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aXa
France748 Posts
maybe I am old-fashioned but in brood-war, what made units unique and really enjoyable to watch was the combination of different factor (speed, range, attack speed..) and not "spells", which sound very LoL'esque, or even Warcraft 3 esque to me... But well we will see ... | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12022 Posts
On December 08 2012 07:36 chadissilent wrote: The shared upgrades for mech is just retarded... Late game terran can just make hit squads of 3-3 banshees to go tear up expansions, it's ridiculous. You realise we could do that before right? If anything, due to the way zerg tech switches work it's almost fairer as you don't get super punished by not being able to deal with tech switches at all as mech. Mech is the style still which suffers from if you don't have the exact correct unit composition, you just die to whatever the other player remaxes with. Speaking of that, what's the best way to deal with muta openings into swarm hosts? I find myself forced into thors and then i get contained and although I don't die, it's really hard to deal with mutas/swarm hosts together since you can't push forward if they're clever with the waves. | ||
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Serpico
4285 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:28 aXa wrote: I'm reading a lot of happy comments about this patch note, but seriously i'm kind of worried... What's up with the flashy abilities ? Every unit has become a spellcaster or alike.. maybe I am old-fashioned but in brood-war, what made units unique and really enjoyable to watch was the combination of different factor (speed, range, attack speed..) and not "spells", which sound very LoL'esque, or even Warcraft 3 esque to me... But well we will see ... Agreed, it's becoming less like starcraft in that respect. Also people need to understand that a patch with gigantic changes is not automatically good. | ||
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Sjokola
Netherlands800 Posts
Btw I would love to see how sc2 1.0 would work out right now. To see what we've learnt. | ||
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A.Alm
Sweden515 Posts
It's so much fun to be able to use mech and ravens lategame is a great way of dealing with zerg. | ||
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Clawfinger
Canada221 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:28 aXa wrote: I'm reading a lot of happy comments about this patch note, but seriously i'm kind of worried... What's up with the flashy abilities ? Every unit has become a spellcaster or alike.. maybe I am old-fashioned but in brood-war, what made units unique and really enjoyable to watch was the combination of different factor (speed, range, attack speed..) and not "spells", which sound very LoL'esque, or even Warcraft 3 esque to me... But well we will see ... I think that the "spells" bring a higher skill cap in Starcraft 2 which is something that it needs right now. When you use an ability on a unit, there is usually a way you could have used it more efficiently in the same situation you were in, and that means that the better players will benefit from them a lot. In Brood War the game was so difficult to play perfectly macro-wise that the better mechanical players would win the majority of the time. I think since Starcraft 2 has made macro a lot easier (we don't have any "real" macro players anymore, because every pro can keep up in macro to a certain extent), these type of abilities are necessary to keep the best players on top. I see what you mean that it doesn't follow Starcraft's past, but with the way SC2 is designed I think these changes could make it a lot more exciting! | ||
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FeUerFlieGe
United States1193 Posts
On December 08 2012 09:15 Serpico wrote: Agreed, it's becoming less like starcraft in that respect. Also people need to understand that a patch with gigantic changes is not automatically good. I actually think a little bit of spells being added to some units is good. As we all know, Starcraft 2 has so far suffered a bit of viewer enjoyability because of unit clumping and such, making engagements less enjoyable and player micro less necessary in some cases. Adding a few spells to units can actually reward the player if they micromanage them a bit more. Although I do agree that some units should just not have spells to cast. | ||
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Rollora
2450 Posts
On December 07 2012 21:20 lonelyPotato wrote: As a Zerg... I just can't find my self winning any games in the beta. In WoL I'm fine, but currently I just feel like Terran and Protoss are using all these tools that are incredibly hard to stop. Widow Mines also screw up every thing as well, mutalisk play is so hard against it. I basically have to carry an overseer with me if I want to harrass a mineral line. My ZvZ is 100% win ratio so far this season while my protoss/terran is something rediculously low xD 1.It takes time to learn to deal with it. It took koreans to figure some things out in WoL, there are still some things not figured out (still some new builds come up, there was a PvZ guide "no more tears") etc. 2.things get patched, nothing will stay exactly the way it is ATM, there will be fine-tuning 3. some fights were really too easy to win as zergs in WoL, like it was too easy to MMM as terran at the beginning of the game and on small maps. so maybe it feels harder now in HOTS, but everything will be figured out (or nerfed :D ) | ||
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Empirimancer
Canada1024 Posts
You'll say that no worse than banshee or ghost cloak, and that's true in a way, but the difference is that they don't drain energy as fast, and especially they have a visual effect that makes it really obvious that cloak is activated, whereas it's really easy to forget you've turned pulsar beam on. | ||
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Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:28 aXa wrote: I'm reading a lot of happy comments about this patch note, but seriously i'm kind of worried... What's up with the flashy abilities ? Every unit has become a spellcaster or alike.. maybe I am old-fashioned but in brood-war, what made units unique and really enjoyable to watch was the combination of different factor (speed, range, attack speed..) and not "spells", which sound very LoL'esque, or even Warcraft 3 esque to me... But well we will see ... it's fine as long as the spells are not gimmick which none of new spells are. | ||
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HTOMario
United States439 Posts
On December 08 2012 10:38 A.Alm wrote: I've played the most epic games ever in my entire SC2 history this day on HoTs. It's so much fun to be able to use mech and ravens lategame is a great way of dealing with zerg. Exactly this, earlier today this zerg and i had an amazing game. At the end it was like 12 floating bcs and 2 command centers following the bcs while the zerg was trying to get a base on the map and corrupters floating around with ultras and lings. 1 hour long game and it was only possible due to the changes. This zerg and I agreed that it was one of the funnest games we've ever played. | ||
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dgwow
Canada1024 Posts
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Proseat
Germany5113 Posts
djWHEAT @djWHEAT Viper's Blinding Cloud works on Missile Turrets. That's pretty sweet. #HOTS 4:13 PM - 7 Dec 12 · Details Now it gets interesting... | ||
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phodacbiet
United States1740 Posts
On December 08 2012 05:45 TheRabidDeer wrote: Mutas have rarely seen use in ZvT for a long time. I rarely see spores used Queens are obviously used because they can help Lings + infestors is popular, however tons of drops still get through at the professional level Creep spread is cleaned up by decent terrans and rarely reaches points able to spot drops Lings are OFTEN used in high level ZvT because of their speed and they always reach the drop first. People saying that lings are never used to deal with drops are strange and in denial. Wut? You do know a medivac full of rines can clean a mineral line in like 5 seconds right? If there were no spore, that would happen. But since there are spores, the medivac has to move around/delay rine drop (hence why zerg arent losing to drops outright or at all). Zenio just use mutas today, Life use mutas all the time, so does DRG/Sniper. Sniper used it in IPL, and so does a lot of zerg. Creep spread is hard to clean up later the game goes (watch zvt, notice how the map is purple. Lings are used in zvt because its easier to transition from ling infestor than ling muta. Also, do you even watch starcraft? | ||
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Zergrusher
United States562 Posts
The problems I have with it are: 1) SM is basically another yamoto cannon, and why make people want to split units if the SPELL HAS NO SPLASH anymore? 2) Ultralisk attack Upgrade scaling( it gets +2 now apparently) and the 33% splash(I'll get to this relationship once i know i can post a proper thread because I have a lengthy analysis on it). But i will say that increasing the base damage like you did is great. 3) Please Un-do the nerfs the Hydralisk got in WOL's beta for HOTS, and please increase hydra range to 6 and remove Grooved spines. Lair speed helps but hydralisk still have issues. But overall you have created a great patch, that feels like something new and something special.  | ||
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Zahir
United States947 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:28 aXa wrote: I'm reading a lot of happy comments about this patch note, but seriously i'm kind of worried... What's up with the flashy abilities ? Every unit has become a spellcaster or alike.. maybe I am old-fashioned but in brood-war, what made units unique and really enjoyable to watch was the combination of different factor (speed, range, attack speed..) and not "spells", which sound very LoL'esque, or even Warcraft 3 esque to me... But well we will see ... I felt like this at first too, but I think it's a good thing ultimately. Just look at stalkers and how blink, a relatively simple ability, gives them so much depth, excitement factor and situational utility. Also, most of the new abilities just change the units attack, which is what you just said made units enjoyable. If every unit was getting a psi storm, you would probably have a point. | ||
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trips
United Kingdom107 Posts
On December 08 2012 01:36 stichtom wrote: Man, the new AI is so so so much better. The easy level now is like the old hardest but more smarter. It's just beautiful playing with the AI :D What AI are you playing?I tried the medium and easy and there both really bad.The old "very hard" was a LOT better.Protoss would always do a good 3 gate robo and push out before 7 mins with lots of units(good for practicing fast expands).The new ai builds like 4 units. | ||
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MoonCricket
222 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:02 Glitch890 wrote: Damn. Right when ultras were starting to get interesting. The rest of the changes seem good however, I'm excited to try these out. Ultras are interesting, base 35 damage changes how Ultras play in all 3 match ups, being able to cleave thru' Zerglings, Marines, Zealots and Hellbats is HUGE. At the moment, I think Mutalisk, Zergling, Baneling into Swarmhost, Viper, Ultralisk is pretty much the end game composition for Zerg in TvZ. Biggest issue for Hydralisks is that even with Lair Speed Upgrade they still aren't cost effective, I think they need to do something more drastic for Hydralisks like reduce the supply cost to 1 or remove their armor type so they're a little more effective against Hellions and Banelings. | ||
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Hetz
196 Posts
On December 08 2012 08:03 FeUerFlieGe wrote: This patch honestly gave me hope for the future of SC2! Thats false hope my friend. SC2 has no appeal and no patch can fix that. Once you find out you're wasting time on moving pixels and virtual rankings things become quite different. User was warned for this post | ||
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On December 08 2012 16:14 phodacbiet wrote: Wut? You do know a medivac full of rines can clean a mineral line in like 5 seconds right? If there were no spore, that would happen. But since there are spores, the medivac has to move around/delay rine drop (hence why zerg arent losing to drops outright or at all). Zenio just use mutas today, Life use mutas all the time, so does DRG/Sniper. Sniper used it in IPL, and so does a lot of zerg. Creep spread is hard to clean up later the game goes (watch zvt, notice how the map is purple. Lings are used in zvt because its easier to transition from ling infestor than ling muta. Also, do you even watch starcraft? Yeah, I feel that a lot of people that are commenting on this are not watching GSL at all. Mutas aren't used rarely... we don't see them every game, as Infestors, but they are in like every third ZvT that I am watching(and I do mostly watch GSL), and even if ZvP they are. Sniper, DRG, Leenock, all of them are using Mutas. | ||
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