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On December 12 2012 15:47 nimbus99 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 10:25 Breach_hu wrote:On December 12 2012 10:20 iEchoic wrote:On December 12 2012 09:12 A.Alm wrote:On December 12 2012 09:07 Breach_hu wrote:On December 12 2012 08:57 A.Alm wrote:
I go for banshee/thors. Using helions to kill workers.
Since you're going mech, you can scan a lot and see what the protoss is doing, and react to it.
I havn't lost a single game when im maxed against a protoss, because they dont have time to make 30 f*cking tempest if you constantly put presure with banshees and helions. It is a bit tought to get maxed though, but i just have to find a solid build, so far it's going decent. Widow mines defenetly help out.
And if, somehow the protoss has 30 tempest you'll be on 6 bases with 3k banked gas which you can do whatever you want with.
I'm high master in both wol and hots, so this apparantly works above bronze league.
I do agree that mech is weaker in TvP than in TvT and TvZ still. Good tosses wont let you do this, trust me. Thors we're really good in WoL when they didn't have an enery bar. in HoTs they don't have an energy bar, and widowmines excist plus a bunch of other terran buffs. Thorzain did a good job killing the best protoss players in the world using thors, and now in HoTs protoss players don't have any new earlygame agression so getting to thors shouldnt be much different in HoTs than in Wol. Thors weren't good because of no energy bar, they were good with 250mm cannon on a timer. Immortals still destroyed them without it. Good players are going to use tempest to attack your mech without getting attacked back. Mech is hard-countered by well-microed tempests. People that are reporting beating tempests with mech are playing 1aers who don't move away from vikings and thors. There's no reason you should ever hit a tempest with any mechanical unit if the Protoss engages you before you're sieged at their base. And if they are adding Carriers to the mix, you can just leave the game. But you can switch into heavy viking in an instant because there is only 1 upgrade for air and ground. Not to mention, the new thor transformation will be buffed (right now its a tiny bit better than ordinary air attack against big air units)
Vikings are just getting murdered by Tempests and Carriers, and combined with HT, you cant really get any closer, Thors are not cutting it, Carriers just kills anything on the ground, you cant touch Tempests, HT/Tempest is the new BL/infestor, you have to kill the P before they get it.
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Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked.
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free bump, didn't see it was a HOTS topic
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On December 12 2012 16:36 Buchan wrote:
Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked.
I've heard Banshees do pretty well against Immortals :-)
I actually played a game yesterday against a meching Terran and his army was pretty damn scary. Lots and lots of Thors, a handful of Banshees, some Ravens, and of course Tanks and Hellions. Stalkers die so fast, that I feel it really opens up options to look at massing more Banshees and reign supreme when the Stalkers are down.
I did win in the end because I identified Goody style early on due to fast Siege Tech + 2nd CC, so I just went 3rd Nexus / double Forge straight of the bat into relatively quick 5 base and massed Carriers while constantly harassing him on 100 workers for a long time but still, I would not say mech is dead. Au contraire, my friend. With the combined upgrades it has a lot of potential imo. My harassment was not very successful (dmg wise, it did buy me plenty of time though) as he had a lot of missile turrets and sensor towers so he was pretty impervious on 3 base while building his death ball.
If the guy had the balls to just push out around 140 supply I would probably roll over and die. It would have also helped him if he would try some harassment of his own, he definitely could have done more. I'm at 233 points master league in HotS atm for your reference.
My resources lost was waaaaaay higher than his btw, at least before the final battle where my Carriers had a nice high ground position and owned him pretty hard.
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On December 12 2012 17:07 dani` wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 16:36 Buchan wrote:
Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked. I've heard Banshees do pretty well against Immortals :-) I actually played a game yesterday against a meching Terran and his army was pretty damn scary. Lots and lots of Thors, a handful of Banshees, some Ravens, and of course Tanks and Hellions. Stalkers die so fast, that I feel it really opens up options to look at massing more Banshees and reign supreme when the Stalkers are down. I did win in the end because I identified Goody style early on due to fast Siege Tech + 2nd CC, so I just went 3rd Nexus / double Forge straight of the bat into relatively quick 5 base and massed Carriers while constantly harassing him on 100 workers for a long time but still, I would not say mech is dead. Au contraire, my friend. With the combined upgrades it has a lot of potential imo. My harassment was not very successful (dmg wise, it did buy me plenty of time though) as he had a lot of missile turrets and sensor towers so he was pretty impervious on 3 base while building his death ball. If the guy had the balls to just push out around 140 supply I would probably roll over and die. It would have also helped him if he would try some harassment of his own, he definitely could have done more. I'm at 233 points master league in HotS atm for your reference. My resources lost was waaaaaay higher than his btw, at least before the final battle where my Carriers had a nice high ground position and owned him pretty hard.
"mech" can work now but it has little to do with the traditional mech of BW.
It's more thor/banshee/hellbat with a few tanks in it. Tanks in itself are just not really interesting to mass against protoss because they are only really effective against stalkers and sentries, a decent protoss will be sure not to continue production in either of those making your tanks if massed just awful.
Bio is the far more interesting style in TvP and get's at least a new potential tool in the raven. This new airmech is incredibly boring because it basically consists of some slow a-move units like hellbats, thors and banshee's. What good is it if blizzard get's mech 'working' but it's a stupid version of it that has nothing to do with the BW variant.
BW mech has a lot of positional play because it's mostly tanks and has much more action going on with vulture harass and laying mines. SC2 mech has hardly any positional play and no real mines to speak off. BW's goliath vs carrier is also an interesting micro and positional fight, SC2's carrier/tempest vs viking/thor however is just not
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On December 12 2012 17:07 dani` wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 16:36 Buchan wrote:
Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked. I've heard Banshees do pretty well against Immortals :-) I actually played a game yesterday against a meching Terran and his army was pretty damn scary. Lots and lots of Thors, a handful of Banshees, some Ravens, and of course Tanks and Hellions. Stalkers die so fast, that I feel it really opens up options to look at massing more Banshees and reign supreme when the Stalkers are down. I did win in the end because I identified Goody style early on due to fast Siege Tech + 2nd CC, so I just went 3rd Nexus / double Forge straight of the bat into relatively quick 5 base and massed Carriers while constantly harassing him on 100 workers for a long time but still, I would not say mech is dead. Au contraire, my friend. With the combined upgrades it has a lot of potential imo. My harassment was not very successful (dmg wise, it did buy me plenty of time though) as he had a lot of missile turrets and sensor towers so he was pretty impervious on 3 base while building his death ball. If the guy had the balls to just push out around 140 supply I would probably roll over and die. It would have also helped him if he would try some harassment of his own, he definitely could have done more. I'm at 233 points master league in HotS atm for your reference. My resources lost was waaaaaay higher than his btw, at least before the final battle where my Carriers had a nice high ground position and owned him pretty hard.
It was me, and it was probably the worst game i played in hots..failed my opening,handled your harass really badly, and no scouting at all... i know i could have won but i played awfully , without any real focus 
your play was interesting and that game could have been great with me a bit focused
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On December 12 2012 17:19 Markwerf wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 17:07 dani` wrote:On December 12 2012 16:36 Buchan wrote:
Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked. I've heard Banshees do pretty well against Immortals :-) I actually played a game yesterday against a meching Terran and his army was pretty damn scary. Lots and lots of Thors, a handful of Banshees, some Ravens, and of course Tanks and Hellions. Stalkers die so fast, that I feel it really opens up options to look at massing more Banshees and reign supreme when the Stalkers are down. I did win in the end because I identified Goody style early on due to fast Siege Tech + 2nd CC, so I just went 3rd Nexus / double Forge straight of the bat into relatively quick 5 base and massed Carriers while constantly harassing him on 100 workers for a long time but still, I would not say mech is dead. Au contraire, my friend. With the combined upgrades it has a lot of potential imo. My harassment was not very successful (dmg wise, it did buy me plenty of time though) as he had a lot of missile turrets and sensor towers so he was pretty impervious on 3 base while building his death ball. If the guy had the balls to just push out around 140 supply I would probably roll over and die. It would have also helped him if he would try some harassment of his own, he definitely could have done more. I'm at 233 points master league in HotS atm for your reference. My resources lost was waaaaaay higher than his btw, at least before the final battle where my Carriers had a nice high ground position and owned him pretty hard. "mech" can work now but it has little to do with the traditional mech of BW. It's more thor/banshee/hellbat with a few tanks in it. Tanks in itself are just not really interesting to mass against protoss because they are only really effective against stalkers and sentries, a decent protoss will be sure not to continue production in either of those making your tanks if massed just awful. Bio is the far more interesting style in TvP and get's at least a new potential tool in the raven. This new airmech is incredibly boring because it basically consists of some slow a-move units like hellbats, thors and banshee's. What good is it if blizzard get's mech 'working' but it's a stupid version of it that has nothing to do with the BW variant. BW mech has a lot of positional play because it's mostly tanks and has much more action going on with vulture harass and laying mines. SC2 mech has hardly any positional play and no real mines to speak off. BW's goliath vs carrier is also an interesting micro and positional fight, SC2's carrier/tempest vs viking/thor however is just not
I agree. If TvP mech is turtle to 200/200 or/and mass Thor/Hellbat then we might as well not have any mech at all. There's no point in having a new strategy if it's boring as fuck to play and spectate.
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You can probably do it on any map with water features, specifically a sea.
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On December 12 2012 17:52 Sapphire.lux wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 17:19 Markwerf wrote:On December 12 2012 17:07 dani` wrote:On December 12 2012 16:36 Buchan wrote:
Just tried a Mech game vs Protoss.... By the end I lost 38000 to his 22000 resources lost. I had 227 apm he had 96 apm. The problem is that immortals are just wayyy too good against mech. So if they identify your going mech and just make a bunch of immortals you cant do anything. Even if you get decent emp's on the immortals you still get wrecked. I've heard Banshees do pretty well against Immortals :-) I actually played a game yesterday against a meching Terran and his army was pretty damn scary. Lots and lots of Thors, a handful of Banshees, some Ravens, and of course Tanks and Hellions. Stalkers die so fast, that I feel it really opens up options to look at massing more Banshees and reign supreme when the Stalkers are down. I did win in the end because I identified Goody style early on due to fast Siege Tech + 2nd CC, so I just went 3rd Nexus / double Forge straight of the bat into relatively quick 5 base and massed Carriers while constantly harassing him on 100 workers for a long time but still, I would not say mech is dead. Au contraire, my friend. With the combined upgrades it has a lot of potential imo. My harassment was not very successful (dmg wise, it did buy me plenty of time though) as he had a lot of missile turrets and sensor towers so he was pretty impervious on 3 base while building his death ball. If the guy had the balls to just push out around 140 supply I would probably roll over and die. It would have also helped him if he would try some harassment of his own, he definitely could have done more. I'm at 233 points master league in HotS atm for your reference. My resources lost was waaaaaay higher than his btw, at least before the final battle where my Carriers had a nice high ground position and owned him pretty hard. "mech" can work now but it has little to do with the traditional mech of BW. It's more thor/banshee/hellbat with a few tanks in it. Tanks in itself are just not really interesting to mass against protoss because they are only really effective against stalkers and sentries, a decent protoss will be sure not to continue production in either of those making your tanks if massed just awful. Bio is the far more interesting style in TvP and get's at least a new potential tool in the raven. This new airmech is incredibly boring because it basically consists of some slow a-move units like hellbats, thors and banshee's. What good is it if blizzard get's mech 'working' but it's a stupid version of it that has nothing to do with the BW variant. BW mech has a lot of positional play because it's mostly tanks and has much more action going on with vulture harass and laying mines. SC2 mech has hardly any positional play and no real mines to speak off. BW's goliath vs carrier is also an interesting micro and positional fight, SC2's carrier/tempest vs viking/thor however is just not I agree. If TvP mech is turtle to 200/200 or/and mass Thor/Hellbat then we might as well not have any mech at all. There's no point in having a new strategy if it's boring as fuck to play and spectate.
And its not* even working againts any decent P.
fixed :D
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Well issnt mech better than bio against toss air composition?
Bio doesnt get close and storm just kills bio if it tries to get close. Though if you go mech you'll have 3/3 air uppg.
So mech might work if you scout stargate timings before it's to late?
Then again it's harder to go for tempest as a protoss playing against bio than playing against mech.
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On December 12 2012 20:35 A.Alm wrote:
Well issnt mech better than bio against toss air composition?
Bio doesnt get close and storm just kills bio if it tries to get close. Though if you go mech you'll have 3/3 air uppg.
So mech might work if you scout stargate timings before it's to late?
Then again it's harder to go for tempest as a protoss playing against bio than playing against mech.
Bio is bad againts stargate because with Oracle they can buy some time to get Colo/Storm out to deal with it, and with TimeWarp from Oracle you cant attack :D so bio is pretty much useless other than get a good timing attack or just harassment, but you have to switch to air, but air sucks againts tempest. so P is broken in the lategame. As it was always in SC2 history.
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The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game...
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On December 12 2012 21:19 Dvriel wrote:
The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game...
HT+Carrier is actually really good in WoL. And yet, no pros use it - perhaps because it is almost guaranteed to die to early pushes. Have you tried the energy-less Thor? They were terrifying for the time that they existed in WoL.
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On December 12 2012 21:45 Treehead wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 21:19 Dvriel wrote:
The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game... HT+Carrier is actually really good in WoL. And yet, no pros use it - perhaps because it is almost guaranteed to die to early pushes. Have you tried the energy-less Thor? They were terrifying for the time that they existed in WoL.
They are good to the ground, but immortals are good also with 250mm. And Thors are sucking againts P air.
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United States4883 Posts
On December 12 2012 05:50 never_Nal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2012 05:01 Sissors wrote:You can drop with them, but why not just do BFH drops, or 3 BFHs and one widow mine. Honestly the only reason of doing widow mine drops instead of BFH is to irritate him that he has to kill your mine, so needs detection. But if he has a few cannons around expansions that is also gone. The only use of them against toss I have seen is either playing burrowed zergling, anti-oracle, oh-my-god he is playing aggressive and hellions are useless against stalkers, and it can be reasonable to burrow them between your tanks if he blinks on top of them. Honestly the number 1 error i feel I make against toss is making widow mines. Every single time they dissapoint me again. Really? not Viable, weird thing is I play mech on WoL in TvP and works perfectly to be honest, its just a very different style,,positional and tactical game, maybe you should watch and learn from BW this type of play , also you are trying to fix a problem just with widow mines, have you tried less hellbats mor siege tanks?, a much more spread siege line?, or maybe using seeker missels in the mix with a couple of banshees for extra damage?, honestly I find mech the strings composition on the game, even if they mass immortals From your post I get the idea you dont have HotS. HotS is not the same as WoL, it also isnt the same as BW. So it might be better to look at HotS for figuring out how to mech. A widely spread siege line against toss just doesnt work, if you play mech in WoL you should know that. Against zerg you can do it since their main units are melee, so even with a spread out line he gets in range of most tanks when he attacks one. Against terran you can do it since tanks are just good against bio. Toss has quite mobile units with good range and very strong: They will just kill you one tank at a time. Anyway your post shows pretty much the problem, it isnt hard to find counters, it is hard to find gas for them. Ravens should do very nicely to augment a mech army against toss. Of course you also need vikings, banshees apparently (honestly they just die horribly against enemy main army), and ghosts are also always nice. And then you are at my number 2 reason for dying: not enough tanks, too much crap to support the tanks. Finally a second time: WoL != HotS. In WoL I was quite succesfull in mech vs toss (relative to my other matchups obviously). But while mech got a few additions, toss also got some changes which really help them. Their much better air which rapes mech quite badly, their mcore which really hurts mech openings, etc. Most importantly, they now see terrans meching. In WoL all terrans nicely follow the BOs of the pros, and for them bio is the way to go. Which makes sure the toss dont have a clue what to do against mech. In HotS thats not the case, and I cant get mech really to work for me. Now it is just waiting on the moment when toss realise that when they add a few carriers to their tempest balls PDDs become useless. I do have HoTS, and I play mech ass well,honestly mech is just underused and "hard" to understand if you are used to play a Mobile style of army, mech is the strongest composition in the game, Search for Day9 vods where he explains how Liquid.Sea opens into a mech composition, and how you can transition into a really really storng army composition. If you can watch GSL and study some positional and tatcial game I suggest you start followin Ax_Ryung. This terran is amazingly good at position and paitience. Also EG.Demuslim isnt doing bad with mech TvP in HoTS, and the good part he streams all day!!!, really try something different in your play, maybe faster expos, different openings allowing better gas management, research more about this 
Seriously, I encourage everyone to try double reactor factory openings TvP. As long as you identify early pressure and survive your initial expand, you can easily go into double reactor factory and make MASS MASS hellions/mines. I know it sounds silly, but 40 hellions beats most early-game units protoss can have (including blink stalkers) while widow mines can save you from any kind of stargate or 2-base allin play. Seriously, I encourage everyone to try delaying tanks and focusing on mass hellion/mine plays or hellion/banshee harass. It really makes a difference in the midgame when you're actually on equal bases and economy with protoss.
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On December 12 2012 21:19 Dvriel wrote:
The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game...
Everyone I played trying to play mech has had an amazing army and then used it in the dumbest way possible. The last two games I played the terran player pushed out at a totally reasonable time, but then set up their tanks in at the bottom of a ramp(on CK, right outside my natural) or in the middle no where. Both players even had a starport with a tech lab, but never got a single raven to zone out my obs with their range 10 thors. I seriously feel that every mech player wants me to have unlimited information on when they are sieged and the cleanest engagment possible.
I really think people need to keep trying mech to make it work. It is not a forgiving style and one bad engagment will instantly loses you the game. However, LiquidSea made it work against Naniwa in WoL, with far fewer tools. I have to beleive that a terran play who put in the time could make it work against a scrub like me.
Edit: I am with SC2John above and that rushing to tanks will get you in trouble. Hellions and widow mines are far scarier in the early game and feel better(or worse from my side) against protoss. The addition of tanks should be a slow build up, like an ever building tidal wave. You can't rush a tidal wave or it will break early.
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United Kingdom12022 Posts
On December 13 2012 03:03 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2012 21:19 Dvriel wrote:
The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game... Everyone I played trying to play mech has had an amazing army and then used it in the dumbest way possible. The last two games I played the terran player pushed out at a totally reasonable time, but then set up their tanks in at the bottom of a ramp(on CK, right outside my natural) or in the middle no where. Both players even had a starport with a tech lab, but never got a single raven to zone out my obs with their range 10 thors. I seriously feel that every mech player wants me to have unlimited information on when they are sieged and the cleanest engagment possible. I really think people need to keep trying mech to make it work. It is not a forgiving style and one bad engagment will instantly loses you the game. However, LiquidSea made it work against Naniwa in WoL, with far fewer tools. I have to beleive that a terran play who put in the time could make it work against a scrub like me. Edit: I am with SC2John above and that rushing to tanks will get you in trouble. Hellions and widow mines are far scarier in the early game and feel better(or worse from my side) against protoss. The addition of tanks should be a slow build up, like an ever building tidal wave. You can't rush a tidal wave or it will break early.
To be fair Naniwa only lost to Sea because he thought Sea was playing Bio.
Stalker/Collosus is a terrible composition to go against tanks. It just gets demolished :p
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On December 13 2012 03:21 Qikz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2012 03:03 Plansix wrote:On December 12 2012 21:19 Dvriel wrote:
The Combo HT+Tempest+Carrier is now unstoppable.Bio still works decently,but only because the P doesnt make SG and no oracles.The moment they do this in Late game we are even worse than in WoL.Anyways is a BETA and i expect this week to see another BETA patch with something improving mech.Its all about that we want to go mech using tanks,and now they are totally out of the game... Everyone I played trying to play mech has had an amazing army and then used it in the dumbest way possible. The last two games I played the terran player pushed out at a totally reasonable time, but then set up their tanks in at the bottom of a ramp(on CK, right outside my natural) or in the middle no where. Both players even had a starport with a tech lab, but never got a single raven to zone out my obs with their range 10 thors. I seriously feel that every mech player wants me to have unlimited information on when they are sieged and the cleanest engagment possible. I really think people need to keep trying mech to make it work. It is not a forgiving style and one bad engagment will instantly loses you the game. However, LiquidSea made it work against Naniwa in WoL, with far fewer tools. I have to beleive that a terran play who put in the time could make it work against a scrub like me. Edit: I am with SC2John above and that rushing to tanks will get you in trouble. Hellions and widow mines are far scarier in the early game and feel better(or worse from my side) against protoss. The addition of tanks should be a slow build up, like an ever building tidal wave. You can't rush a tidal wave or it will break early. To be fair Naniwa only lost to Sea because he thought Sea was playing Bio. Stalker/Collosus is a terrible composition to go against tanks. It just gets demolished :p
It is also because Sea masterfully denied information for most of the match. He got a very early raven to deny Naniwa's obs, which is incredibly underrated by every terran I talk to. It is really hard to engage or even build a good composition against a terran that is aggressively denying scouting. It really seems like one of the keys to mech is making sure the protoss knows as little as possible.
Even with that, Naniwa could have won that match, but Sea set up his tanks is a perfect position to deny a reasonable engagement. To many players I play against just set up the tanks in the most terrible place possible and assume that the power of mech will save them. With all the talk about positional play, I would hope someone would think about where they position those tanks.
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New sentries can hallu,so you got your scout.No need of robo
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United Arab Emirates439 Posts
On December 13 2012 03:59 Dvriel wrote:
New sentries can hallu,so you got your scout.No need of robo
Yes it's impossible to deny scouting if the Protoss wants it now. A raven+viking isn't even going to deny an Obs if the Protoss is careful, but with hallucinate you have no chance. Not to mention they can always go in with early MSC if they seriously needed scouting fast. Anyways, I'm looking forward to the MSC/Blink nerf. Blink has always been one of the most severe restrictions on what Mech openings are and aren't solid. The ability to ignore all terrain/sim city advantages seriously hurts Mech early on.
(FYI: There was a blue post they are looking into how to nerf Blink+MSC, that's what I'm referring to)
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EPT
