|
Is there any evidence to say its not just completely random?
There are divisions with less than 30 players in it. It would make sense to wait till one gets full then create a new one, right? But the system actually wait to put some players in the Rank S, while keeping creating new Rank E divisions. I think that is strong enough evidence :D
------
Edit: once again I am the first in a page... I swear I am not doing it on purpose lol.
------
People are bringing examples for LA server, proving that someone should be at top 200. I tried to figure it out with math, but there seems to me that the math is 100% right for the people actually in top 200, but for some reason some players are "blocked" away from official top 200. Though I can't think of any reason, so it could be just a bug. (it's not activit, it's not rested points, it's not a new division problem, nor being new in a division problem, so I bet in some kind of bug on Blizzard's end lol).
|
United States12240 Posts
On December 01 2010 09:33 SDream wrote:There are divisions with less than 30 players in it. It would make sense to wait till one gets full then create a new one, right? But the system actually wait to put some players in the Rank S, while keeping creating new Rank E divisions. I think that is strong enough evidence :D ------ Edit: once again I am the first in a page... I swear I am not doing it on purpose lol. ------ People are bringing examples for LA server, proving that someone should be at top 200. I tried to figure it out with math, but there seems to me that the math is 100% right for the people actually in top 200, but for some reason some players are "blocked" away from official top 200. Though I can't think of any reason, so it could be just a bug. (it's not activit, it's not rested points, it's not a new division problem, nor being new in a division problem, so I bet in some kind of bug on Blizzard's end lol).
Why did it take so long for you to join TL? You are awesome.
|
Uraj Omega baby! S-rank FTW!!!
Joking, i actually dont care about it that much! considering Blizzard has already announced that a new season gona start soon, top tier players no longer consider laddering anymore, all they care is maintaining their current position and do lots of custom games with clamates!
|
I might pull some data from SEA tonight for you, if you'd like. I'm just curious as to how many points I need to make Top 200 there, so I can focus on NA.
Started some work, probably need to write myself a formula rather than doing it by eye XD and maybe grab some previous data, rather than just working on the current list.
|
|
|
sup excalibur, iw anted to say how much i appreciate your work !! and the time you took to answer my PM keep up the good work in the bnet forums
take care
|
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:
This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world. #60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions. To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated. Top15 of our division are in EU top200. One would think that such a division is prime example of S class. Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B.
If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working.
To start, can we agree that activity != skill?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions.
If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division.
But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200.
The system is correctly encouraging you to play more: deluding you into thinking you can advance higher and higher.
Carrot: Top 200 list
Horse: You
* Dangle * Dangle
Sorry if it's a bit brutal
The only weakness I see is the scenario where a B teamer becomes good enough to deserve to be in a S Diamond division.
The only real way to change divisions then is to tank to demote, then win at an absurd rate to regain your true MMR. Hopefully you can delay promotion long enough to get a high enough MMR to be in a decent division.
Oddly enough, this is exactly OPPOSITE what people were doing when they tried to game the system back at release. Oh situational irony, how I love thee.
|
On December 01 2010 18:48 Emperor_Earth wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:
This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world. #60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions. To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated. Top15 of our division are in EU top200. One would think that such a division is prime example of S class. Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B. If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working. To start, can we agree that activity != skill? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions. If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division. But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200. The system is correctly encouraging you to play more deluding you into thinking you can advance higher and higher. Carrot: Top 200 list Horse: You * Dangle * Dangle Sorry if it's a bit brutal
The only weakness I see is the scenario where a B teamer becomes good enough to deserve to be in a S Diamond division. The only real way to change divisions then is to tank to demote, then win at an absurd rate to regain your true MMR. Hopefully you can delay promotion long enough to get a high enough MMR to be in a decent division. Oddly enough, this is exactly OPPOSITE what people were doing when they tried to game the system back at release. Oh situational irony, how I love thee.
Are you implying it's hard to get promoted to an S class division?
I was promoted after around 30 games to Norad Phi on EU (A rank division).
I don't know if Excalibur can explain this to me or anyone else but does promoting to a high division means u start with low rating with lots of bonus pool points and promoting to low division means high rating with less bonus pool points?
Maybe this has something to do with the division modifier? I got promoted to Norad Phi with 450 rating~ with about 1k bonus pool points while my practice partners got promoted to a lower division with 1500rating and only 400 bonus pool points~. I don't know if this is some kind of hint about the amount of division tiers but maybe I just want to see this pattern ><
|
On December 01 2010 19:09 shannn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 18:48 Emperor_Earth wrote:On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:
This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world. #60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions. To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated. Top15 of our division are in EU top200. One would think that such a division is prime example of S class. Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B. If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working. To start, can we agree that activity != skill? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions. If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division. But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200. The system is correctly encouraging you to play more deluding you into thinking you can advance higher and higher. Carrot: Top 200 list Horse: You * Dangle * Dangle Sorry if it's a bit brutal
The only weakness I see is the scenario where a B teamer becomes good enough to deserve to be in a S Diamond division. The only real way to change divisions then is to tank to demote, then win at an absurd rate to regain your true MMR. Hopefully you can delay promotion long enough to get a high enough MMR to be in a decent division. Oddly enough, this is exactly OPPOSITE what people were doing when they tried to game the system back at release. Oh situational irony, how I love thee. Are you implying it's hard to get promoted to an S class division? I was promoted after around 30 games to Norad Phi on EU (A rank division). I don't know if Excalibur can explain this to me or anyone else but does promoting to a high division means u start with low rating with lots of bonus pool points and promoting to low division means high rating with less bonus pool points? Maybe this has something to do with the division modifier? I got promoted to Norad Phi with 450 rating~ with about 1k bonus pool points while my practice partners got promoted to a lower division with 1500rating and only 400 bonus pool points~. I don't know if this is some kind of hint about the amount of division tiers but maybe I just want to see this pattern ><
To start, I'm nowhere near Excalibur Z on my understanding of the ladder system.
But, as I understand it:
S >>> A
+ Show Spoiler +Self-explanatory
It takes much longer to confirm you belong in S, much shorter that you belong in A.
First because it's a higher skill level.
Second because there's less available S level players to confirm your skill level vs. The next point relates to this in greater detail.
Timing of laddering
+ Show Spoiler +If you're laddering at times where there's not many ppl near your true MMR online, they system will have a hard time confirming your actual MMR curve.
If Team USA keeps playing my high school basketball team, it's going to take about 100 games before I'm truly convinced that Team USA is pretty damn good, while it would only take 5 games if they were to play against say Team Spain.
The availability of people in your true MMR range should play a role in how quickly you get placed if my logic is sound and based on sound starting points^^
|
On December 01 2010 19:18 Emperor_Earth wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 19:09 shannn wrote:On December 01 2010 18:48 Emperor_Earth wrote:On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:
This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world. #60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions. To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated. Top15 of our division are in EU top200. One would think that such a division is prime example of S class. Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B. If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working. To start, can we agree that activity != skill? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions. If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division. But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200. The system is correctly encouraging you to play more deluding you into thinking you can advance higher and higher. Carrot: Top 200 list Horse: You * Dangle * Dangle Sorry if it's a bit brutal
The only weakness I see is the scenario where a B teamer becomes good enough to deserve to be in a S Diamond division. The only real way to change divisions then is to tank to demote, then win at an absurd rate to regain your true MMR. Hopefully you can delay promotion long enough to get a high enough MMR to be in a decent division. Oddly enough, this is exactly OPPOSITE what people were doing when they tried to game the system back at release. Oh situational irony, how I love thee. Are you implying it's hard to get promoted to an S class division? I was promoted after around 30 games to Norad Phi on EU (A rank division). I don't know if Excalibur can explain this to me or anyone else but does promoting to a high division means u start with low rating with lots of bonus pool points and promoting to low division means high rating with less bonus pool points? Maybe this has something to do with the division modifier? I got promoted to Norad Phi with 450 rating~ with about 1k bonus pool points while my practice partners got promoted to a lower division with 1500rating and only 400 bonus pool points~. I don't know if this is some kind of hint about the amount of division tiers but maybe I just want to see this pattern >< To start, I'm nowhere near Excalibur Z on my understanding of the ladder system. But, as I understand it: S >>> A + Show Spoiler +Self-explanatory
It takes much longer to confirm you belong in S, much shorter that you belong in A.
First because it's a higher skill level.
Second because there's less available S level players to confirm your skill level vs. The next point relates to this in greater detail. Timing of laddering + Show Spoiler +If you're laddering at times where there's not many ppl near your true MMR online, they system will have a hard time confirming your actual MMR curve.
If Team USA keeps playing my high school basketball team, it's going to take about 100 games before I'm truly convinced that Team USA is pretty damn good, while it would only take 5 games if they were to play against say Team Spain.
The availability of people in your true MMR range should play a role in how quickly you get placed if my logic is sound and based on sound starting points^^
Yea I understand that S > A which also means it takes longer if u belong in S or A. But I don't necessaril asked whether a person should be placed into S or A ranked division or w/e rank division you are. But rather the rating u start with when promoting a person into a certain division.
If I should rephrase it to make it more understandable then is there some kind of reasoning why you get less rating or higher rating when being promoted in a division? Does this have something to do with division modifier?
|
On December 01 2010 19:32 shannn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 19:18 Emperor_Earth wrote:On December 01 2010 19:09 shannn wrote:On December 01 2010 18:48 Emperor_Earth wrote:On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:
This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world. #60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions. To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated. Top15 of our division are in EU top200. One would think that such a division is prime example of S class. Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B. If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working. To start, can we agree that activity != skill? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating? If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions. If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division. But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200. The system is correctly encouraging you to play more deluding you into thinking you can advance higher and higher. Carrot: Top 200 list Horse: You * Dangle * Dangle Sorry if it's a bit brutal
The only weakness I see is the scenario where a B teamer becomes good enough to deserve to be in a S Diamond division. The only real way to change divisions then is to tank to demote, then win at an absurd rate to regain your true MMR. Hopefully you can delay promotion long enough to get a high enough MMR to be in a decent division. Oddly enough, this is exactly OPPOSITE what people were doing when they tried to game the system back at release. Oh situational irony, how I love thee. Are you implying it's hard to get promoted to an S class division? I was promoted after around 30 games to Norad Phi on EU (A rank division). I don't know if Excalibur can explain this to me or anyone else but does promoting to a high division means u start with low rating with lots of bonus pool points and promoting to low division means high rating with less bonus pool points? Maybe this has something to do with the division modifier? I got promoted to Norad Phi with 450 rating~ with about 1k bonus pool points while my practice partners got promoted to a lower division with 1500rating and only 400 bonus pool points~. I don't know if this is some kind of hint about the amount of division tiers but maybe I just want to see this pattern >< To start, I'm nowhere near Excalibur Z on my understanding of the ladder system. But, as I understand it: S >>> A + Show Spoiler +Self-explanatory
It takes much longer to confirm you belong in S, much shorter that you belong in A.
First because it's a higher skill level.
Second because there's less available S level players to confirm your skill level vs. The next point relates to this in greater detail. Timing of laddering + Show Spoiler +If you're laddering at times where there's not many ppl near your true MMR online, they system will have a hard time confirming your actual MMR curve.
If Team USA keeps playing my high school basketball team, it's going to take about 100 games before I'm truly convinced that Team USA is pretty damn good, while it would only take 5 games if they were to play against say Team Spain.
The availability of people in your true MMR range should play a role in how quickly you get placed if my logic is sound and based on sound starting points^^ Yea I understand that S > A which also means it takes longer if u belong in S or A. But I don't necessaril asked whether a person should be placed into S or A ranked division or w/e rank division you are. But rather the rating u start with when promoting a person into a certain division. If I should rephrase it to make it more understandable then is there some kind of reasoning why you get less rating or higher rating when being promoted in a division? Does this have something to do with division modifier?
Ooh, never thought of that. Let's ask Excalibur Z. :D
Rephrase of shannn's question:
Does your new rating immediately post-promotion get affected by the division modifier?
|
I have just completed the analysis for the EU ladder (I could not analyse every players yesterday due to the website failure).
I have put it on a google spreadsheet there : https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AjPTjCzKPs5rdEY0c0U1Zkl4dUdKcW1sTFJrQy00OUE&hl=en&authkey=CPiU3Z4M
I have now every division that have at least one contestant in the top 200:
Note that the division Khaydarin X-Ray is most probably E-rank and not F-rank as I previously thought. I also put an asterisk (*) beside every division for which we have only incomplete data due to the history not going far enough. I could then only infer the division rank, assuming vicories and losses were reasonable in term of points.
Also note that I have 2 inconsistencies with aAakAra (rank 35th, should be 44th) and Draco (rank 79, should be 87th). I have highligted them in the spreadsheet.
S-rank (+0) :
Agria Alpha
Akilae Lima
Aldaris Foxtrot
Feld Delta
Forge Eta
Hellion Echo
Mar Sara Sigma
Phoenix Mars(*)
Ramsey X-Ray
Roach Lambda
Scimitar Psi(*)
Shuttle November
Siege Tank Gamma
Stukov Foxtrot
Tal’darim Theta
Uraj Eta
Zealot Alamo
A-rank (+63) :
Khala Tau
Muadun Tau
Norad Phi
B-rank (+126):
Chau Sara Quest(*)
Reaper Gravity
Routhe Victor
C-rank (+189):
Boros Tango
Brood Lord Mars(*)
Executor Alamo
Hauler Foxtrot(*)
Scourge Charlie
Shiloh Oscar(*)
Vermillion Nu
D-rank (+252):
Alzadar Sigma
Char xi
Gantrithor Bravo
Jorgensen Zeta
E-rank (+315):
Broodling Mu(*)
Corsaire Pepper
Duke Sigma
Khaydarin X-Ray(*)
Liberty X-Ray
Marine psi
Meinhoff Pi(*)
Sakai Lima
F-rank
|
|
|
The rank of the division has no direct consequence on the skill of the players in them, which is obvious since no one can change division once they are diamond.
It is only a guess when the players go diamond, so that they will probably be able to compete inside their own division.
Reaper gravity is a typical example where many players were in fact better than what the ranking system thought at the time they were promoted diamond.
No point in complaining, the only thing relevant here is that knowing that your division is B-rank, you have to deduce 126 points when you compare yourself to an S-rank player.
|
On December 01 2010 20:06 Inori wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 19:09 shannn wrote:
If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working.
To start, can we agree that activity != skill?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions.
If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division.
But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200. So top15 of my division in Blizzards EU top200 list is the definition of pisspoor? Also, for comparison, I have US smurf account and within 2 weeks I'm 100 rating below US top200, while being in S-class division. Yet on EU my mmr is below average because I'm B-classes pisspoor player? That's just BS.
lol you have some misquote cuz I didn't say that  I merely quoted someone else plz fix that before others flame me for no good reason too :D
And I think that guy wasn't trying to be that harsh but he couldn't say it in another way I guess.
Besides B rank is still +126 modifier. Which is in my opinion quite high. I think there are a lot of division modifiers who knows how many. This will also account for different leagues (Diamond/plat/gold etc) I think.
|
|
|
On December 01 2010 20:06 Inori wrote:
So top15 of my division in Blizzards EU top200 list is the definition of pisspoor?
To start, I brushed over your post initially. My cursory read of your post resulted in a reply directed 20% offtarget. I'm sorry for that part I will show you the part I misread. But now, I have looked into your division a bit more. (5 minutes)
Seeing as you're not addressing my post in its entirety and only focusing on taking things out of context, I'll try one more time at a constructive debate.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:This system is complete BS and fails at even doing what it was supposed to do (which is also BS).
I disagree as I've stated earlier. But perhaps there's a disconnect in what we consider the system's job to be.
As most people understand it currently, the ladder is to get people to play with people of their skill level. If you have not been playing people of your skill level, and people at the top echelon have not either, then the system is failing. The two jobs are to get you playing, and to find you opponents your skill level.+ Show Spoiler +The points shown is not indicative of skill. The hidden MMR used for matchmaking is the skill measurement. They don't want to show us. That's another argument. Top 200 lists are a middle ground that tend to resemble the hidden MMR more than points shown does, but it is not calculated via MMR as far as we can tell so far. But it does use the "division modifier" that is affected by your MMR fitting into a predetermined range of MMRs at time of promotion.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:So I'm in division Reaper Gravity EU, which is #4 most active division in the world.
I won't argue this, as activity != skill.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:#60 in my division would be #1 in 90% of other EU divisions.
Source?
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:To get into top10 you must be 2600+ rated.
2540 is enough. Let's be accurate here.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:Top15 of our division are in EU top200.
This part I misunderstood.* Somehow, I read:+ Show Spoiler +Top15 [sic] of our division should be in EU top200.
But... in the latest Top 200, only 10 of your division are in the Top 200. Again, let's be accurate lest we lose credibility.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:One would think that such a division is prime example of S class.
To confirm this supposition, we need to find out each player's position on the EU Top 200 at time of division creation. I haven't done this yet as I don't know when your division was created, but I suspect they weren't in the top 200 internally speaking at time of division creation even if it was after they started having Top 200 lists (internally).+ Show Spoiler +Assuming that their hidden MMR reflects that they are also in EU top 200 MMR wise as of right now, then you have hit on the primary weakness of the current system as I posted not too long ago. (Skill improvement post promotion will not allow for division realignment unless you demote then repromote. I believe this is the role of the "new season", to properly realign people to their correct divisions to account for skill variations over time.
On December 01 2010 17:44 Inori wrote:Well, nope, according to this retarded system, it's B.
This relates to two prior snippets I snipped a minute ago.
|
On December 01 2010 20:34 Inori wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 20:26 shannn wrote:On December 01 2010 20:06 Inori wrote:On December 01 2010 19:09 shannn wrote:
If anything, this is perfect evidence that the system is correctly working.
To start, can we agree that activity != skill?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that MMR != shown rating?
If we can accept the previous supposition, can we further accept that if your division is B rating, then the MMR of players in your B division is much lower than those in S divisions.
If we can accept all the previous suppositions, we further continue as follows:
You feel that people in your division are deserving of high ranks that the system is giving them via high ranks in their division.
But the reality is that they're pisspoor players compared to those in S rated divisions. (They're also way better than the norm.) So the system is correctly giving people in B divisions the illusion of being good while correctly displacing them from the top 200.So top15 of my division in Blizzards EU top200 list is the definition of pisspoor? Also, for comparison, I have US smurf account and within 2 weeks I'm 100 rating below US top200, while being in S-class division. Yet on EU my mmr is below average because I'm B-classes pisspoor player? That's just BS. lol you have some misquote cuz I didn't say that I merely quoted someone else plz fix that before others flame me for no good reason too :D And I think that guy wasn't trying to be that harsh but he couldn't say it in another way I guess. Besides B rank is still +126 modifier. Which is in my opinion quite high. I think there are a lot of division modifiers who knows how many. This will also account for different leagues (Diamond/plat/gold etc) I think. Yeah fixed it. I know that it's just the way it is, but still doesn't make me feel better that I'm "pisspoor B-teamer" because of some stupid system that decided so. I wish Blizzard would just scrap all this and use proper ELO system or something like ICCUP.
Sorry Inori, I should have been more diplomatic with my words. I forget that people don't see things the same way I do. I would be very surprised if you couldn't destroy me in a Bo7.
But from where I stand, if you're better than me, you have no life. And if you're worse than me, you suck:D It makes me feel better about myself.
But think of it like this, we're talking about (numbers out of my ass here) 5% of the divisions of the top 6.5% of everyone playing of maybe 1% of the world's human population.
My math is a bit fuzzy but that's pretty good^^
|
|
|
On December 01 2010 20:06 Inori wrote:Also, for comparison, I have US smurf account and within 2 weeks I'm 100 rating below US top200 (in the top350 of sc2ranks masters league). Yet on EU my mmr is below average because I'm B-classed pisspoor player? That's just BS.
MMR != Division Modifier != Points Shown != EU Top 200 rating
Division selected is determined by your MMR at time of promotion.
Your MMR could easily be Top 200 material yet you not be in the Top 200.
Best litmus test in lieu of actually seeing your MMR is checking the calibre of the opponents you play.
I'm curious though, since I don't have access to EU. How much tougher/easier is EU vs USA at your skill level?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
