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On December 13 2012 00:26 awesomoecalypse wrote:
Things I'd like to see in the new patch:
Medivac speed changed to use energy--promotes much harder decisions, while still expanding the utility of the Medivac.
Slight modification to Ultralisk--shrink the model size a bit (like was done with the Thor) and tweak the collision radius to make them easier to handle. Also, they may be a bit too strong in ZvZ, but this could be handled by removing Frenzied (which really only effects Infestors, since Gravitor, Forcefield and Conc shells all don't work on massive anyway) or buffing Broodlord damage vs. massive.
A slight Muta buff that further encourages harass, maybe improved acceleration or health regen.
A slight buff to Thor's new HIP attack to make it useful in more situations--as it is, most of the units you'd use it against clump anyway so you're still better off with splash. HIP has the unit to make Thors more interesting by forcing choices about what mode to use and when to switch, but only if HIP is legitimately useful. I think a moderate damage buff would be in order. Also, it should be usable vs. Colossi when they are out of range of the ground attack, it doesn't make sense that it isn't and it would further help Terran mech vs Robo.
Tanks should receive some kind of upgrade to improve damage vs. shields. This would make them much less reliant on ghost support to deal with Protoss and thus enable more of a pure mech style, without effecting either the 1/1/1 timing or other matchups.
+1 I agree with thos change
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On December 13 2012 00:26 awesomoecalypse wrote:
Slight modification to Ultralisk--shrink the model size a bit (like was done with the Thor) and tweak the collision radius to make them easier to handle. Also, they may be a bit too strong in ZvZ, but this could be handled by removing Frenzied (which really only effects Infestors, since Gravitor, Forcefield and Conc shells all don't work on massive anyway) or buffing Broodlord damage vs. massive.
Just want to say, that the ultralisks size is basically the only thing that keeps them being interesting. If they get balanced around being easily deployable, there is nothing interesting left. Also imo NP on Ultras would turn them completly useless. Not sure how to solve this issue for ZvZ (if there is one), apart from buffing roaches/hydras/ITs vs them, which will cause problems in the other matchups...
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On December 12 2012 12:05 Zergrusher wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 12:04 Zdrastochye wrote:On December 12 2012 11:55 Zergrusher wrote:On December 12 2012 11:53 s3rp wrote:On December 12 2012 11:51 Zergrusher wrote:On December 12 2012 11:43 s3rp wrote:On December 12 2012 11:40 Zergrusher wrote:On December 12 2012 11:40 s3rp wrote:On December 12 2012 11:37 Zergrusher wrote:On December 12 2012 11:19 s3rp wrote:
[quote]
On single Units but you're not going to have 1 Ultra only hit only unit at a time . Especially considering Ultras are not the only damage to deal with.
Btw if you test it Medivacs cannot outheal Ultras because the heal of Medivacs starts with significant delay.
Define "Delay" Because the improved medivacs heal more per 1 energy in a very short time. When the Medivac starts healing the Ultralisk will already starting the swing for the second time. what if you stim the units before the ultralisk starts attacking? Doesn't matter because the Medivacs will heal the Stim and then just stop and will again have a delay. There's delay between the heal . The new Upgrade doesn't make Units survive Ultra attacks . They may last longer but the Ultra damage is higher because Medivacs will have hiccups healing units. Trust me an Ultra will kill a unit healed by the new Medivac 100% of the time . Theoretically it might should not but in reality it does so. You cannot outheal the Ultralisk it just doesn't work . If you don't believe me try it yourself i'm not making this up. I know your not making this up, but I am saying if the medivacs heal rate(s) are basically like DPS then if it has a higher DPS then shouldn't the splashed units last longer? Maybe they should but they just don't. It for whatever reason works differently . I'm just playing the game and telling you how it works in my game . Either the numbers are wrong or some other factor needs to be figured in that you haven't thought of. yeah theres this big ????????? factor that were not getting :/ The difference is that one player is playing HotS and the other is making sweeping generalizations using math without factoring in how the actual game is playing out. You really need a beta key and to play 100 games and come back to your statements. I 100% promise that you'll have a different opinion than you currently do. Ahhh the doubters show up, its about time. because heaven forbid someone, a person, know more about the game and perhaps its future, then some feeble little rank says on a computer screen. User was warned for this post
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On December 13 2012 00:43 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 00:26 awesomoecalypse wrote:
Slight modification to Ultralisk--shrink the model size a bit (like was done with the Thor) and tweak the collision radius to make them easier to handle. Also, they may be a bit too strong in ZvZ, but this could be handled by removing Frenzied (which really only effects Infestors, since Gravitor, Forcefield and Conc shells all don't work on massive anyway) or buffing Broodlord damage vs. massive. Just want to say, that the ultralisks size is basically the only thing that keeps them being interesting. If they get balanced around being easily deployable, there is nothing interesting left. Also imo NP on Ultras would turn them completly useless. Not sure how to solve this issue for ZvZ (if there is one), apart from buffing roaches/hydras/ITs vs them, which will cause problems in the other matchups...
I don't think Ultralisk size makes them interesting so much as clunky and annoying--removing charge was a good move because imo it looked dumb and made no sense, but the problem that inspired it of Utralisks being sort of unfun to play with because they spend so much time derping around remains. If a slight size reductions makes them imba then consider rebalancing, but I doubt it would.
I also don't think NP would instantly make all Ultralisk play useless, but if it did then some other change should be attempted to keep Ultras from destroying lategame ZvZ. As I said, Broodlord damage vs massive could be buffed without breaking much--they'd be stronger vs Ultras (which is a good thing) vs. Colossi (not a bad thing either imo), vs. Thors (who, as I've said, should receive an HIP buff which could cancel out the BL buff) and Archons (who should not be the counter to Broods anyway in a game wiithout stupid archon toilets).
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Well thank god for a new patch soon, I was worried they might take long. New toys to play with are always fun, but new balanced toys are better!
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On December 13 2012 00:58 awesomoecalypse wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 00:43 Big J wrote:On December 13 2012 00:26 awesomoecalypse wrote:
Slight modification to Ultralisk--shrink the model size a bit (like was done with the Thor) and tweak the collision radius to make them easier to handle. Also, they may be a bit too strong in ZvZ, but this could be handled by removing Frenzied (which really only effects Infestors, since Gravitor, Forcefield and Conc shells all don't work on massive anyway) or buffing Broodlord damage vs. massive. Just want to say, that the ultralisks size is basically the only thing that keeps them being interesting. If they get balanced around being easily deployable, there is nothing interesting left. Also imo NP on Ultras would turn them completly useless. Not sure how to solve this issue for ZvZ (if there is one), apart from buffing roaches/hydras/ITs vs them, which will cause problems in the other matchups... I don't think Ultralisk size makes them interesting so much as clunky and annoying--removing charge was a good move because imo it looked dumb and made no sense, but the problem that inspired it of Utralisks being sort of unfun to play with because they spend so much time derping around remains. If a slight size reductions makes them imba then consider rebalancing, but I doubt it would. I also don't think NP would instantly make all Ultralisk play useless, but if it did then some other change should be attempted to keep Ultras from destroying lategame ZvZ. As I said, Broodlord damage vs massive could be buffed without breaking much--they'd be stronger vs Ultras (which is a good thing) vs. Colossi (not a bad thing either imo), vs. Thors (who, as I've said, should receive an HIP buff which could cancel out the BL buff) and Archons (who should not be the counter to Broods anyway in a game wiithout stupid archon toilets).
Well, they are annoying to play with. But at least there is something more. Without that, what is left? The only thing that kind of takes skill, is to keep them attacking the right things and to spread them out before combat.
Also I don't really like the idea of BLs to counter Ultras. BLs just have straight up deployment issues vs Ultras, so it enforces turtle play if you need to counter Ultras with them. And I don't believe that BLs need to be better vs anything (maybe apart from buffed Thors, we'll see), as they do counter said units already pretty hard and force quite severe reactions, even without them being more costefficient.
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Does anyone have any comments about tempest? The range for them is just ridiculous and it makes it impossible to defend them if they have 3 or more. Get 3 tempest and a group of stalkers.. Then attack the mineral line with oracles at the same time that you attack the front and it's almost gg every time. I'm just curious to see if anyone else has experienced games where the other person has went tempest. Also in 2's I've had to play against brood/tempest. Now that is an impossible combination to beat.
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Balance Update #9 is coming super soon! 
-Cloaken
Not just "soon" but "super soon"
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they could add some kind of stampede ability to the ultra that lets them rapidly charge in one direction ignoring unit collision and trampling all enemies in its path for damage. that would make them take some micro while also giving the user the ability to put them where you want them
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Not sure why people keep demanding ultras to get an ability that allows them to force engagements. Do understand that if you make it so that a terran/protoss can't micro away from your ultras, they in return need to have cost effective answers to them. That means gimping ultra damage.
I would much, MUCH rather have high damage ultras that massacre stuff at close range but can be countered with careful sim city and positioning. It forces decisionmaking from both players, as the opponent needs to avoid open spaces and zerg needs to be good at choosing their attack paths since they don't have a "push button to force engagement"-ability.
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On December 13 2012 02:36 SarcasmMonster wrote:-CloakenNot just "soon" but "super soon"
I'm actually pretty interested to see what they do. Nerfs to Reapers and Medivacs?
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On December 12 2012 23:34 Dvriel wrote:
Being a BETA I would wish to see warpgates with bigger cooldown than gates.It will be real cool change and will make the game very different.
the game would barely change. The longer cooldown would mean instead of building 4 gates on one base you now need to build 5 to spend all of my money or however the numbers work out. Building from regular gates would hurt protoss mobility way too much considering the only drawback would be that protoss has too build a few more gateways that cost only worthless minerals. With mutas and drops buffed I doubt anyone would try using regular gates to save a few minerals. It seems like a pointless nerf to me. If you want waprgates nerfed you should find some other way to do it.
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On December 13 2012 02:52 Crawdad wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 02:36 SarcasmMonster wrote:Balance Update #9 is coming super soon! Not just "soon" but "super soon" I'm actually pretty interested to see what they do. Nerfs to Reapers and Medivacs?
Forget that, we need an animation or effect attached to the medivac speed boost. Right now the thing looks so funny when they just "ZOOOOOOOM" away.
They have said they think reapers are a bit to strong and they might get rid of their bonus to light damage, which I think is fine. They are super cool early scout and still make your opponent look real dumb if they are not prepared.
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On December 13 2012 02:52 Crawdad wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 02:36 SarcasmMonster wrote:Balance Update #9 is coming super soon! Not just "soon" but "super soon" I'm actually pretty interested to see what they do. Nerfs to Reapers and Medivacs?
Viper nerfs most likely.
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On December 13 2012 03:45 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 02:52 Crawdad wrote:On December 13 2012 02:36 SarcasmMonster wrote:Balance Update #9 is coming super soon! Not just "soon" but "super soon" I'm actually pretty interested to see what they do. Nerfs to Reapers and Medivacs? Viper nerfs most likely.
I don't think so. In the notes about this patch, it rather sounded like DK was thinking about buffing them.
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On December 12 2012 18:12 [F_]aths wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2012 23:50 ShamW0W wrote:On December 10 2012 16:10 sagefreke wrote:
Kinda wish they'd buff Zerg's tier 2 a little more. Besides ZvZ I've had to do a fast tech to tier 3 almost every game unless I'm doing an all in. Speed hydras aren't useful in ZvP without Viper support still. The Muta buff really hasn't made them all that more viable in ZvT, but since Infestors have been nerfed into the ground there's not really much else Zerg has for tier 2 harass.
That being said, I love the Ultra buff. Finally I won't have to witness Zealots soft counter Ultras. As a Zerg player that's my biggest gripe with HOTS right now. It's not about the balance for me, it's that it feels like I'm building the same units that I made in WoL every game. I watch Terran players with Widow Mines, Hellbats, and super medivacs and think "hey, I want to make some HOTS units". My only option is Swarm Host for 2/3 of the game which forces you into a pretty specific playstyle. Would love to see them give Zerg something at Hatch or Lair tech that actually changes how a Zerg player should think in different matchups. Right now, ZvZ is basically the same as WoL. It could use something fresh. I find Hydras more usefull with the speedupgrade avaiable at tier 2. The hydra is not a new unit, but I still use it more than in Wol. With spores avialable at pool, I feel I have more flexibility to quicky morph some emergency anti air buildings. The zerg changes overall are small, but the race feels more complete. I also think that we still have to explore the real potential of the viper.
I'm also having fun trying to incorporate Hydras more, even vT now with the new medivac boost, which feels 'new' since they were 100% not viable in WoL.
That said, it's more exciting for Zerg now when we hit tier 3 and get the Viper which is a real game changer imo. The problem though is that it takes until tier 3 to get the unit which, ignoring balance, isn't as exciting as having something much earlier in the tech tree.
Example: Terran now gets Widow Mine at factor and Protoss now gets the Mothership Core at Cy Core. (equivalent to Baneling Nest or Roach Warren in the Zerg tech tree)
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Like grubby said, "the best patch Blizzard has ever implemented"
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EPT
