Limiting the number of scvs that can repair I think is the best fix. Planetary fortresses are extremely powerful with 20 scvs repairing them. I haven't run into a thor push with scvs but I'm sure the problem is similar.

sleepingdog

Austria6145 Posts

September 20 2010 13:44 GMT

#104

first of all let me say THANK YOU for starting this thread - I lost to exactly this shit a while ago against a "very" mediocre terran and felt terribad......didn't check the replay, I just thought I sucked really hard, although I did have superior gateway-unit-count

many have brought up the immortal as the natural way of dealing with this; of course I do theory-craft here, but still, what if he has researched the strange thor-cannon-upgrade nobody gets nowadays? this will kill an immortal instantly; if he starts the upgrade right away when starting to produce the thor I think this should finish when the thor arrives at your base? terrans, am I at least to some extent correct with the timings? a second immortal would also die extremely fast to marine focus fire...so only gateway-units would remain

while thinking about it, I suppose you could counter it hard with rushing to colossi with range upgrade; since the thor is so slow, maybe you could get one colossi befor the push arrives? I'm currently not able to test it, maybe someone wanna check?

ok, now you may think, what will a colossus do vs a thor? the "trick" is, the last time I checked, thors don't use their air-attack vs colossi (range 10) but their ground attack (range 7); a colossus with upgrade has range 9; now I know this is completeley counter-intuitive, but after you get the colossus you could "rush" towards your opponent and kite the SCVs; marines won't do anything, if he has marauders his push should be quite delayed timing-wise;
while normally a protoss can't move around freely, this timing push - ironically - gives you all the mobility that normally the terran has; I think the key could be to really abuse this mobility to the maximum - spreading troups, maybe doing some hit and run with 2-3 stalkers near his base, etc.

of course this doesn't change the fact that the auto-repair together with the melee-AI is broken, but could be a way of at least not dieing against this....

dilbags

Australia13 Posts

September 20 2010 13:51 GMT

#105

yep limit the number of scv's repairing, I think 2-3 is a good number, this will also reduce the problem of PF's being nigh invulnerable while reducing your ground forces to ashes, I have seen a game where a terran pretty much walled off 1 half of the map with 2 well placed PF's in chokes with 20 scv's bouncing between them

paralleluniverse

4065 Posts

September 20 2010 13:55 GMT

#106

This has been an annoying problem for a while, and should be fixed.

Attack priorities should be simple:
1. All normal units in sight, including buildings that are capable of attacking one of your units, workers that are repairing or attacking, should be put on a list.
2. Your units attack whoever on the list is closest.
3. If it fails to attack the closest, it should attack the next closest target on the list, etc.

Hypatio

549 Posts

September 20 2010 14:08 GMT

#107

On September 20 2010 17:17 EriktheGuy wrote:

Show nested quote +

You mean attack whichever units are closest, and then buildings? Or just whatever is closest?

Regarding whether buildings or units are attacked is a good question. Perhaps such an AI should be limited to closest units, followed by buildings.

ShLiM

Bulgaria178 Posts

September 20 2010 14:11 GMT

#108

http://db.tt/CZhZCSg
this is my experience with repairing workers on thors, it is a much faster game since my opponent went to rax=>armory=>factory making just a couple of marines.

at first when i managed to get into his base i was like" lol this guy is joke he doesnt have anything, then the thor came up, and i was still thinking lol 1 thor vs 4stalker 4zealots he is done."

and THEN, i saw the @#$@#$@ rate of repairing and was steaming as hell, at this point i was absolutely clueless of what im supposed to do, made a lot of mistakes, if executed well i could probably have another wave of units 4 more zealots or 4 more stalkers, since 4gate is good vs early tech and he still managed to win.
the first battle was very close, and i couldn't catch up later so...

i made a robo but was too panic to actually use it, maybe colossus is option, meh idk,
give me ur opions guys.

Craton

United States17274 Posts

September 20 2010 14:17 GMT

#109

Immortal vs thor, not colossi. You have to just outmicro and pick off SCVs.

ShLiM

Bulgaria178 Posts

September 20 2010 14:53 GMT

#110

my point was colossi kills scv's ez with splash then its thor is vulnerable

sleepingdog

Austria6145 Posts

September 20 2010 17:19 GMT

#111

On September 20 2010 23:53 ShLiM wrote:
my point was colossi kills scv's ez with splash then its thor is vulnerable

more importantly - colossi with range can kite the thor! and the marines won't be able to do anything, they die like flies vs colossi;
so unless he also adds marauders, colossi should work imo

Highways

Australia6105 Posts

September 21 2010 12:08 GMT

#112

wow, check out how imba scv reapir is

kcdc

United States2311 Posts

September 21 2010 15:34 GMT

#113

On September 21 2010 21:08 Highways wrote:
wow, check out how imba scv reapir is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MhW_tfJbYM

That was Z getting outmacroed. The repair surround wasn't an issue at all. If Z is trying to engage sieged tanks head-on w/o a big econ lead, Z will lose.

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