EPTA Korean fan explains why he hates KeSPA - Page 9
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Pizzapie
Australia18 Posts
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Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
On November 14 2010 18:04 Shizuru~ wrote: Great OP that states facts mainly instead of all personal opinions, which lately even in this forum have been flooded by endless amount of mis-informed/un-informed stances unfortunately... Kespa needs to die for the sake of E-Sports development, not just for Starcraft:Brood War or Starcraft 2 but for the gaming industry as a whole, yes a central governing body is needed when the industry starts to mature, but it will not be Kespa, not a corporate puppet body, but one that is formed by the passionate members of the gaming community, pro-gamers, coaches, managers etc... Talk about the pot calling the kettle black aren't you misinformed by stating what is written by the article given by the op as fact ? Kespa do not have to die for E-sports developments it has already been a tour de force in ensuring that highly competitive tournaments continues to exist . It's your opinion and i choose to stick to mine . | ||
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eSen1a
Australia1058 Posts
valve never asked for any money from cs tournaments blizzard themselves didn't ask for any money from wc3 tournaments and suddenly they are so intent on a few hundred thousand dollars from kespa? (even though they are making a shitton of money from wow) i dont even care but they could at least say "yes we want to kill bw" | ||
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Pizzapie
Australia18 Posts
On November 14 2010 18:42 AyJay wrote: I'm pretty sure that people in BW section have no idea what KeSPA is except for veterans and people who actually live in Korea. ZING! | ||
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Seam
United States1093 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:23 eSen1a wrote: id never asked for any money from quake tournaments valve never asked for any money from cs tournaments blizzard themselves didn't ask for any money from wc3 tournaments and suddenly they are so intent on a few hundred thousand dollars from kespa? (even though they are making a shitton of money from wow) i dont even care but they could at least say "yes we want to kill bw" Do said tournaments make money from said games? No? They didn't break copyright? Maybe that could be the reason? Perhaps? | ||
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Fraidnot
United States824 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:23 eSen1a wrote: id never asked for any money from quake tournaments valve never asked for any money from cs tournaments blizzard themselves didn't ask for any money from wc3 tournaments and suddenly they are so intent on a few hundred thousand dollars from kespa? (even though they are making a shitton of money from wow) i dont even care but they could at least say "yes we want to kill bw" Ok so because they didn't care about the money in the past shows that they're wanting to kill bw so that they can get more money from sc2? You didn't think this through did you? | ||
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SixtusTheFifth
New Zealand170 Posts
A thankyou must also go to Gonodactylus. A lesser person might have stopped posting after embarrassing themselves the way you did on page 5. But not you! You just kept on going. I for one don't mind a thread being completely derailed as long as it's for a good reason, reasons like "the benefit of the TL community" or "your ego". | ||
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HeIios
Sweden2523 Posts
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Railxp
Hong Kong1313 Posts
:'(, savior, even after all you did, i ... i still..... :'( | ||
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WilbertK
Netherlands210 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:13 Gonodactylus wrote: And I only said I am as much a PhD as he is a law undergrad law student. I don't believe him, he doesn't believe me. So, you don't believe he's an undergrad, and you're saying you're as much a PhD as he's an undergrad. So basically, you're saying that you're NOT a PhD? This is getting confusing. Also, PhD or not, you claim to have a lot of knowledge about this, and you begin to see that simply stating facts is not going to win the 'debate' (if you can call it that). Could you please start referring us to your sources? At the moment, people might mistake the facts you're pointing out to them as just being your opinion. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:19 Sawamura wrote: Kespa do not have to die for E-sports developments it has already been a tour de force in ensuring that highly competitive tournaments continues to exist. Sometimes you have to take a step back in order to go two steps forward. While Kespa has driven the Korean e-sports scene to the point it's at now, it doesn't mean the foundations for the growth of e-sports have been healthy or that it's been done the right way. Korean e-sports scene in general (even pre-kespa) made a lot of mistakes down the road that are slowly coming back to bite them, and I should also add - rightfully coming back to bite them. Not to mention that kespa's reputation was severely damaged a number of times way before the final showdown began with the coming of SC2. Then among an ocean of examples, just look at the way they've treaded NaDa recently (twice even - during showmatch vs TLO and after fully switching to SC2). The BW scene under KeSPA regulation might be exciting, big, popular and flashy (no pun intended), but you can't save something that's fundamentally rotten in its core. Even now, regardless of the outcome of all this mess, BW scene has suffered permanent damage. No amount of clinging to the past and the "old ways" will help. | ||
Ohdamn
Germany765 Posts
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Gonodactylus
54 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:39 WilbertK wrote: Could you please start referring us to your sources? At the moment, people might mistake the facts you're pointing out to them as just being your opinion. Not until a certain number of people publicly apologize. As for the 50+ reasons as to why Kespa is bad. Some are factually wrong. Some are disputable. And some are even why Kespa is good, like no.3, no9 through 13 and several others. Most of the negative ones have to do with Korean culture and a lack of a player union. People like Boxer and Nada could have formed player unions but instead they did in fact betray progaming, as kespa puts it, as they are now in Blizzard's camp when their entire career they thank to SCBW/Korea. Korean progamers never speak out on anything. Be it against Kespa/Blizzard/North Korea/US whatever. That's a problem they have. They don't stand up for their rights. They have to do this themselves. But never will they have it as good under Gomtv as Blizzard fears professional teams as one day the teams may stand up against them again, creating a new Kespa. If Kespa could run SC2 leagues, SC2 would have been way way bigger. Globally as well as in Korea. Blizzard should have teamed up with Kespa and OGN and MBC, yet it was Blizzard's choice to destroy Kespa and Kespa's fear of being destroyed. You can't blame Kespa for fighting back and fighting dirty. SC2 could have been huge. Yet we only have amateur tournaments outside of Korea and in Korea we have only gomtv with a semi-pro tournament only broadcaster through the internet. No huge sponsors, no professional teams, no cable tv broadcasting. Imagine if all teams just started a SC2 team alongside their SC BW team and ran leagues besides the ones we have now. It would have been so much bigger and more professional. Remember any other tournaments in Korea are banned. We have hundreds of tournaments that don't really matter here in the foreigner scene. In Korea they don't have anything like that, only Gomtv. Listen to what SuperDanialMan has said about this all. He worked personally with most people at Gomtv/Kespa/OGN/MBC, etc. User was warned for this post | ||
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SovSov
United States755 Posts
Keep it up, kids, soon the toy will break all together and you'll be left with nothing. | ||
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Seam
United States1093 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:46 Gonodactylus wrote: Not until a certain number of people publicly apologize. As for the 50+ reasons as to why Kespa is bad. Some are factually wrong. Some are disputable. And some are even why Kespa is good, like no.3, no9 through 13 and several others. Most of the negative ones have to do with Korean culture and a lack of a player union. People like Boxer and Nada could have formed player unions but instead they did in fact betray progaming, as kespa puts it, as they are now in Blizzard's camp when their entire career they thank to SCBW/Korea. Korean progamers never speak out on anything. Be it against Kespa/Blizzard/North Korea/US whatever. That's a problem they have. They don't stand up for their rights. They have to do this themselves. But never will they have it as good under Gomtv as Blizzard fears professional teams as one day the teams may stand up against them again, creating a new Kespa. Conversely, I have sources that state that it is fact that everything you said it wrong! But I won't cite them until I get 120 people to give me a hug over this forum. If you don't get what I'm saying, it's easy to call others wrong, and state that you have sources, but then put out a demand before being willing to cite them. It's also makes for a horrible argument. | ||
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TheRabidDeer
United States3806 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:46 Gonodactylus wrote: Not until a certain number of people publicly apologize. As for the 50+ reasons as to why Kespa is bad. Some are factually wrong. Some are disputable. And some are even why Kespa is good, like no.3, no9 through 13 and several others. Most of the negative ones have to do with Korean culture and a lack of a player union. People like Boxer and Nada could have formed player unions but instead they did in fact betray progaming, as kespa puts it, as they are now in Blizzard's camp when their entire career they thank to SCBW/Korea. Korean progamers never speak out on anything. Be it against Kespa/Blizzard/North Korea/US whatever. That's a problem they have. They don't stand up for their rights. They have to do this themselves. But never will they have it as good under Gomtv as Blizzard fears professional teams as one day the teams may stand up against them again, creating a new Kespa. Why should we apologize? Also, SC2 already has progaming teams that are sponsored (ogs/prime/werra/startale/etc). Hell, boxer has his own sponsorship. e-sports in korea has reached a point where a KeSPA is not really necessary. The players are sponsored and have their houses, the game is popular, the broadcasters want to broadcast and everything is good. There is no reason to have a KeSPA right now for SC2. The foundation that KeSPA laid out for BW is being put out on their own terms by the players. | ||
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Heimatloser
Germany1494 Posts
for example, did it really kill sc that a teamleague was getting "forcefully started by KeSpA" every major sport has teamleagues, except maybe golf and tennis;-) | ||
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Pizzapie
Australia18 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:46 Ohdamn wrote: so this post is in the kespa forums and they didn't delete it? If they did, that would even worsen the case. | ||
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Seam
United States1093 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:52 Heimatloser wrote: every second one of you so called "reasons to hate KeSpA" can be read both way. for example, did it really kill sc that a teamleague was getting "forcefully started by KeSpA" every major sport has teamleagues, except maybe golf and tennis;-) But they aren't being ran Illegally. | ||
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Daria
Australia500 Posts
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