EPTThe chair and the gamma made him look like a Twilight cast member, i mean that in a positive way (i guess
)Team Tasteless!
Official State of the Game Podcast Thread - Page 953
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Tyree
1508 Posts
The chair and the gamma made him look like a Twilight cast member, i mean that in a positive way (i guess )Team Tasteless! | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
On May 04 2011 22:47 NightAngel wrote: I would argue that the balance of Starcraft 2 is one of the most important things to disucss. Do you disagree? The potential fact that some organisations view esport and starcraft 2 as just another mean to make money with hyper hyped and promoted products of moderate to bad quality is concerning me much, much more than an old balance discussion that is going nowhere. | ||
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Muffinman53
571 Posts
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
In SC1, there are so many units that are situational, and that needs certain skills to be used to their fullest: the reaver is the biggest exemple of that. The units is so damn slow and useless that, in most case, it is not worth it, except the protoss players of the world fixed the whole thing with drop play and shuttle micro. The defiler seems so weak until you understand how powerful dark swarm is when it's well used. Back to SC2: where are those units that are situational, that can turn the game if they are used well ? Especially in the zerg arsenal: THERE ARE NONE. There are no hidden potential for a units such as the slow hydra, the low range roach, the zergling, etc. The infestor is not situational, it is a good unit but there are no situation where it can gives you the win. SC2 suffer from its lack of units, especially from the lack of defensive units. In this regard, IdrA is right. | ||
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Talionis
Scotland4085 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:01 Muffinman53 wrote: So during the most embarrassing moments section, there were references to a lot of BW games that I have never seen (since I didn't play or watch BW). Can anyone find links to the idra command center cancel? That game sounded epic :D And the one where Tasteless made a smiley face with pylons sounded funny too. I haven't watched that part yet, but it's probably this game Idra's talking about: | ||
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dementrio
678 Posts
 people being so aggressive and unfriendly to each other kinda kills the show imo. | ||
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NightAngel
United States144 Posts
On May 04 2011 22:58 MrCon wrote: The potential fact that some organisations view esport and starcraft 2 as just another mean to make money with hyper hyped and promoted products of moderate to bad quality is concerning me much, much more than an old balance discussion that is going nowhere. Elaborate, please. I found that reply quite confusing other than I was able to garner that you do indeed disagree with my statement. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On May 04 2011 22:36 vetinari wrote: The operative word is "complaining". Protosses aren't complaining about zerg. Therefore, PvZ imba in P's favour. Basically, the game is balanced when all 3 races are crying about the other 2, lol. (Yes, this is partly tongue in cheek. Partly.) That's not true, a lot of protoss players complain about some of the stuff zerg does, especially infestors. | ||
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Tanatos
United States381 Posts
IdrA : ummmm... terran? I was laughing so hard last night. | ||
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Yaotzin
South Africa4280 Posts
On May 04 2011 22:48 Tranqje wrote: if you'd actually watch idra's stream you'd see him destroy about every protoss aswell. He also does better against toss in tournaments than Sheth. So for people to want to dismiss him from talking about it seems quite retarded to me. Same goes for that guy insinuating idra doesn't understand the matchup. It boggles me someone can make that statement and think they're actually correct. Yeah I know, I should've said "former Idra style". He doesn't really play like that anymore. And his results have improved for it, go figure. Seems he's gone back to moaning about ZvT more too, hah. | ||
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dementrio
678 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:01 WhiteDog wrote: The problem is, Day9 would be 100% right on balance if we were on a different game, a finished and polished game like SC1 for exemple. Day9 IS right because what he said is a tautology. There's no denying that we are far from a game-theory equilibrium so it's kind of pointless to say that the equilibrium is bad/unsatisfactory because we're not there yet. However that's a mathematician's approach and doesn't really help people that are trying to figure out the game right now; but idra's "game is broken" approach does not help either. | ||
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hydra21
94 Posts
In regards to the Geoff vs Tyler debate... I don't think Tyler made clear what his objection really was and Geoff made him seem completely wrong about everything. Someone correct me if I am mistaken, but I think Tyler's real problem comes from a few factors. First, this is Team Liquid's home, and they make or break anything Starcraft related since they essentially have a monopoly on the information for foreign Starcraft. Second, EG is a company using TL's community to plug something that while good for the community, is ultimately a business venture that they will profit the most from. Third, when asked why TL was not participating they made it seem as if TL just chose not to participate rather than they made a request and were not accommodated. Was the request unreasonable? Did EG make the right call denying it etc? That's really irrelevant. From Tyler's perspective when you are in TL territory, and you want to use the community they have built for your financial gain, do not just cover your ass when someone asks why you didn't include them. Sure they try to keep the team and community parts separate, but you can't ignore the relationship between the two. If TL decided not to let the post stay up because they were not participating it would be within their right and would most likely be the kiss of death in terms of the viability of the league. I think Tyler's hidden point was, they would never do that because they try to be fair to everyone, so representatives of EG should do the same when here. My 2 cents. Again, I could be wrong, and I do not necessarily agree with Tyler's interpretation of what EG did. | ||
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Yaotzin
South Africa4280 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:05 Tanatos wrote: InControl : Idra, what was the weakest race in BW? IdrA : ummmm... terran? I was laughing so hard last night. He actually said that? Why does anyone listen to this guy? | ||
p4NDemik
United States13896 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:03 dementrio wrote: this was the worst sotg episode so far people being so aggressive and unfriendly to each other kinda kills the show imo.I agree the episode wasn't that great, but not because the hosts were aggressive and unfriendly, I mean conflict and conflicting opinions is why people listen. But when you have 20-25 minutes of circular logic regarding whether balance should be discussed, or 20-25 minutes blowing up a tiff between players into a huge thing I start to question why I'm listening. Its just not interesting. | ||
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TRAP[yoo]
Hungary6026 Posts
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:08 dementrio wrote: Day9 IS right because what he said is a tautology. There's no denying that we are far from a game-theory equilibrium so it's kind of pointless to say that the equilibrium is bad/unsatisfactory because we're not there yet. However that's a mathematician's approach and doesn't really help people that are trying to figure out the game right now; but idra's "game is broken" approach does not help either. What's the point of your post ? You're just like Day9, I'm talking about the current zerg, the number of units, their potential, and you give me a useless comment about how Day9's argument is an universel unconditionnal truth always valid, which is wrong. SC2 is not a science. | ||
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dementrio
678 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:16 WhiteDog wrote: What's the point of your post ? You said that day9 would be right if we were talking bw but not in the case of sc2. That's not true, because what day9 said cannot be wrong. that's all. | ||
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:19 dementrio wrote: You said that day9 would be right if we were talking bw but not in the case of sc2. That's not true, because what day9 said cannot be wrong. that's all. My argument was EMPIRIC, you know like ABOUT THE GAME and not about the freaking universe and the possibility of an unknown god that made you and me, and everyone else. Read or just let it go ? | ||
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:12 Yaotzin wrote: He actually said that? Why does anyone listen to this guy? He seems to be equating weakest with hardest to play. On May 04 2011 22:28 SnuggleZhenya wrote: I think Day9 also just thinks it isn't productive to complain about. Maybe its imbalanced, but if you are a serious pro gamer, its your job to figure out how to win games. Day9 is simply saying: Spend your time figuring out how to win games - not complaining about balance, because you are wasting your time. It's easy for Day9 to say this when it's not his career to play the game. | ||
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DoubleReed
United States4130 Posts
On May 04 2011 23:08 dementrio wrote: Day9 IS right because what he said is a tautology. There's no denying that we are far from a game-theory equilibrium so it's kind of pointless to say that the equilibrium is bad/unsatisfactory because we're not there yet. However that's a mathematician's approach and doesn't really help people that are trying to figure out the game right now; but idra's "game is broken" approach does not help either. How does Idra's approach not fix things? He's pointing out specific flaws of the game that should be changed in order for the game to become a competitive esport and be taken seriously. Day9's mathematician's answer is ridiculous. Of course it's true, but it has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion. His constant reiterating of "there are so many strategies to explore" is NOT helpful. Idra was being very specific, while Day9 was just being vague. I especially didn't like Day9 saying that Idra should drill a lot of these strategies pretty hard. Idra trained in friggin' Korea, man. Personally, I don't think there's that much innovation to go with Zerg. The early game is too volatile to worry about almost anything but defense, and there are sooooo many strategies being done by top zergs in comparison with other races. I was also shocked to hear that IdrA said he was going all-in and doing cheesy shit. I'm sorry but the IPL win was not cheesy at all. Sure some of his stuff is now, but not the mass dropping at 200/200. I think IdrA completely underestimated how much damage his drops do. Sure, it wasn't cost efficient (zerg drops are never cost efficient), but he was constantly trading and whittling the protoss down more and more while securing a larger macro advantage. I don't think he was being all-in at all. | ||
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