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On October 25 2010 04:06 MythicalMage wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 04:04 kojinshugi wrote:On October 25 2010 03:55 Fa1nT wrote: As in, learn to make stuff besides MMM. Ghosts? Harass. Banshees? Hellion drops? BLUE hellions? Ravens?
Ghosts? Expensive garbage against a macroing Zerg, too expensive for early game. Banshees? Made of paper and useless once Lair is out. Hellions of all varieties are raped by roaches. Ravens kinda sorta work. Every TvZ will degenerate to the same turtling Terran with Thors/tanks/marines versus a Zerg on 5+ bases. It's gone from badly balanced to badly balanced, with Z having a slight upper hand instead of T. Terran now plays almost exactly like a weaker, less mobile Toss in that matchup. Yeah. It used to be that Terran could go mech, but now, like Toss, they need a core of low tier units.
Yep. Less mobile mech and squishier infantry.
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On October 25 2010 02:18 HalfAmazing wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2010 02:31 Nagano wrote:On October 24 2010 02:28 lim1017 wrote:On October 24 2010 02:25 Meff wrote:On October 24 2010 02:17 tieya wrote:terran gets strong he goes to terran, zerg gets strong he goes to zerg  lets see if he will stick to a race Makes sense. TLO is a strong all-around player (as opposed to specialized, mono-race ones) and he's a beacon of creativity. I think that it would be interesting to see the way he can exploit the changes put forth by each new patch. spin master right here. On a side note i believe pre patch zergs deserve some credit for sticking to their guns (even though i never really thought they were UP much), we see a whole bunch of people switching/trying zerg our after only a couple weeks of this new patch I agree. I have much respect for the people who make their race work, whether or not it's considered stronger than the others. Idra, zenio, Fruitdealer, all these guys stuck it out, made it work, and that's why they have the respect they do. TLO switching immediately after a patch like this is a little disappointing. You have a warped perspective. Zerg has always been strongest. Most boring, most susceptible to cheese and most difficult to play, but they've always been the best out of the three. Recent patch only made it more obvious. Notice the difference between a classy player like TLO and someone like Dimaga, Fruitseller or Idra (no offense to any of them), when he doesn't threaten to switch -- he simply does it. Anyway, best of luck to TLO. I don't believe he'll suddenly start beating 100% zerg users in ZvZ but we'll see.
Yup, no whining, no attention-whoring or trying to prove a point. Just does it unlike the names you mention (even though they're awesome as well)
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
Well oGs has some good zergs like Zenio and TheWind so i'm sure TLO will be fine in terms of getting quality practice. Good luck Dario!
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On October 24 2010 02:17 tieya wrote:terran gets strong he goes to terran, zerg gets strong he goes to zerg  lets see if he will stick to a race not dissing him in anyway, i actually really liked how he played zerg, i kind of hope he sticks with it this time. That actually sounds like your dissing him, TLO plays this game the right way, Zerg didn't get buffed through the roof. I have no idea where that came from. He can play any race he wants. gl hf TLO.
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Hope TLO's zerg is just as entertaining as his terran : )
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On October 25 2010 03:56 Iracor wrote: To be completely honest, the TvZ MU now feels like pushing a large rock up a steep hill for Terrans. They have nothing to really threaten a Zerg's FE, so they'll always be behind economically if they don't do some decent harass. And your harassment options are limited because reapers come too late, helions will pretty much always take damage from roaches against a decent Zerg, and queens w/ overseers can fend off cloaked banshees. A terran's most effective harassment is probably going to be double starport banshees, but even then the Zerg could just counterattack since you won't really have much.
On the other side, once a Zerg gets the critical mass of mutalisks, a Terran can't really move out of his base or reasonably take a third since his army would be too spread out. At that point Zerg can just drone, expand, and spread creep.
Yup. Blizzard overstepped their balance changes on this one. Pro players like Fruitdealer had enough tools before with Zerg to be competitive against the best Terrans in the GSL but with the latest patch, Fruitdealer will 2-0 everybody in the GSL for every GSLseason until there is another patch.
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On October 25 2010 05:23 StarcraftMan wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 03:56 Iracor wrote: To be completely honest, the TvZ MU now feels like pushing a large rock up a steep hill for Terrans. They have nothing to really threaten a Zerg's FE, so they'll always be behind economically if they don't do some decent harass. And your harassment options are limited because reapers come too late, helions will pretty much always take damage from roaches against a decent Zerg, and queens w/ overseers can fend off cloaked banshees. A terran's most effective harassment is probably going to be double starport banshees, but even then the Zerg could just counterattack since you won't really have much.
On the other side, once a Zerg gets the critical mass of mutalisks, a Terran can't really move out of his base or reasonably take a third since his army would be too spread out. At that point Zerg can just drone, expand, and spread creep. Yup. Blizzard overstepped their balance changes on this one. Pro players like Fruitdealer had enough tools before with Zerg to be competitive against the best Terrans in the GSL but with the latest patch, Fruitdealer will 2-0 everybody in the GSL for every GSLseason until there is another patch.
it's too bad that zerg had to deal with this for months, and you guys cant take it for a few days.
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On October 25 2010 04:57 McFoo wrote: Hope TLO's zerg is just as entertaining as his terran : )
Oh it is my friend.
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On October 25 2010 05:31 Zonel wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 04:57 McFoo wrote: Hope TLO's zerg is just as entertaining as his terran : ) Oh it is my friend. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didnt he come up with the Ling/Infestor Fungal/Parasite build to counter mech? Mech and Bio?
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On October 25 2010 05:42 DROPPINBOMBS wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 05:31 Zonel wrote:On October 25 2010 04:57 McFoo wrote: Hope TLO's zerg is just as entertaining as his terran : ) Oh it is my friend. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didnt he come up with the Ling/Infestor Fungal/Parasite build to counter mech? Mech and Bio?
It's hard to say he invented it but he certainly uses ling/infestor/ultra, although I do believe he has changed his ZvT builds.
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This is bitter/sweet for me, as I'm a terran player and I'm saddened to see one of our best Terrans leaving the boat. On the other hand, TLO's zerg is freaking awesome.
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On October 25 2010 05:25 tieya wrote: it's too bad that zerg had to deal with this for months, and you guys cant take it for a few days.
this.
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On October 25 2010 06:11 NomNomMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 05:25 tieya wrote: it's too bad that zerg had to deal with this for months, and you guys cant take it for a few days. this.
Wouldn't it be better if the game was balanced, I honestly can't understand some zerg players being happy over how weak terran is right now.
And I root for toss, and nobody's even mentioning how toss probably won't have any representative in GSL2 Ro8
But overall I think the game is getting close to balance, and there is a lot of unnecessary complaining about every little thing. Terrans need to figure some new strats and new openings, it's still too early since the patch came out.
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On October 25 2010 05:25 tieya wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 05:23 StarcraftMan wrote:On October 25 2010 03:56 Iracor wrote: To be completely honest, the TvZ MU now feels like pushing a large rock up a steep hill for Terrans. They have nothing to really threaten a Zerg's FE, so they'll always be behind economically if they don't do some decent harass. And your harassment options are limited because reapers come too late, helions will pretty much always take damage from roaches against a decent Zerg, and queens w/ overseers can fend off cloaked banshees. A terran's most effective harassment is probably going to be double starport banshees, but even then the Zerg could just counterattack since you won't really have much.
On the other side, once a Zerg gets the critical mass of mutalisks, a Terran can't really move out of his base or reasonably take a third since his army would be too spread out. At that point Zerg can just drone, expand, and spread creep. Yup. Blizzard overstepped their balance changes on this one. Pro players like Fruitdealer had enough tools before with Zerg to be competitive against the best Terrans in the GSL but with the latest patch, Fruitdealer will 2-0 everybody in the GSL for every GSLseason until there is another patch. it's too bad that zerg had to deal with this for months, and you guys cant take it for a few days. The imbalances in TvZ has always been there and a lot of people have been aware of them for way longer than a few days. These imbalances were not as obvious due to all the abusive ways to get ahead in the early game but any terran who intentionally avoided the abusive stuff like planetary fortress mech or 5rax reaper openings or early all-in timing pushes have been painfully aware of the TvZ imbalance in a long macro game. The only thing that has changed is that seeing this imbalance is now inevitable as even the abusive ways out of it are gone.
But these issues are in no way directly the result of the roach change or the depot before rax.
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On October 25 2010 06:11 NomNomMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 05:25 tieya wrote: it's too bad that zerg had to deal with this for months, and you guys cant take it for a few days. this. you guys make it sound like zergs didn't bitch the entire time too lol
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honestly, as long as boxer plays this game i dont care about any other terran
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oh mannnn I cant wait to see awesome play from TLO! good luck to him with zerg
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what he chooses to do is really none of your business anyway, what's with the butthurts?
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On October 25 2010 06:26 darkevilxe wrote: honestly, as long as boxer plays this game i dont care about any other terran
Even NaDa? You don't care about NaDa?
Terrans still have their heroes. I'm glad to see another member of the swarm.
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If you cant punish fast expands (which you can) as terran, then start to scout earlier and 15 CC. A 2 base timing attack is sick strong.
Can't belive how people can even utter the word "weak" together with terran just because your early game options have been reduced and thus changed the metagame abit. Adapt maybe?
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