[WCS] Winter 2019 - NA Gauntlet Match

On April 07 2019 01:04 Durnuu wrote:
Quality stream

On April 07 2019 02:57 Toua wrote:
Where is this being played?

On April 07 2019 03:06 Cyro wrote:
What is Masa doing here? Game 2 was really weird and then he killed one of his own marines 3 mins into the third game

On April 07 2019 03:40 argonautdice wrote:
Anyone know why aligulac has been Bad Gatewaying way more often recently?

On April 07 2019 03:54 Waxangel wrote:
As a wise man once said, "li pay man add oil！"

On April 07 2019 05:11 Waxangel wrote:
Do you think China will still save StarCraft II if it's discovered that Neeb is 1/32nd Chinese?

On April 07 2019 06:20 sudete wrote:
While I appreciate the idea of having more fun stuff between games, having an FFA between the semi and the final feels like a bit of an unnecessary speed-bump in a tourney with no live audience

On April 07 2019 07:13 Achamian wrote:
Worst type of map to play a FFA on. And the allied stuff was nonsense. I think the winner here was ZG holding the cast together, allowing InControl to put in some highlights.

On April 07 2019 07:27 jarodtou wrote:
finally, Neeb vs Scarlet.
But please, take this as a positive feedback and don`t hate on me, no more FFA, waste of time, better do extended players interview with those guys, or show miniclips with the road of the players, or even preregistered interview with players/casters.
Also, the casting lineup is just so so bad compared to other events. All of these guys are trying hard, but they are second level commentators on a top level event.. which is WCS. they are only good in combination with a good caster. Incontrol is the funny guy, he is a great host, and a good co-host, but I really feel we did not have any main casters on any of the games and this is a big letdown.
Sincerely, I will much rather watch any proplayer speak then these guys. Ravi and Nate and Jessica are nice guys, but far from commentators which can be "main", which can cheer up the games and have good background history about the players (like Rotti has, for example).

Hope next time will be better and hope nobody gets offended.

On April 07 2019 07:13 Achamian wrote:
Worst type of map to play a FFA on. And the allied stuff was nonsense. I think the winner here was ZG holding the cast together, allowing InControl to put in some highlights.

On April 07 2019 07:46 Boggyb wrote:
They need to delete Zerg if Scarlett wins this.

On April 07 2019 07:50 stilt wrote:
Well, placing the hatch so close was probably a bad idea, I mean, he immediatly scouts it, the hatch was at 20%...

On April 07 2019 07:57 Boggyb wrote:
I just had a terrible thought. WCS Winter and the lack of depth to the NA scene means that Scarlett has a HUGE advantage when it comes to qualifying for the next WCS Global Finals.

On April 07 2019 07:52 ZigguratOfUr wrote:


He was gonna scout no natural and know that the hatch was somewhere anyhow, and if you place it too far your spines take forever before they actually do anything.

On April 07 2019 08:07 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:

He kind of had to do something

On April 07 2019 08:07 Boggyb wrote:
This game is why when Zerg players act like there is some major trade off between making army units and workers, I scoff. Scarlett invested so many resources to kill Neeb's 3rd but then immediately jumped up to 70 workers (she was even with him for awhile) and suffered no lag to her macro.

On April 07 2019 08:07 Boggyb wrote:
This game is why when Zerg players act like there is some major trade off between making army units and workers, I scoff. Scarlett invested so many resources to kill Neeb's 3rd but then immediately jumped up to 70 workers (she was even with him for awhile) and suffered no lag to her macro.

On April 07 2019 08:27 Boggyb wrote:
Are the adepts blowing up?

On April 07 2019 08:27 Boggyb wrote:
Are the adepts blowing up?

On April 07 2019 08:31 sudete wrote:
Masa now -38 against Neeb, Scarlett goes to -20

Also, it's quite amazing that this is a premier tournament

On April 07 2019 08:34 Nakajin wrote:


Lol those number are amazing

On April 07 2019 08:38 Boggyb wrote:

Audience cheering doesn't make awful games into passable ones.

On April 07 2019 08:38 Xain0n wrote:
I can't say I am disappointed but I'd have loved for Scarlett to win WCS once.

On April 07 2019 08:38 Solar424 wrote:

None of the events in the LA studio have an audience, including Blizzcon, which is a shame. I remember the ESL studio in Germany always had a crowd for WCS EU back in 2013-14.

On April 07 2019 08:35 swarminfestor wrote:
Boring series after all without audiences' cheer.
I hope production could do something to bolster up the scene next time.

On April 07 2019 08:46 Die4Ever wrote:

they should add a fake cheer-track! /s

this format sucks though, they could've at least had AM and EU meet for the playoffs bracket, the player pool is way too weak when split up like this

On April 07 2019 08:38 Xain0n wrote:
I can't say I am disappointed but I'd have loved for Scarlett to win WCS once.

On April 07 2019 08:50 yht9657 wrote:

EU is actually fine, the problem is NA doesn't have any real competitors besides the Neeb/Scarlett/Special trio, and one of them bombing out of group stage made things even worse.

On April 07 2019 08:52 William paradise wrote:

agree with that i just dont see how the players themselves make up the skill difference though i mean how many years have the Koreans dominated. i just look to the future of the eu and na sc scene and see it dying off in the very near future. there no new young players coming up Scarlett and neeb are getting older special didnt even make it, and who beside serral in Europe can truly compete with the best in the world. it looks bleak.

On April 07 2019 08:53 AzAlexZ wrote:

LOL, the prediction

On April 07 2019 08:55 Die4Ever wrote:

"i just look to the future of the eu and na sc scene and see it dying off in the very near future. there no new young players coming up"

literally the same thing in Korea, when's the last time Korea got a decent new player? except they have forced military service, so half the GSL is gonna disappear in the next year or so, and the other half not long after

EU and AM might end up both being stronger than Korea in a few years

On April 07 2019 08:58 AzAlexZ wrote:

I meant the map score prediction, this could have been 4-1 or 4-3 if Scarlett played worse/better in one (more) game

On April 07 2019 08:52 William paradise wrote:

agree with that i just dont see how the players themselves make up the skill difference though i mean how many years have the Koreans dominated. i just look to the future of the eu and na sc scene and see it dying off in the very near future. there no new young players coming up Scarlett and neeb are getting older special didnt even make it, and who beside serral in Europe can truly compete with the best in the world. it looks bleak.

On April 07 2019 09:02 Wombat_NI wrote:

You never know where the next person to burst out will happen. Serral is no prodigy phenomenon, he gradually improved over years and years in the EU scene.

I took a break from SC2 because burnout and whatnot, when I left Serral was a mid tier EU player, when I came back he was not just the dominant foreigner but was able to consistently beat S class Koreans as well.

Neeb had just switched to Protoss as well, and look how that’s gone for him. I never could have predicted how good he would get, I doubt anyone did at the time.

Maybe there’s new talent that’ll come in, or maybe a mid-tier pro will push on and gradually improve and surprise us.

As someone else mentioned I would love to see some kind of playoff tournament between the top finishers in EU and NA for sure.

On April 07 2019 09:05 Wombat_NI wrote:
SC2’s had its sizeable niche as an eSport for quite some time and it still hasn’t fallen off a cliff despite ‘dedgame’ for years and years.

My main concern for its competitive future is Blizzard itself, considering they bankroll the WCS circuit, and if they’ll be allowed to keep doing it in perpetuity.

On April 07 2019 09:09 William paradise wrote:

but that was one time if you were betting right now would you bet that a Korean would win yet another world title or a non Korean theres no depth i just dont see it thats just my opinion i think they went about the whole esport the wrong way they should have structured it after tennis or golf have 4 majors and some minors in between anyone can compete no region lock bs but whats done is done.

On April 07 2019 09:17 Wombat_NI wrote:

Well do you want non-Koreans to be competitive or do you not?

If you don’t give Europeans or NA players anything they can realistically even get in the money in, never mind win, that gap just isn’t going to be closed at all.

It’s not quite the same now depth wise, I’d say the period when the Kespa players got good at SC2, and lots of notable Korean mainstays hadn’t retired, say of the top 50 players, 45+ would have been Korean, or something in that ballpark.

I do like the idea of having more open and regular tournaments of high prestige like the ‘grand slams’ in tennis to get a better idea of who the best in the scene are over a year.

On April 07 2019 09:17 Wombat_NI wrote:

Well do you want non-Koreans to be competitive or do you not?

If you don’t give Europeans or NA players anything they can realistically even get in the money in, never mind win, that gap just isn’t going to be closed at all.

It’s not quite the same now depth wise, I’d say the period when the Kespa players got good at SC2, and lots of notable Korean mainstays hadn’t retired, say of the top 50 players, 45+ would have been Korean, or something in that ballpark.

I do like the idea of having more open and regular tournaments of high prestige like the ‘grand slams’ in tennis to get a better idea of who the best in the scene are over a year.

On April 07 2019 09:22 Parrek wrote:


What are you guys talking about that EU and NA have no new blood? Showtime, Serral, Reynor, Elazer, Drogo, Neeb, HateMe, HeroMarine, DnS, Time and definitely a few more are all new blood. You don't go from "pick up the game" to pro in like a year. All these guys were HotS or later players. It's not like NA and EU is just full of people that have been playing since launch or something.

On April 07 2019 09:25 Die4Ever wrote:

yea EU and NA have some new blood, Korea doesn't though

On April 07 2019 09:55 Wombat_NI wrote:
Serral can go toe to toe with anyone and have a shot, and actually win tournaments that have the best Koreans there. Neeb’s done pretty well in the odd tournament

Below that you have players that can be competitive against the majority of Koreans, but don’t have that tournament winning consistency like Scarlett or Reynor. Reynor being a rare foreigner to make it into Code S through actually qualifying and even made it out of his group and he’s super young.

Sure it could be closer still, and there aren’t as many Korean players these days, still of the entirety of SC2’s existence this Period has the smallest gap between Korea and the rest of the world.

I think the existence of WCS definitely helps this.

If you’re pursuing a demanding competitive activity, and basically you know the only way to make a living is to be close to the best in the world and compete vs a scene that has certain advantages like team houses, are you going to pursue that?

If the bar is set to be amongst the best of Europe and you can make a stable-ish living, that’s achievable and if you’re ambitious you push on from there.

Basically no elite sportsman goes from grinding to being Olympic champion, they gradually improve, maybe win their nationals, maybe win a European championship and even if they break their leg, well they’ve been the best at something in the whole or Europe.

Without some kind of regional competition you’re basically putting foreign pros into tough positions, either basically aim for being Olympic champion or bust, or do stuff like stream which cuts into their ability to practice properly and effectively and makes it less likely they bridge that gap.

On April 07 2019 10:20 William paradise wrote:

i get what your saying but with golf and tennis you have 4 majors which most if not all the top and mid tier players go everytime then you have your mid to minor ones regionals and the like that players pick and choose those are the ones that the up and comers hone there talent they win a regional or something similar they hone there talent there and they dont have to be a big production.

On April 07 2019 10:42 Wombat_NI wrote:

In golf and tennis you can make a decent living as a top 200 player though. The 200th ranked player in the world (I just looked) in golf took home 190,000 euros from a tournament win that he got, alongside decent money here and there.

I do like the idea for Starcraft to have 4 grand slam equivalents a year for sure, but I think they should be put over and above the existing WCS tournaments and given prestige above those.

Spread them across the world and have a giant open bracket like IPLs used to have alongside players already qualified; would be great.

You wouldn’t even have to step on toes to do it either, you could collaborate with the few existing tournaments as well. Just make IEM Katowice the European ‘grand slam’ for example, maybe replace one of the non-GSL GSL tournaments with one and make that grand slam Korea. Add one in the US and probably China or somewhere else in Asia other than Korea for the other.

I dunno, it’s not perfect and I’m spitballing. It’s been a problem all throughout SC2 that the best (foreigners especially) don’t clash enough. Serral won Blizzcon, which was great. I think most SC2 fans want to see him and the best Koreans facing more regularly, in tournaments that matter.

On April 07 2019 08:58 AzAlexZ wrote:

I meant the map score prediction, this could have been 4-1 or 4-3 if Scarlett played worse/better in one (more) game

On April 07 2019 13:18 Zzoram wrote:


Aren’t IEM Katowice, WESG, GSL v The World and Blizzcon the 4 grand slams?

On April 07 2019 13:18 Zzoram wrote:


Aren’t IEM Katowice, WESG, GSL v The World and Blizzcon the 4 grand slams?

On April 07 2019 13:30 Wombat_NI wrote:

2 of them are. WESG is a stacked tournament that doesn’t really have much hype. GSL vs the World is cool but it basically just pits WCS players vs the best of Korea.

I think what we’re talking about is tournaments that aren’t just stacked theoretically, but are placed and pushed in such a way that in prestige terms they’re tournaments that are considered of another level