EPThow much A+ are there per season? mb 2?
how much Diamond players are in sc2? infinite?
The Truth About Diamond League - Page 29
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XenOsky
Chile2276 Posts
how much A+ are there per season? mb 2? how much Diamond players are in sc2? infinite? | ||
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Beazly101
United States15 Posts
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Harem
United States11390 Posts
On August 25 2010 10:32 Kinmaul wrote: I'm an average player at best and I agree with the OP 110%. Elitist Jerks have a World of Warcraft forum that usually has solid posts, but the only way they maintain that quality is that they are moderation nazi's to the extreme. There is very little moderation here and as a result your average post is going to be full of armchair theorycrafting with no basis that was probably made up on the spot. People don't seem to understand that the average SC2 player is average... average. I think a few rules from EJ would help this board out immensily. *The ability for people to report bad/unqualified posts. You regulate this by giving out warnings/bans to people that report posts for no reason. *You must have 10-15 replies in various threads before you can made your own topic. *Orginal topics are closely watched. People who make poor topics are quickly banned from posting/replying. The report post feature makes moderation much more efficient. Rather than randomly browse the forums for trash you can look at the the list of reported posts and take immediate action. Is the post worthy of a warning/ban? Done. Did the person needlessly report the post? Warn/ban them. Clean up the boards imo. Report feature already exists but only people who have been here for at least a year can use it. However, if you don't have access to it then you can always just PM a mod about something you deem objectionable. Also, people consistently abuse the report feature lose access to it too and can be warned for bad reports. There are also pre-requisites before a person can make his first thread. I forgot what they are exactly but I know it's time-related rather than post count related. That already happens here too? However, it starts with warnings first but people who consistently make shitty OPs don't tend to last long. Also, first replies to threads are looked at harshly as that can set the tone for a thread and even well-made OPs can turn into bad threads due to derailment etc. I'm also confused to you saying that there is very little moderation here either. | ||
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TrevorJK
United States77 Posts
On August 25 2010 13:09 Harem wrote: Report feature already exists but only people who have been here for at least a year can use it. However, if you don't have access to it then you can always just PM a mod about something you deem objectionable. Also, people consistently abuse the report feature lose access to it too and can be warned for bad reports. There are also pre-requisites before a person can make his first thread. I forgot what they are exactly but I know it's time-related rather than post count related. That already happens here too? However, it starts with warnings first but people who consistently make shitty OPs don't tend to last long. Also, first replies to threads are looked at harshly as that can set the tone for a thread and even well-made OPs can turn into bad threads due to derailment etc. I'm also confused to you saying that there is very little moderation here either. How much exactly is reportable? Looking at the 2 posts above yours, Beazly101's is essentially facebook "Like"ing the OP without adding any sort of content to the thread, similar to the people "affirming" their ICCUP stats vs Diamond rating. These kind of posts make up probably 25% of this thread alone which I guess isn't the biggest deal but completely missed the point of the OP. XenOsky-'s post is.... I don't know what to say but its not constructive in anyway. Quickly scrolling through this thread alone only about 2 or 3 people have actually been punished while there have been a hell of a lot more than 3 shit posts. I'm not sure if this is because the mods haven't seen them or because the rules are extremely lax. So what exactly is reportable/punishable? | ||
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sensenmann
United States172 Posts
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Angra
United States2652 Posts
The SC2 sections of TL have been getting so exhausting to view and post in sometimes lately because it seems like so many people have their own opinions on what's "right" and "wrong" and then get into endless debates about it with other people who have other ideas. I'm totally fine with people discussing strategies and build orders and ideas and stuff, but 90% of the time all of the discussions have this air of superiority about them, people dropping hints in their posts that they are right and the other person is wrong just because they are X points in diamond league. On August 25 2010 02:34 Chill wrote: The Starcraft 2 community in general just needs some more humility across the board and we'd be good. Completely agree with this as well. Sometimes I feel like I'm getting bored of playing SC2 not because of the game, but because the forum I love visiting is making the SC2 craze in general just really tiring to deal with because of how people are when discussing the game. The ZvT discussions lately are a pretty good example of what I mean, I think. The majority of people who are discussing it don't really seem like they are discussing it from a neutral stance. They are discussing it based on what race they play, and that alone. Of course there's always been the whole proud of your race thing in BW, but a ton of people are taking it way too far currently with SC2. People are so zealous about their race that they completely neglect the fact that they should be trying to actually help turn SC2 into a good, fun game. | ||
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PokePill
United States1048 Posts
You see, a strange phenomenon exists since SC2 is such a new game. It's that you can do almost whatever you want and make it work. There's no such thing as standard play, standard timings, and standard defenses. What this means is that 1 base allins are extremely potent, especially at lower levels, and even at what you might consider high levels as well. That means that even at the 900 point diamond range, there exist an abundance of players who simply just know how to 4gate allin or marine/hellion/tank allin. They just know one build per matchup, practice it to death, and the go on the ladder and win because people don't know how to respond. Does this mean they know how to win? Of course. But does it mean they know anything about the game? Not at all. I'm trying to understand how even a typical C to B+ Brood War player who played for many many years and developed great mechanics and copies the latest pro league builds and gets all of his timings based on what he watches in replays is any different from what you just described. Does he know how to win? But does he understand anything about the game (Well he does have a bigger sample size from playing all those years!) ? | ||
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Angra
United States2652 Posts
On August 25 2010 14:20 PokePill wrote: I'm trying to understand how even a typical C to B+ Brood War player who played for many many years and developed great mechanics and copies the latest pro league builds and gets all of his timings based on what he watches in replays is any different from what you just described. Does he know how to win? But does he understand anything about the game (Well he does have a bigger sample size from playing all those years!) ? BW build orders coming from pro players are going to be a lot more refined, well developed, and extend further into the game, so following those while playing well in general will help you adapt to a lot more situations just because the build is going to be able to handle it. It essentially is the same thing, it's just since it's so much more developed in BW it's going to get you a lot more success if you play it well. I think copying that in general will give a lot better sense about the game just because it's not actually "make supply depot, make barracks, make orbital command", it has a lot more to it, especially when it's coming from progamers in Korea. Top players (like Idra, in both BW and SC2) will still adapt based on their knowledge of the game though. | ||
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ZomgTossRush
United States1041 Posts
My friend told me about and "elite" invite only forum section on tl was an idea, but got shot down, wouldnt mind the idea though. | ||
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monad
United States156 Posts
On August 25 2010 13:50 sensenmann wrote: The main problem with this is that the kids you want to read this, the people you wrote it for, will most likely not even read it. Great post though, and I love QXC's idea about invite only topics. I hate to reference WoW, but there is a popular arena site that has somewhat the same style, where only very skilled players are able to talk in this one section of the forums. They use armory links to prove they are legit and such. Honestly all games have this in some form or another, I don't know why it's so taboo to talk about TL doing the same thing. When I came from FFXI they had the same thing, WoW has it, it's completely natural to have a place for the pros and only the pros to talk, and everyone can read. | ||
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Skyze
Canada2324 Posts
I agree, if someone is only 700 pts but has like 200-200 or any 50% winrate, then sure, they are maxed out, but I dont think it is something we should just start labelling people because of their current point totals. The game is very new. | ||
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trueg0x
South Africa86 Posts
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Jyxz
United States117 Posts
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kineSiS-
Korea (South)1068 Posts
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0mgVitaminE
United States1278 Posts
On August 25 2010 15:01 Skyze wrote: while I "kinda" agree.. I will say its not fair to label anyone too soon. For example, what if someone just simply hasnt played a lot of solo yet? Are like 50-30 and still climbing at 600 diamond. Do you consider them D iccup? I agree, if someone is only 700 pts but has like 200-200 or any 50% winrate, then sure, they are maxed out, but I dont think it is something we should just start labelling people because of their current point totals. The game is very new. Im pretty sure that it should be implied that these ranking are when the players are "maxed out" already. Taking into account people who just started laddering would be pointless. | ||
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Aeropunk
Australia255 Posts
There hasn't even been a major professional tournament or league for SC2 yet, so no-ones been able to see what strategies work and what hasn't under the pressures of a top level tournament yet. Basically I think everyone needs to just chill out for a few more months, then things are going to be a lot clearer for everyone. | ||
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Sentient
United States437 Posts
Perhaps there should be a separate league you can opt into, where everyone is lumped in one division, but you have to make it to Diamond league to qualify. And once you opt in, there's no backing out again. | ||
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Siwa
91 Posts
I have this little story I remember from beta: Some semi-known "diamond nr1" players joking about the "ridicilous" change that Phoenix can shoot while moving. They were laughing hard at Blizzard in their stream. "This is OP beyond anything, what a ridicilous change!" And they played a custom game where other guy was making mutalisks and other guy kiting them with "beyond OP" Phoenixes and owning! "This is going to fixed next week, LOL" was the pro verdict on that issue. And then some time passed. Are they really OP? Nope. Same goes with strategies. Top players maybe don't make those kind of wrong assumptions so often, but don't take everything as a truth. No matter who says it. Game is developing. | ||
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Erectum
France194 Posts
Just let them some time .... | ||
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antelope591
Canada820 Posts
On August 25 2010 10:32 Kinmaul wrote: I'm an average player at best and I agree with the OP 110%. Elitist Jerks have a World of Warcraft forum that usually has solid posts, but the only way they maintain that quality is that they are moderation nazi's to the extreme. There is very little moderation here and as a result your average post is going to be full of armchair theorycrafting with no basis that was probably made up on the spot. People don't seem to understand that the average SC2 player is average... average. I think a few rules from EJ would help this board out immensily. *The ability for people to report bad/unqualified posts. You regulate this by giving out warnings/bans to people that report posts for no reason. *You must have 10-15 replies in various threads before you can made your own topic. *Orginal topics are closely watched. People who make poor topics are quickly banned from posting/replying. The report post feature makes moderation much more efficient. Rather than randomly browse the forums for trash you can look at the the list of reported posts and take immediate action. Is the post worthy of a warning/ban? Done. Did the person needlessly report the post? Warn/ban them. Clean up the boards imo. This post is exaggeration to the extreme....these forums are moderated extremely well considering its a community site and they have thousands of users per day posting stuff. It's easy to moderate the EJ forums when you have 100x less people than TL reading it and posting at a time. I never see people post blatant flames here without getting at least a warn. | ||
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