Balance Update #7 10/26/12 - Page 24

On October 27 2012 14:50 Destructicon wrote:
I have no idea how people consider these changes good.
Time warp + any aoe will be the end of anything, but especially terran bio.
Time warp + FF to always land guaranteed and perfect FFs, also reduce the damage trapped units do to your army.
Time warp + storm to basically not even allow bio to split or bait.
Time warp + colossus and zealots to nullify bio ability to kite and guarantee huge splash.

I have no idea how they consider TW to be a good idea of a spell, bio already was having a hard time being cost effective against toss armies, now it will just flat out die. Mech will still be useless vs toss because tanks don't give proper zone control and are too easily countered by toss units and in addition mech now has to worry about tempests sniping from a distance.
BCs are now equally useless, they already had enough counters via feedbacks from HT, void-ray threats and potential archon toilet, now they also have to face a relatively fast unit that can kite them and kill them with ease.

Problem with TW, also, it can't be fixed in any way, if you reduce the radius too much it becomes nearly useless, if you reduce duration too much it just encouraged making more oracles and spamming the spell, and reducing the speed reduction too much will also tilt the balance of the spell too much.
Also a slow like this is ridiculous and stupid for a race that already has so much aoe, there is just no way TW can fit into this context, it just needs to go.

Pulsar beam seems kind of useless, any competent player should still have units in place to deny the harass. In all honesty entombed would have been a more interesting choice if it needed to target individual mineral patches and cost 25 energy per mineral patch, at least it would have taken more skill to use like that.

Viper worries me, I like the unit concept, its good and interesting, it does things no other unit does. However the synergy between Vipers and Infestors will be murderous, and I'm still appalled no one has pointed this out to Blizzard. Basically infestors root things in place while also damaging them, and viper reduces said units range to near 0, and with the units rooted in place, they can't escape the cloud.

Overall, I'm very worried with the direction Blizzard is going, it still feels like they have no clue what they are doing, just trowing ideas randomly out there without any thought as to the consequences of what these changes will do.

On October 28 2012 00:06 AbideWithMe wrote:
I called it before and it is true now. These changes are arbitrary and ridiculous. Time Warp is a beyond insane ability.

On October 28 2012 00:18 Crawdad wrote:


On the contrary, players were asking for this, and it was obvious that Blizzard was going to replace Void Siphon with an army support spell that did something like this. I didn't expect Entomb to be removed, but hey, that's even better. Sorry dude, but I don't see them reversing this decision.

On October 27 2012 17:35 avilo wrote:


He's playing the beta, you obviously aren't. He's correct in his assessment that the mines are what allow mech TvP to get running, and as the game goes into lategame you do not want more than 10 supply worth of mines on the map.

Mines in HOTS allow Terran to pour vespene gas into factory and armory infrastructure without flat out dying to: DTS, void rays, blink stalkers so easily like in wings of liberty.

You'll notice wings of liberty mech requires you to do crazy shit, like always make a starport, always need a raven, always need siege mode/tanks meaning you can never move out on the map, etc. When you're pouring 100 gas into a starport, 200 gas into a raven to protect vs DTS, 100 gas into an armory, 75 gas into vikings as the only realistic AA option...that's over 400-500 vespene gas dedicated to simply not dying to random all-ins and various things.

What the widow mine does in HOTS is give Terran users a reliable way to pour all of that wings of liberty vespene gas into factories, allowing more possibilities for mech play in the match-up.

As the game goes into the later stages, the mines become progressively weaker to the point where you want basically want no more than 4-5 mines on the map because they take away from your army value. Mines cannot fight against a lategame Protoss deathball of tempests + anything effectively.

The problem now is the same problem that exists in wings of liberty for Terran - there is no mech anti-air option. Right now the only real option is "make a lot of vikings," which is a catch-22 because zerg and protoss ground units absolutely kill grounded vikings meaning in the scenario you kill the opponent's air, you're left with a bad army that dies to the ground remax, or the situation where your vikings die to their air + storms/fungals...you simply die.

Sorry for the long post, just had to debunk your sensationalist bullshit about the mine being good lategame and OP with a logical post.

On October 28 2012 00:22 AbideWithMe wrote:

XD
I would literally bet about 300 dollars that Time Warp will be gone within the next two patches.
Anybody willing to take this bet?

On October 28 2012 00:22 AbideWithMe wrote:

XD
I would literally bet about 300 dollars that Time Warp will be gone within the next two patches.
Anybody willing to take this bet?

On October 27 2012 23:18 Lorch wrote:


I'm sorry but I can't even try to make sensee into your train of thoughts. Maybe you don't understand how game development works or maybe you don't understand what I wrote, but I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

On October 28 2012 00:33 Ramiz1989 wrote:

This isn't Warhound that is just plain stupid, it is Time Warp, design of the ability is actually quite cool, if it is overpowered, they may nerf it, but design is good, since it can be used for slowing down the mining, and can support your army, it opens up a lot of possibilities for you to play it, and it is really good in a lot of different situations, majority of players like it, so no, they won't remove it.
They will probably nerf it, lower the duration, higher energy cost, lower the slow %, etc etc., but no, I can't see it being removed, since community is quite happy with it.

And funny how everybody was saying how Pulsar Beam is useless, and I just watched Husky's video, it does crazy amount of damage in no time. One Oracle can snipe down Pylons pretty fast, and can always retreat when enemy comes for it, and come back later. Two Oracles are destroying Supply Depots, and add-ons.

On October 27 2012 10:32 SarcasmMonster wrote:


Time Warp doesn't affect air so doesn't affect BCs... if you're a BC kinda guy.

I also don't see why TW and FF can't work together, you slow units to make sure they can't escape or dance around the edge of FF range and then you FF them, you then aoe them down with either storm or colossus, and even with zealots and stalkers it is effective because TW doesn't slow your own units.

On October 28 2012 00:22 AbideWithMe wrote:

XD
I would literally bet about 300 dollars that Time Warp will be gone within the next two patches.
Anybody willing to take this bet?