes arguably lame games where you're always going to see the same sort of build/attack. People can defend it, but it's still lame. As far as map imbalances, there are things like Scrap Station which has positional imbalances. It's lame because nobody has been able to come up with the "Safe 90% of the time" builds, once people find safe openings the games wont be boring, again it's not an issue of maps it's an issue of playstyle and the fact that safe builds wont exist in <1 year. It takes time On January 07 2011 11:52 -orb- wrote: Many of the points here are good, but I thought I should point out how dumb you make yourself look when you use baller as your reference for a low post count user with a good post quality. Do you seriously not realize that baller is an alt account? AFAIK it's still pretty much agreed upon that baller is Hot_Bid's alt. Even if it isn't, it's pretty generally agreed that it's an alt of a high post count user that's been here for years. Pretending like he's a new user that just got here with sc2 and yet puts out good quality posts is a joke While that is true and a good point, I still like the example, partially because most people didn't know that, and partially because those posts were badass. But most importantly I didn't want to search through the 100k shitty posters to find some of the quality posters with low post counts amongst them, as I knew I'd be spending large amounts of time searching deep into the history of the internet for the early BW content. | ||
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