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On November 22 2016 06:46 JimmiC wrote:
Actually you have been anything but clear and kept changing your opinion or moving the target, while claiming your never have, then later sorta saying you did. I am trying to pin down your opinion that TRoss should have known better and was at fault. But apparently that is impossible.
1) if the clock was not supposed to be 2.4 , but 3+ seconds this is an entirely different discussion. and the Raptors were robbed before the play started by the officials who should've had the correct time on the clock rather than 2.4 seconds.
part (b).
"fault" ? i've never said anything about blaming any single player. my interest is in assessing whether or not the Raptors were "robbed" by the referees.
when Ross looks at the clock he sees 1 second from a crouched position with a defender on top of him with his arms up. he should've seen a lower # and not 1.0 or 0.9. If that # is 0.2 or lower the game is over. if that # is 0.6 or higher the Raptors got robbed. if the clock said 0.3 he must from a crouched position put up a very rushed shot and a defender on him with his arms up and he has almost no chance of hitting it. if the clock is 0.4 its less rushed but still very, very hard to hit. Ross takes about 0.55 seconds to execute a clean 3 point stroke.
from the replay i think Ross should've seen 0.3 seconds on the clock. He'll miss a circus shot if it does not get blocked and the game is over.
none my previous comments related to anything being "Terrence Ross fault". that's ur issue.. not mine.
however, i will now provide my judgement of Ross in this single individual play
... he was placed 30+ feet from the hoop on a deflected pass with ~2 seconds left and a defender on him. i do not expect him to hit the shot. if he hits it my opinion of him goes up 0.1%. if he misses it my opinion of him lowers by 0.0000000001%
the article i linked along with the replay pretty much reflects what i've stated here.
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let's say ross should know that the ball was tipped by cousins and the clock should be running, how would ross know at the pressure of the moment that the clock started late? he impossibly can't make a conclusion based on looking at the shot clock 'hmmm boogie tipped the ball but the clock is running .5 late'. he wasnt looking at the clock when the ball got tipped. after he got the ball was when he looked at the clocked and it was running. he couldnt know it started late.
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On November 22 2016 07:59 icystorage wrote:
let's say ross should know that the ball was tipped by cousins and the clock should be running, how would ross know at the pressure of the moment that the clock started late? he impossibly can't make a conclusion based on looking at the shot clock 'hmmm boogie tipped the ball but the clock is running .5 late'. he wasnt looking at the clock when the ball got tipped. after he got the ball was when he looked at the clocked and it was running. he couldnt know it started late.
before the play begins its up to Ross to know there is 2.4 seconds left in the game. while he is gathering the ball and moving around he plays under the knowledge that time is short and he can't stare at the clock while dribbling the ball.
if he is going by his own internal thinking of what 2.4 seconds is then doing his standard 3 point stroke is a mistake because the shot is late. now its a mistake by only tenths of second. but its late. and the game is over.
if he is going by what he sees on the clock at the time he turns to look at the basket he has ~0.3 seconds to heave a desperation shot. and if that ~0.3 is really 0.2 the game is over because of the position of the defender.
the percentage chance of Ross hitting a long 3 with ~0.3 seconds left in a crouched position with a defender on him is the percentage teh Raptors were "robbed by the referees".... and its pretty low.
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On November 22 2016 08:15 JimmiC wrote:
The chance of him making the shot he did was pretty low and yet he did it. He should have been given the opportunity to do it. At worst with a clock error they should replay. It also was not the only clock error in the game, should they review the entire game to see if perhaps there should be a bunch more seconds on the clock? Considering with the help of replay and slow motion no one conclusively will say if it was .3 secs, .5 secs or .7 secs that the clock should have changed. It is mind boggling that you think in the heat of the action TRoss should have known this and adjusted himself like .3 seconds or something.
i've already said most of this stuff. and if they replay it chances are the Raptors miss. And if they tie it they are only going into OT its not a win. so over all the referees robbed the Raptors in a very low % had everything run perfectly.
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awesome. Let's look back at a post i made very early on in this discussion.
On November 21 2016 22:20 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
the 1 thing never provided is a timer tracking AFTER Cousins tips it and BEFORE Ross collects the ball. If that time is less than 0.5 seconds THEN the Raptors got robbed. However, the geniuses at SportsNet with their multibillion dollar budgets have yet to make such an advanced analysis happen.
looked to me like the right call was made... even watching the live game i thought Ross took a long time.
it looked to me like it was 0.6 or 0.7
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the referees claim another second came off the clock before Cousins called a TO. Making 2.4 correct. None of this matters though because according to you only .4 seconds occurred between the tip and the clock starting. So the ball leaves Ross's hands at 0.1 or 1.1 the game still goes to overtime.
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i looked at it you are right  it wasnt a direct TO call after the rebound also there's a 2nd TO after the first TO's inbound
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On November 22 2016 08:21 icystorage wrote:
the ball traveled .4 seconds before ross got it and after cousins tipped it.
looks like the NBA disagrees with the 0.4 second theory. looks their claim is the time was 0.6 seconds.
http://global.nba.com/news/shootaround-nov-21-raptors-still-reeling-after-finish-to-game-in-sacramento/?cid=trafficdriver:nbacom:homepage
"crew chief Callahan said the replay revealed there was 2.5 seconds from the time Cousins tipped the ball to when Ross made the shot. There was 2.4 seconds left on the clock when the play began but the arena clock was not started when Cousins tipped it."
which again means Ross must rush a 30 foot shot with a guy right on top of him with his arms up while Ross is in a crouched position. the probability of Ross hitting that shot with 0.3 rather than 0.9 on the clock is really low. further, all this does is take the game to overtime.
like i said before they got "robbed" by the refs by the exact percentage of times Ross hits a rushed shot and the Raptors turn the tie game into an overtime win. So I dunno.. that is a bout a 5% or less robbery.
On November 22 2016 08:21 JimmiC wrote:
No you have said he should have adjusted regardless of what was on the clock.
i provided a multi-case scenario which describes what happens when Ross chooses to look at the clock. AND what happens if Ross chooses to ignore the clock entirely and go on instinct. I cover both cases because my goal is to assess if the Raptors got robbed. Ross's value as a player remains virtually unchanged because this is 1 play in a very unusual set of circumstances. Ross's value as a player is an accumulation of 1000s or 10000s or plays.
another option might be to restart the play at 2.4 seconds and do it all over again? is that permitted in the NBA rules when the clock messes up? this scenario presents long odds against the Raptors as well.
On November 22 2016 02:41 JimmiC wrote:
So he knows the clock is running and should have reacted .5 secs faster... or .7 secs faster... or he did it right and they made the mistake. Again your points make no sense its just you will never ever admit your wrong. its hilarious.
Ross stated after the game he saw Cousins deflect the ball, therefore, Ross knows the clock starts at that point. Ross is staring at the ball and not the clock.
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Wooooooo Sixers back to back.
Never expected the Process to put up these numbers in such limited minutes.
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The NBA released the video showing the time delay between Cousins deflection and the clock starting. which again is what i asked for right from the start. its 0.67 seconds.
0.67 seconds.. . which gives Ross from 0.23 to 0.33 seconds to hit his shot depending on whether he looks at the clock with 1.0 or 0.9 seconds. ... so it came pretty close to the ~0.3 i thought i saw watching from my couch.
Griffin and JV hugging it out. This is what you get when you are both in a union as strong as the NBAPA.
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2 minute penalty to the Clippers for too many men on the ice.
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Chris Paul is the best player in the league
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its not a league its an association
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EPT
