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United Kingdom16710 Posts
Farewell Incontrol! I'll miss your quick wit and well-oiled tongue.
As for the replacement, perhaps get a Terran player? SeleCT? Drewbie?
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On May 26 2011 06:16 1Eris1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote:
Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid?
Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed.
Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. Tyler, my point was more directed at HuK almost insulting zerg players. Things like zerg players just amoved and lost and then whined. Yes infestors were buffed, and this opened up various new strats. But a lot of these strats were not viable before the buff, and thus they weren't done. I don't think zerg players got better with infestors, they just weren't viable. Zerg were already using them in ZvT and ZvZ regularly. I am a random player, and I tried infestor play pre-patch. It wasn't very viable, at least at my level. But now with it's increased strength, it can help transition into say faster ultralisks, which means you can counter the deathball+sentrys push where you would normally just throw a roach/hydra/corrupter army and hope to remax and kill it. You couldn't get fast ultralisks before, because it would leave you at risk to certain timings, but now with the infestor being a much stronger and better defensive unit, it is a lot more viable. It was dumb and arrogant of him to say, oh zerg players learned how to micro. No they didn't. They got buffed, and discovered new strats, and thats completely different then learning to micro. Zergs already knew how to micro, there just wasn't a lot of micro oppurtunities. And as far as the a-moving, it was no different then the protoss deathball being clicked across the map, so it's a stupid point. My comment wasn't really directed at you, and I'm sorry if it seemed that way. I just greatly dislike players that generalize a group of people based on a small % of that group. Then again, I am just a masters random player. I have about a 90% winrate in PvZ right now, because I've been incorporating archons, even though they apparentely suck according to some pros. The infestor buff was designed to counter the colossi/deathball, so it should be beating it, because zergs other "supposed" counter wasn't working. I don't think infestors are too good right now, colossi simply aren't the anwser to them. Then again, maybe the zergs I am playing just aren't good enough. who knows
Hang on hang on...you're saying the infestor buff is reason that protoss feel like the match up is having a turnaround...but you also feel like the infestor is rubbish vs protoss?
Regardless, Tyler's post is excellent; shouldn't zergs be ecstatic that the tide is turning? But because of the terrible broken race imba mindset spread by certain players, a lot of zerg's reaction is 'OMIGOD how dare they even infer that protoss isn't overpowered as fuck, I'm so fucking mad I wish IdrA had been there he would've said how it is!'.
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On May 26 2011 07:22 Telcontar wrote:
Farewell Incontrol! I'll miss your quick wit and well-oiled tongue.
As for the replacement, perhaps get a Terran player? SeleCT? Drewbie?
Painuser?
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On May 26 2011 07:14 blackone wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 07:07 FrankWalls wrote:
i will miss geoff for sure, but i remember a couple sotg's back he wasnt there for an episode and i really didnt mind it that much. whenever sotg is back im sure it will be just as entertaining, though it has lost one of the most entertaining personalities in esports That's exactly how I feel to. Let's just hope that hiatus is not longer than a week or so 
Doubtful considering how long the last hiatus was.. 1-2months is more than likely.
I hope the show still has that "spark" without Incontrol.
GL JP.
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SC Center went on a hiatus as well. Coincidence that JP is involved with it too? Maybe he'll be too busy to do these shows for awhile.
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On May 26 2011 06:11 nvs. wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 06:06 Tachion wrote:On May 26 2011 05:54 nvs. wrote:Generalizations are awesome. I have to almost assume that you are under 18 and have a hard time finding things to occupy your time with. Let the irony commence!! :D Assumptions and generalizations are different things. Hypocrisy is the word you're looking for, not irony. It is if he's generalizing what it means to be under 18.
You're both right and I actually apologized to him in a PM where we had a proper discussion.
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On May 26 2011 07:18 sickoota wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 07:14 zawk9 wrote:On May 26 2011 07:11 sickoota wrote:On May 26 2011 06:29 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On May 26 2011 05:56 ZeromuS wrote:On May 26 2011 05:39 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote:
Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid?
Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed.
Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. at the same time, calling an entire race "whiners who don't know how to micro" is kind of ridiculous... it's like you said in the first part of your post, zergs got this new tool and we've been slowly figuring out how to get them safely, good unit compositions to go with them, transitions, reactions, etc... but it's pretty insulting to say that the only reason zergs were underperforming is because they weren't trying new things because they'd rather whine and didn't know how to micro. IdrA (the most outspoken zerg), for example, tried plenty of new things and eventually found a solid way to use infestors... and saying that he can't micro is just plain wrong Here's my view of the whiners who cant micro thing. It was said amongst friends and players for the community to hear but obviously it was hyperbole. the Zerg players did use to complain a lot and say Zerg weak, matchups OP etc etc. This is a fact that many many Zergs of all levels were voicing their frustrations out loud and the term whiner was used in reference to this (of course it is hyperbole to a certain extent). Then the "don't know how to micro" part is also true. Zerg are figuring out the infestor, if they had it figured out before then they would have already known how to micro it. So no the Zerg players didnt know how to micro (the infestor). Thats all; I dont see how you can be getting so offended by a discussion on the current state of PvZ amongst Protoss players. Protoss is falling behind and the shift is towards the Zerg, often the game shifts understanding from one race to another in a matchup so I don't see anything wrong with the fact or way they discussed it on SOTG. microing infestors is pretty easy, you hit f and then you click on a bunch of stalkers. we've used infestors in ZvT before, too, it's not rocket science. if that's what huk was talking about, then... it's kind of strange to think of that as a change from "race can't micro" to "race can micro". yeah, a lot of zergs were bitching, a lot of protosses and terrans are bitching now and protosses have bitched in the past as well, everyone bitches so it's dumb to say "this race is the whiner race". I don't think it's that wrong to be offended by someone saying that my entire race is comprised of whiners who can't micro... I'm pretty sure he was talking more about baneling drops than just infestors,cause thats whats been going on in the matchup atm, which really is zergs learning to micro instead of a-move to solve their problems. Don't see any problem with what he said, seems accurate to me. If you think zergs tried to just a-move to solve their problems before than your either ridiculously mistaken or rather blatantly trolling. They figured out it took more than that eventually... and now they win alot more games.
As has been repeated: pro zergs weren't really "a-moving" when the matchup was at its hardest.
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We need incontrol to not let everything get too serious 
Maybe Catz is a good replacement since he's also a pretty funny guy but also quite serious when he has too?
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+1 to get a terran player replacement. Since it has to be NA player (just because of the schedule) I guess the most likely ones are: Drewbie, LzGaMeR or qxc
On May 26 2011 06:21 DooMDash wrote:
Yeah please for the love of god get a Terran to replace him at least. I thought Gretorp was great on there personally. Gretorp is annoying to listen to. The man can't speak! If the show were transcribed his sentences would have ellipses instead of normal punctuation and ocasionally would have words duplication typos.
Still, that's not the main problem. I don't care if he doesn't speak perfectly or fluently. The main problem I have with him, in particular his casting, is his points are just tl;dr palm reading and theorycrafting. He's like the horoscope, he says things that are always true or sound true; and he takes forever to say it. Honestly I feel Husky and HD and Whaet make better points then Gretorp, just because they (a) don't take 20minutes to say it, and (b) don't make everything sound like it's some racial imbalance that needs to be nerfed, and (c) don't pretend to know things they have no clue about.
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On May 26 2011 05:30 djWHEAT wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 04:32 ShooTouts wrote:
honestly I am going to watch both .... but I prefer Sotg because JP isnt an asshole ...DJ Wheat just rubs me the wrong way especially because hes always rude to just about every caller even when they have a decent question .... JP is more chill ... "just about every caller" - And by that I'm sure you mean the 2 guys I got upset with in Episode 1. Generalizations are awesome. The last sentence was false. If JP dealt with callers who interrupt the show... I'm sure he'd show a neck vein or two as well.
I wasn't just talking about the calls. I just feel that overall JP seems like hes genuinely a good time and is very chill and I understand that he doesn't have to take the phone calls so he doesn't deal with trolls.There is definitely phone calls where people deserved to be hung up on or whatever. I just prefer the relaxed atmosphere of SotG. I will definitely continue to watch/support ItG.
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On May 26 2011 07:18 sickoota wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 07:14 zawk9 wrote:On May 26 2011 07:11 sickoota wrote:On May 26 2011 06:29 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On May 26 2011 05:56 ZeromuS wrote:On May 26 2011 05:39 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote:
Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid?
Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed.
Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. at the same time, calling an entire race "whiners who don't know how to micro" is kind of ridiculous... it's like you said in the first part of your post, zergs got this new tool and we've been slowly figuring out how to get them safely, good unit compositions to go with them, transitions, reactions, etc... but it's pretty insulting to say that the only reason zergs were underperforming is because they weren't trying new things because they'd rather whine and didn't know how to micro. IdrA (the most outspoken zerg), for example, tried plenty of new things and eventually found a solid way to use infestors... and saying that he can't micro is just plain wrong Here's my view of the whiners who cant micro thing. It was said amongst friends and players for the community to hear but obviously it was hyperbole. the Zerg players did use to complain a lot and say Zerg weak, matchups OP etc etc. This is a fact that many many Zergs of all levels were voicing their frustrations out loud and the term whiner was used in reference to this (of course it is hyperbole to a certain extent). Then the "don't know how to micro" part is also true. Zerg are figuring out the infestor, if they had it figured out before then they would have already known how to micro it. So no the Zerg players didnt know how to micro (the infestor). Thats all; I dont see how you can be getting so offended by a discussion on the current state of PvZ amongst Protoss players. Protoss is falling behind and the shift is towards the Zerg, often the game shifts understanding from one race to another in a matchup so I don't see anything wrong with the fact or way they discussed it on SOTG. microing infestors is pretty easy, you hit f and then you click on a bunch of stalkers. we've used infestors in ZvT before, too, it's not rocket science. if that's what huk was talking about, then... it's kind of strange to think of that as a change from "race can't micro" to "race can micro". yeah, a lot of zergs were bitching, a lot of protosses and terrans are bitching now and protosses have bitched in the past as well, everyone bitches so it's dumb to say "this race is the whiner race". I don't think it's that wrong to be offended by someone saying that my entire race is comprised of whiners who can't micro... I'm pretty sure he was talking more about baneling drops than just infestors,cause thats whats been going on in the matchup atm, which really is zergs learning to micro instead of a-move to solve their problems. Don't see any problem with what he said, seems accurate to me. If you think zergs tried to just a-move to solve their problems before than your either ridiculously mistaken or rather blatantly trolling. They figured out it took more than that eventually... and now they win alot more games.
it's hard to micro when your army is surrounded by flashy wall things, so now we found ways to get around the flashy wall things, you mean?
because I really hope that's what you mean, otherwise you're actually so wrong it isn't funny >____<
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Huk trolled zerg players pretty hard with his comments and here they are whining again.
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The next episode better be momentous, or else; somebody else will make it that way. :3
Really hoping for the next episode to be full of laughs, really sad to see that iNcontrol has to part ways from SotG, and will sorely be missed in future episodes, however, I am greatly looking forward to the SotG to come, I will definitely be joining in on the drinking fun, at least in my own little way.
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On May 26 2011 07:39 Baarn wrote:
Huk trolled zerg players pretty hard with his comments and here they are whining again.
yup, lets talk shit about an entire race and then if they don't like that they're whiners.
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Wow its really unfortunate that incontrol is leaving SotG. He was a big part of why I enjoyed the show so much. I just can't imagine it being as funny without him.
Of course I will continue to watch/listen, but its a shame TT
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On May 26 2011 07:22 The KY wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 06:16 1Eris1 wrote:On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote:
Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid?
Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed.
Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. Tyler, my point was more directed at HuK almost insulting zerg players. Things like zerg players just amoved and lost and then whined. Yes infestors were buffed, and this opened up various new strats. But a lot of these strats were not viable before the buff, and thus they weren't done. I don't think zerg players got better with infestors, they just weren't viable. Zerg were already using them in ZvT and ZvZ regularly. I am a random player, and I tried infestor play pre-patch. It wasn't very viable, at least at my level. But now with it's increased strength, it can help transition into say faster ultralisks, which means you can counter the deathball+sentrys push where you would normally just throw a roach/hydra/corrupter army and hope to remax and kill it. You couldn't get fast ultralisks before, because it would leave you at risk to certain timings, but now with the infestor being a much stronger and better defensive unit, it is a lot more viable. It was dumb and arrogant of him to say, oh zerg players learned how to micro. No they didn't. They got buffed, and discovered new strats, and thats completely different then learning to micro. Zergs already knew how to micro, there just wasn't a lot of micro oppurtunities. And as far as the a-moving, it was no different then the protoss deathball being clicked across the map, so it's a stupid point. My comment wasn't really directed at you, and I'm sorry if it seemed that way. I just greatly dislike players that generalize a group of people based on a small % of that group. Then again, I am just a masters random player. I have about a 90% winrate in PvZ right now, because I've been incorporating archons, even though they apparentely suck according to some pros. The infestor buff was designed to counter the colossi/deathball, so it should be beating it, because zergs other "supposed" counter wasn't working. I don't think infestors are too good right now, colossi simply aren't the anwser to them. Then again, maybe the zergs I am playing just aren't good enough. who knows Hang on hang on...you're saying the infestor buff is reason that protoss feel like the match up is having a turnaround...but you also feel like the infestor is rubbish vs protoss? Regardless, Tyler's post is excellent; shouldn't zergs be ecstatic that the tide is turning? But because of the terrible broken race imba mindset spread by certain players, a lot of zerg's reaction is 'OMIGOD how dare they even infer that protoss isn't overpowered as fuck, I'm so fucking mad I wish IdrA had been there he would've said how it is!'.
Does anyone find this talk about imbalance all just really hilarious when on an early SOTG episode Huk was crying about 3-range roaches and saying ff and colossus were bad against Zerg? Now he's coming back saying Zerg is imba AGAIN but adding that only zerg players are whiners?
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On May 26 2011 07:42 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 07:39 Baarn wrote:
Huk trolled zerg players pretty hard with his comments and here they are whining again. yup, lets talk shit about an entire race and then if they don't like that they're whiners.
You guys got idra to do the same thing to the other races. It all works out.
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On May 26 2011 07:22 The KY wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2011 06:16 1Eris1 wrote:On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote:
Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid?
Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed.
Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. Tyler, my point was more directed at HuK almost insulting zerg players. Things like zerg players just amoved and lost and then whined. Yes infestors were buffed, and this opened up various new strats. But a lot of these strats were not viable before the buff, and thus they weren't done. I don't think zerg players got better with infestors, they just weren't viable. Zerg were already using them in ZvT and ZvZ regularly. I am a random player, and I tried infestor play pre-patch. It wasn't very viable, at least at my level. But now with it's increased strength, it can help transition into say faster ultralisks, which means you can counter the deathball+sentrys push where you would normally just throw a roach/hydra/corrupter army and hope to remax and kill it. You couldn't get fast ultralisks before, because it would leave you at risk to certain timings, but now with the infestor being a much stronger and better defensive unit, it is a lot more viable. It was dumb and arrogant of him to say, oh zerg players learned how to micro. No they didn't. They got buffed, and discovered new strats, and thats completely different then learning to micro. Zergs already knew how to micro, there just wasn't a lot of micro oppurtunities. And as far as the a-moving, it was no different then the protoss deathball being clicked across the map, so it's a stupid point. My comment wasn't really directed at you, and I'm sorry if it seemed that way. I just greatly dislike players that generalize a group of people based on a small % of that group. Then again, I am just a masters random player. I have about a 90% winrate in PvZ right now, because I've been incorporating archons, even though they apparentely suck according to some pros. The infestor buff was designed to counter the colossi/deathball, so it should be beating it, because zergs other "supposed" counter wasn't working. I don't think infestors are too good right now, colossi simply aren't the anwser to them. Then again, maybe the zergs I am playing just aren't good enough. who knows Hang on hang on...you're saying the infestor buff is reason that protoss feel like the match up is having a turnaround...but you also feel like the infestor is rubbish vs protoss? Regardless, Tyler's post is excellent; shouldn't zergs be ecstatic that the tide is turning? But because of the terrible broken race imba mindset spread by certain players, a lot of zerg's reaction is 'OMIGOD how dare they even infer that protoss isn't overpowered as fuck, I'm so fucking mad I wish IdrA had been there he would've said how it is!'.
Where did I say infestors are bad? I just said I don't find them overpowered at all. Maybe it's because I don't play a deathball style of PvZ though.
And I don't think they should be, obviously it's better, but at this rate it's just going to be protoss bitching about zerg, and zerg players hardly want that. They should want the protoss to find some new strat that isn't too strong but beats infestors
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On May 26 2011 07:35 zawk9 wrote:As has been repeated: pro zergs weren't really "a-moving" when the matchup was at its hardest.
people keep saying that but if remember
i.e. Idras match vs. Cruncher in TSL3, the VoD tells otherwise.
i just recently had a heated discussion in an other forum that zerg players kept saying me that Corruption was useless because you are wasting one Attack Periode to cast the spell and i was said to be a troll because i stated that this is not true and a micro failure of them.
(this true because attackmove, and spell casting are independend of each other; any Protoss knows that cause we have to micro like that everytime with sentrys, but many Zerg players don't seem to know this thus they cast spells and then a-move which obviously reduces the damage output of corruptors in the inital engagement)
and there are many different other little things.
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EPT
