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IRL_Sinister
Ireland621 Posts
On May 27 2013 01:49 ToT)OjKa( wrote: Isn't toning up more a question of losing body fat %? Although you're probably doing that when you're working out so nevermind. No. I have an extremely low body fat % and a high metabolism. It's actually quite hard to put on weight (not that I want to) which, as a result, hunders trying to get "lean" or bulking to get more toned. | ||
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decafchicken
United States20010 Posts
On May 29 2013 03:11 IRL_Sinister wrote: No. I have an extremely low body fat % and a high metabolism. It's actually quite hard to put on weight (not that I want to) which, as a result, hunders trying to get "lean" or bulking to get more toned. Try tracking your actual calories for a week on something like fitday.com and you'd be surprised. | ||
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Xialos
Canada508 Posts
On May 26 2013 03:17 dudeman001 wrote: Are there good quality foods that have the opposite effect and increase testosterone? Meat/steak and chocolate maybe? Soy and Green vegetables are for females, don't eat that imo =] | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On May 29 2013 03:11 IRL_Sinister wrote: No. I have an extremely low body fat % and a high metabolism. It's actually quite hard to put on weight (not that I want to) which, as a result, hunders trying to get "lean" or bulking to get more toned. No you don't, you're just.... me. And every other skinny guy in te history of the gym. Eat more protein, get on a strength routine, count your calories, you'll be surprised how quickly it comes together. On May 29 2013 07:06 Xialos wrote: Meat/steak and chocolate maybe? Soy and Green vegetables are for females, don't eat that imo =] Nothing wrong with vegetables. Stay away from soy. Get plenty of saturated fats (because that's what testosterone is made out of) do a full-body workout routine, and make sure you get 9 hours/night of sleep. If you're zinc deficient, take a supplement. If you're already doing all these things, then the only other thing proven to work is turning yourself into a pincushion, which is outside the realm of experience of anyone here AFAIK. | ||
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
Steroid compounds are made out of ring structured molecules... BUt it's true eating saturated fats does increase testosterone. So drink up your whole milk. Sleep a lot, magnesium, zinc, vitamin D, etc. | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On May 31 2013 21:56 eshlow wrote: Test isn't really made out of saturated fats... :p Steroid compounds are made out of ring structured molecules... BUt it's true eating saturated fats does increase testosterone. So drink up your whole milk. Sleep a lot, magnesium, zinc, vitamin D, etc. I knew that. That's Biology 101 =(. I'm blaming it on summer. advice stands, though. | ||
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Jonoman92
United States9103 Posts
On May 29 2013 05:56 decafchicken wrote: Try tracking your actual calories for a week on something like fitday.com and you'd be surprised. That site is kinda irritating. Decided to register (it's hard for me to track calories though, I mean I just made salsa chicken in slow cooker w/ 4 ck breast and when I eat it I don't know exactly how much I'm eating.) But I guess I could get a pretty accurate guess. It won't let me have a target weight higher than my current weight t.t Society.... | ||
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DrCooper
Germany261 Posts
Pen and paper>fitness apps! :D | ||
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Jonoman92
United States9103 Posts
On June 02 2013 19:45 DrCooper wrote: I don't know what you Americans all have with your fitness apps. Pen and paper>fitness apps! :D Yeah I think you're right. Much more accurate since I know my bread is actual X number of calories per slice or w/e. Only hard part is things like deli meat since I have no clue how much I eat in a portion really. Guess I can take the 3/4 lb I buy and figure out how many sandwiches that lasts me. | ||
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FlyingBeer
United States262 Posts
No mention of importance of living an active lifestyle + Show Spoiler + I'd say this is a rather significant omission. In terms of calories burned, Walking > Standing Up > Sitting > Sleeping The difference between somebody who works a desk job and say, a waiter, in terms of calories burned while they're at work is around 600 calories/day. The best weight loss trick out there is to avoid sitting down. No mention of nutrient density of foods + Show Spoiler + You kind of touch on caloric density although I don't see you specifically use the words. But the second biggest diet target is nutrient density. Eating nutrient dense foods like vegetables is critical for feeling full faster and for getting the nutrients your body needs without the use of supplements. http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/82/4/721.full No mention of carb cycling + Show Spoiler + This can be unhealthy if taken to an extreme, so I can understand why it might not have been included, but it's the standard method for boxers, wrestlers, and powerlifters to make weight without losing muscle mass, and is the best way to reduce body fat percentage into the single digits. The supplement section should be removed or altered + Show Spoiler + Taking supplements is a major decision, and there's not enough information here for people to make informed decisions. In the US at least, and many other countries, the supplement industry is almost completely unregulated, and many of the ones available on shelves are dangerous for long-term health. Taking any kind of supplements should only be done cautiously and with careful study of both the nutrients and the manufacturer. No mention of skeletal muscle fiber types + Show Spoiler + Type I, Type IIa, Type IIb should all be discussed. The 5-8 rep count recommendation is wrong + Show Spoiler + The correct rep count for increasing type IIb muscle fibers is 1-6 reps. These are best for explosive quickness. 8 reps is for building type IIa muscle fibers, which is what body builders use. This is so they can have large flashy muscles. This is also where the 4 seconds up, 2 seconds down recommendation comes from if you've heard that anywhere. It's for body builders. The different muscle fibers is the reason bodybuilders look bigger even though power lifters are stronger. 15+ is for increasing type I muscle fibers. http://www.weightrainer.net/training/reps.html Intermittent fasting has not been firmly established as healthy + Show Spoiler + This is a topic area that needs a lot more research especially when you consider the number of different variations of intermittent fasting. Here is a well-done negative opinion on IF: http://www.alanaragon.com/an-objective-look-at-intermittent-fasting.html And here is a well-done positive opinion: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-questions-answers/#axzz2V7oEt5gs I believe the negative opinion is probably closer to general scientific consensus. Mark's blog is great because of it's ridiculous detail, but he also has a lot of heterodox opinions, which don't reflect current consensus. High intensity circuit training is superior to low rep weight training for weight loss + Show Spoiler + Over the short term, circuit training is far and away better. Over the long term, IMO, circuit training is still better, but a combined approach is better than either individually. There are some sources who believe power lifting is superior long-term because of a lot of complicated factors. So, why is circuit training better for burning fat? There's a simple equation for this. number of reps per set x lbs lifted per rep / number of minutes between sets = amount of work per minute So, if I'm doing 5 reps at 200 lbs over 15 seconds and then resting for 75 seconds between, then the equation looks like this: 5 x 200 / 1.5 (15s+75s) = 666 lbs/min If, however, I'm doing 20 reps at 100 lbs over 45 seconds, and then resting for only 15 seconds, my equation looks like this: 20 x 100 / 1 (45s+15s) = 2000 lbs/min Circuit trainers are able to do this because they don't worry as much about the amount of weight they're lifting, so often only need 1 or 2 weight amounts for their entire workout. They simply increase the explosiveness of each rep and number of reps if they find the weight is too low. This works as long as they still remember to pause briefly between each rep, so they don't use momentum to help them with the next rep. A typical circuit trainer might do 3 circuits of 8 exercises per circuit with 1 minute rest between each circuit. That's 48,000 lbs of work in 26 minutes. The power lifter would have to work out for over an hour to get the same results. This is the benefit of targeting Type I muscle fibers instead of Type IIb muscle fibers. More stamina = more work Long term, there is a slight benefit to power lifting as a supplement to circuit training for weight loss. This allows you to build up type IIb muscle in addition to building type I muscles from circuit training. This will slightly increase your BMR (basal metabolic rate) leading to slightly higher caloric burn throughout the day. There are also a bunch of other factors which have led some to believe power lifting is superior for weight loss long-term, but that gets into rather complicated territory. Circuit training is the reason organizations like CrossFit work so damn well at getting you ridiculously fit while only requiring 15 minutes of your time 3 days a week. It's also the P90X method. Overall, stay away from any nutrition sources meant for popular consumption like Men's Health, Shape, etc. Sometimes they're accurate; sometimes they're making controversial claims to surprise people and sell more books/magazines. Primarily either read papers in scientific journals or sources that reference studies from scientific journals; preferably ones that are peer-reviewed. Hope that helps. | ||
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decafchicken
United States20010 Posts
-nutrient density is covered in point #2 pretty explicitly in the OP -carb cycling isnt here but often discussed and used by members here in the health and fitness thread -all the supplements that are recommended here are completely safe and can easily be sourced from nih.gov like vitamins, fish oil, creatine, etc. -fiber types and rep ranges - again, covered in the health and fitness thread. this thread is mostly for nutrition -Circuit training and weight training are both good for weight loss, but again all comes down to cal in vs cal out and how you want to recompose your body. Most of your points are valid but just kind of nit-picking, take a look around more of the forum there's a lot of great info especially in the stickies. Welcome! | ||
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FlyingBeer
United States262 Posts
On June 03 2013 14:58 decafchicken wrote: -Active lifestyle being good for you is kind of a given here, it's the health and fitness forum. Life style and such is covered more often in the h&f thread -nutrient density is covered in point #2 pretty explicitly in the OP -carb cycling isnt here but often discussed and used by members here in the health and fitness thread -all the supplements that are recommended here are completely safe and can easily be sourced from nih.gov like vitamins, fish oil, creatine, etc. -fiber types and rep ranges - again, covered in the health and fitness thread. this thread is mostly for nutrition -Circuit training and weight training are both good for weight loss, but again all comes down to cal in vs cal out and how you want to recompose your body. Most of your points are valid but just kind of nit-picking, take a look around more of the forum there's a lot of great info especially in the stickies. Welcome! Woops on the nutrient density part, but no, fiber types are not covered in either of the articles. As for active lifestyle, to me, it's the first thing you should recommend to anybody, and I'm guessing most people aren't aware of it because they're getting their advice from fitness instructors who are trying to sell them exercise videos. I just checked the training recommendations thread, and it makes the exact same mistake: "1. High repetitions works endurance. It does not put on muscle mass. Strike one. 2. High repetitions does not burn much fat. Just like cardio doesn't. Strike two. 3. There is no such thing as spot reduction. That is to say that doing endless amounts of situps does not make your abs more defined." That is simply false. High repetitions do build muscle and do burn fat. It also repeats the 5-8 rep error in another section of the post. And I don't consider that nitpicking. Especially since low rep / high weight is more likely to lead to injury if you have improper form. | ||
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Schwopzi
Netherlands954 Posts
On June 03 2013 15:52 FlyingBeer wrote: Woops on the nutrient density part, but no, fiber types are not covered in either of the articles. As for active lifestyle, to me, it's the first thing you should recommend to anybody, and I'm guessing most people aren't aware of it because they're getting their advice from fitness instructors who are trying to sell them exercise videos. I just checked the training recommendations thread, and it makes the exact same mistake: "1. High repetitions works endurance. It does not put on muscle mass. Strike one. 2. High repetitions does not burn much fat. Just like cardio doesn't. Strike two. 3. There is no such thing as spot reduction. That is to say that doing endless amounts of situps does not make your abs more defined." That is simply false. High repetitions do build muscle and do burn fat. It also repeats the 5-8 rep error in another section of the post. And I don't consider that nitpicking. Especially since low rep / high weight is more likely to lead to injury if you have improper form. Making a whole section about active lifestyle in the nutrition topic seems a bit redundant. Spot reduction is trying to burn specific fat by stimulating the muscles in that area; something that doesn't happen. If you want to burn belly fat you have to just burn fat, at least that's how I read that sentence and if read like that it's true. Though the last bit is kinda false 'cus ofc you can make your abs more defined by training them when low fat. Rep range is a valid point though. 1-5 strength, 8-10 pump (btw bodybuilders also build strength first with low rep count compound exercises). Rep range is way too goal & current state of individual dependant to just flat out say "this is the best for everyone" | ||
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Vitruvian
United States168 Posts
On June 03 2013 15:52 FlyingBeer wrote: Woops on the nutrient density part, but no, fiber types are not covered in either of the articles. As for active lifestyle, to me, it's the first thing you should recommend to anybody, and I'm guessing most people aren't aware of it because they're getting their advice from fitness instructors who are trying to sell them exercise videos. I just checked the training recommendations thread, and it makes the exact same mistake: "1. High repetitions works endurance. It does not put on muscle mass. Strike one. 2. High repetitions does not burn much fat. Just like cardio doesn't. Strike two. 3. There is no such thing as spot reduction. That is to say that doing endless amounts of situps does not make your abs more defined." That is simply false. High repetitions do build muscle and do burn fat. It also repeats the 5-8 rep error in another section of the post. And I don't consider that nitpicking. Especially since low rep / high weight is more likely to lead to injury if you have improper form. - For novice-state trainees (i.e. people with little to no lifting background,) high repetitions will, of course, build muscle. However, this will not continue to be the case long-term. - It's a bit of a head-scratcher that your argument against the statement "High repetitions do not burn much fat" is "High repetitions do burn fat." - If you're going to tailor your recommendations to the assumption that people are going to have improper form, you might as well recommend that people simply not train; after all, any physical activity executed poorly is likely to lead to injury. | ||
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
First, The point of the 5-8 range is to make a good compromise for strength + hypertrophy for beginners. That's why almost every beginner routine is between 5-8 reps: 1. if your main goal is to build bigger muscles you also need to train strength at the beginning because heavy weights will lead to better hypertrophy down the road as an intermediate/advanced trainee when you start implementing more isolation exercises. 2. If your main goal is strength, having more muscle CSA is going to increase your potential for strength. Unless you are in an explicit weight class sport where you need to keep muscle down it's a good recommendation. 5-8 reps is a good compromise between both of these goals that lead to better progress down the road. Secondly, lifting weights provides a better stimulus for muscle mass. The goal of most people looking to lose weights is to LOOK GOOD. Therefore, it's better to get muscle mass on people trying to lose weight anyway with a caloric deficit. That's why weights are recommended over HIIT and endurance training for people looking to lose weight. So they won't be skinny or skinny fat after losing weight and it generally gets them to their goal(s) faster. I'm pretty sure I said in the stickies that supplements are meant to SUPPLEMENT. Not be a major part of your diet. The rest is either nitpicking or too advanced for beginners. There's a reason why it's called the general nutrition/training/TL H&F thread..... if you want to discuss more advanced concepts then sure but it's not required in the OP. It will just confuse beginners. | ||
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sc_a.M
420 Posts
Yes I know in theory this question was answered in the op, but I either can't cook or can't afford (or both) the meals in op. | ||
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mordek
United States12704 Posts
When I was trying to bulk and not eat crappy on the cheap I ate: Eggs Chicken Breast Rice Oats Ground beef Peanut butter Whole milk Then I tried to eat any fresh vegetables/fruit the budget could afford. | ||
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eLyx
Germany54 Posts
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Komei
50 Posts
-Weight differences from day to day don't mean anything (just water weight variations) -If you eat more calories than you burn you gain that as fat, not muscle -For muscle, lift heavy weights -For heath, eat healthy | ||
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Cynry
810 Posts
Some context : used to be a full time geek, not much sports, eating too few, very bad body awareness and position when playing (think L from death note). Now that I've finally got out of this and that I'm now in charge of my food, I have made great progress. I am recovering from wrist injury right now, but soon I'll be able to spend a lot of time exercising with martial arts in mind. Last part is important, because I am not looking to gain muscles or look good or whatever, it is more a side effect for my goal. Basically I want a "solid" body to be able to train hard and for a long time without injury. I think I already have a good muscle quality, my issue lies in the poor condition my years of geek have left my ligaments and tendons in. So my question is, is there anything that can be done to help achieve that goal food wise ? It's not the place for training question and I already know the basics about that, which are be slow and steady. Just want to know if I can eek out a bit more out of my food. Thanks ! Edit : well, just read some infos from eatmovewhatever.com and it seems that my biggest issue is posture. So, I guess my question still stands, but at least I know where the pain and overall weak feelings I get from tendons and ligaments come from. I suck ass at using my body. | ||
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