I was hoping him playing today would bring a little more life to the thread. I posted in his fan club a few minutes before it started that he was playing but it might have been too close to the start time for people to see.
Yeah it's kind of weird to be playing season 1 games after the season finals. It would make a little more sense if they did it like WCS Korea and called them the start to season 2, or like you said, just play them earlier.
On June 21 2013 07:40 Shellshock1122 wrote: Yeah it's kind of weird to be playing season 1 games after the season finals. It would make a little more sense if they did it like WCS Korea and called them the start to season 2, or like you said, just play them earlier.
Korea is the opposite problem. They call it the next season but play it during the previous season. I actually hate that even more.
0-2 Ret 4-1 HyuN 1-2 Scarlett 2-0 ViBE 2-0 Comm 1-0 Massan 1-0 HyuN 1-0 Revival 0-1 Revival 1-0 Suppy (and 1-0 vs Jaedong that day too as the 11th result)
So according to MLG Jaedong's winrate against Zerg is 62%, worse than vs. Protoss (63%) and Terran (80%)? Seriously, where are they getting these stats from ^^
On June 21 2013 08:06 Neemi wrote: So according to MLG Jaedong's winrate against Zerg is 62%, worse than vs. Protoss (63%) and Terran (80%)? Seriously, where are they getting these stats from ^^
On June 21 2013 08:07 Shellshock1122 wrote: if you count blizzcon, Mvp has 4 GSLs, 1 MLG, 1 IEM, WCS EU, and Blizzcon right? that's 8 titles? edit: and I forgot WCG so a 9th
On June 21 2013 08:07 Shellshock1122 wrote: if you count blizzcon, Mvp has 4 GSLs, 1 MLG, 1 IEM, WCS EU, and Blizzcon right? that's 8 titles? edit: and I forgot WCG so a 9th
Is it comparable though? I don't know the frequence of major tournaments in bw
On June 21 2013 08:07 Shellshock1122 wrote: if you count blizzcon, Mvp has 4 GSLs, 1 MLG, 1 IEM, WCS EU, and Blizzcon right? that's 8 titles? edit: and I forgot WCG so a 9th
Is it comparable though? I don't know the frequence of major tournaments in bw
I didn't follow BW so I doubt it's directly comparable but I was just responding to them making it sound like no one has close to as many, although it is only 1 player.
On June 21 2013 08:07 Shellshock1122 wrote: if you count blizzcon, Mvp has 4 GSLs, 1 MLG, 1 IEM, WCS EU, and Blizzcon right? that's 8 titles? edit: and I forgot WCG so a 9th
Is it comparable though? I don't know the frequence of major tournaments in bw
No, in BW were there much fewer tournaments, and a greater emphasis on teamleagues (Proleague specifically). You basically only had OSL and MSL as the main individual events, with the annual WCG Korea (WCG finals was just Koreans crushing everyone else). There was the GOMTV Classic for a bit, that only lasted 3 seasons.
In comparison, Flash has won about 8 Premier tournaments in BW (3 OSL, 3 MSL, 1 WCG, 1 GOMTV Classic). So Premier tournament wins are worth a bit less in SC2 than in BW.
On June 21 2013 08:07 Shellshock1122 wrote: if you count blizzcon, Mvp has 4 GSLs, 1 MLG, 1 IEM, WCS EU, and Blizzcon right? that's 8 titles? edit: and I forgot WCG so a 9th
Is it comparable though? I don't know the frequence of major tournaments in bw
I didn't follow BW so I doubt it's directly comparable but I was just responding to them making it sound like no one has close to as many, although it is only 1 player.
It was indeed a bit sensational, but I'd let it slip...it's their job to hype after all ^^
On June 21 2013 08:32 chipmonklord17 wrote: And now all the Chinese players have gone through to code S AM
Xigua is hanging himself for his decision of playing EU not AM
There's a line for that, Comm is first for getting D/Qd
EDIT: Also was that region change from season 1--->2 applicable to all regions or just WCS:Kor picks? I wouldn't be surprised if Xigua switches. Also I'm curious which code B players will switch to AM and if that will be announced
Chinese players making runs is always nice to see.
They have the funniest nicknames in the game as well for me. I find it bizarre but endearing that nicks like 'Ian' and 'Jim', such standard everyday names are used by them.
On June 21 2013 08:42 Wombat_NI wrote: Chinese players making runs is always nice to see.
They have the funniest nicknames in the game as well for me. I find it bizarre but endearing that nicks like 'Ian' and 'Jim', such standard everyday names are used by them.
I remember Artosis talking about a Korean pro named Justin in BW I think. I find it kind of funny, too.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I believe he was referring to how in Korea the 1st round losers go straight to Code B but in EU/AM first round losers still get to play in the up and down matches rather than the difficulty of the leagues.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
With AM and EU, ro32 drop downs in Premier, which are played online, all play in the first round of Challenger. That's too much luck in who you get faced against and then have it all ride on a singe bo3... you could go 1-2 against HerO, 2-0 against Snute, and 1-2 against HerO again in a Premier group, then find yourself facing Taeja in round 1 of challenger and be totally out. That's just too nasty. In Korea at least if you are 3rd in your ro32 group you are safe from elimination. In this system, you could theoretically drop out even if you made the ro16 in Premier, but it takes losing several matches to do so.
This also brings more significance to the up and down groups.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
With AM and EU, ro32 drop downs in Premier, which are played online, all play in the first round of Challenger. That's too much luck in who you get faced against and then have it all ride on a singe bo3... you could go 1-2 against HerO, 2-0 against Snute, and 1-2 against HerO again in a Premier group, then find yourself facing Taeja in round 1 of challenger and be totally out. That's just too nasty.
This also brings more significance to the up and down groups.
I think there are pros and cons to each version of challenger. One con with the way it is for WCS EU and NA is that there is hardly any cycling of new players in, although it might not be as big of a deal, especially in AM, due to the lack of depth in these regions as compared to Korea.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
With AM and EU, ro32 drop downs in Premier, which are played online, all play in the first round of Challenger. That's too much luck in who you get faced against and then have it all ride on a singe bo3... you could go 1-2 against HerO, 2-0 against Snute, and 1-2 against HerO again in a Premier group, then find yourself facing Taeja in round 1 of challenger and be totally out. That's just too nasty. In Korea at least if you are 3rd in your ro32 group you are safe from elimination. In this system, you could theoretically drop out even if you made the ro16 in Premier, but it takes losing several matches to do so.
This also brings more significance to the up and down groups.
It also means that you can win 1 out of 4 series and stay in Challenger League. Or you can win 2 of 4 and get to Premier. And that the Challenger League is largely unimportant since unless you beat all three rounds the results are the same as immediately losing 0-2. And that it's incredibly difficult for new players to break into the scene.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
With AM and EU, ro32 drop downs in Premier, which are played online, all play in the first round of Challenger. That's too much luck in who you get faced against and then have it all ride on a singe bo3... you could go 1-2 against HerO, 2-0 against Snute, and 1-2 against HerO again in a Premier group, then find yourself facing Taeja in round 1 of challenger and be totally out. That's just too nasty.
This also brings more significance to the up and down groups.
I think there are pros and cons to each version of challenger. One con with the way it is for WCS EU and NA is that there is hardly any cycling of new players in, although it might not be as big of a deal, especially in AM, due to the lack of depth in these regions as compared to Korea.
But if you manage to get in, it;s more of a prize because you aren't as much at risk of immediately dropping back out from one bad game or an unlucky draw. In Korea you have guys who make heroic underdog runs through the qualifers and then hit Gumiho in round 1 or something, it's painful to even think about. At least let those who qualify stick around for a few matches.
On June 21 2013 08:36 Undead1993 wrote: jaedong don't you dare to not qualify for WCS AM Premier!
You should be thankful the American/European divisions are so lenient, otherwise he'd have been dropped to Code B.
oh ty so much didn't know that the american and european divisions are weaker than the korean, a very surprising fact!
I'm not talking about player skill, I mean the tournament format. In GSL if you lose in round 1 of Code A - as Jaedong did to theognis -, you're dropped to Code B.
I don't get the reasoning. I though this new WCS was intended to make the game more competitive, but with so few openings for newcomers each season, this system seems to be encouraging stagnation.
With AM and EU, ro32 drop downs in Premier, which are played online, all play in the first round of Challenger. That's too much luck in who you get faced against and then have it all ride on a singe bo3... you could go 1-2 against HerO, 2-0 against Snute, and 1-2 against HerO again in a Premier group, then find yourself facing Taeja in round 1 of challenger and be totally out. That's just too nasty. In Korea at least if you are 3rd in your ro32 group you are safe from elimination. In this system, you could theoretically drop out even if you made the ro16 in Premier, but it takes losing several matches to do so.
This also brings more significance to the up and down groups.
It also means that you can win 1 out of 4 series and stay in Challenger League. Or you can win 2 of 4 and get to Premier. And that the Challenger League is largely unimportant since unless you beat all three rounds the results are the same as immediately losing 0-2. And that it's incredibly difficult for new players to break into the scene.
The bracket stage does determine prize money, low though it is. It also determines your seeding for the up and down groups. So losing in round 1 might get you thrown in with a Korean who dropped out of Premier ro16 while making to the last round and losing will group you with the likes of Hellokitty.
It is just sad watching Jaedong play these days. I don't care the caliber of a player like stardust or Jim I find it just sad. This used to be a man who was on another level in BW that very few people in the history of SCBW were a part of. I dunno how much more I can handle as a big fan of his to keep watching him and thinking he'll dominate.
On June 21 2013 09:06 LimeNade wrote: It is just sad watching Jaedong play these days. I don't care the caliber of a player like stardust or Jim I find it just sad. This used to be a man who was on another level in BW that very few people in the history of SCBW were a part of. I dunno how much more I can handle as a big fan of his to keep watching him and thinking he'll dominate.
Well you have to realize it's only his zvp. His zvt/zvz is very good. He'll figure out zvp in time (I hope). If he figures it out like zvz/zvt omg he'll be such a beast.
On June 21 2013 09:06 LimeNade wrote: It is just sad watching Jaedong play these days. I don't care the caliber of a player like stardust or Jim I find it just sad. This used to be a man who was on another level in BW that very few people in the history of SCBW were a part of. I dunno how much more I can handle as a big fan of his to keep watching him and thinking he'll dominate.
Well you have to realize it's only his zvp. His zvt/zvz is very good. He'll figure out zvp in time.
It's been his ZvP since he started playing HOTS though. There isn't an excuse for a player of his caliber to have not figured it out by now.
On June 21 2013 09:06 LimeNade wrote: It is just sad watching Jaedong play these days. I don't care the caliber of a player like stardust or Jim I find it just sad. This used to be a man who was on another level in BW that very few people in the history of SCBW were a part of. I dunno how much more I can handle as a big fan of his to keep watching him and thinking he'll dominate.
Well you have to realize it's only his zvp. His zvt/zvz is very good. He'll figure out zvp in time (I hope). If he figures it out like zvz/zvt omg he'll be such a beast.
you have also to realize he is trying hard, but i don't think this tournament marathon that comes along his way helps there too much to concentrate on figuring out a mu
Eh it's not like he's the only zerg struggling in zvp. Lots of zergs aren't doing that great in zvp, he's still figuring out what works best for him. Even for his caliber he'll figure it out just right now he doesn't know it feels like.
wow whole army runby to get a few workers, I thought Zerg was done for and suddenly he had 200 supply again. I should pay more attention to the eco. (well kinda easy now)
wonder when Drunkenboi will realize that his cc can fly :x and he doesn't have to be idle with his one army. But imagine burrowed banelings in this scenario.
Base trades from high level players are always funny.
The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
They were going to at one point for GSTL (or at least a LOT of rumors about it), sadly it never happened. I'd definitely watch to see how they'd do
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
It would also require the approval of KeSPA. Geopolitically South Korea and China aren't best buds by any means so I dunno if that would be a factor.
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
It would also require the approval of KeSPA. Geopolitically South Korea and China aren't best buds by any means so I dunno if that would be a factor.
Didn't KeSPA hold an OSL final in China, and attempt to hold a Proleague Grand Final there too?
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
It would also require the approval of KeSPA. Geopolitically South Korea and China aren't best buds by any means so I dunno if that would be a factor.
Didn't KeSPA hold an OSL final in China, and attempt to hold a Proleague Grand Final there too?
Yep the 10-11 PL finals was going to be held in China but it was cancelled by severe weather.
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
It would also require the approval of KeSPA. Geopolitically South Korea and China aren't best buds by any means so I dunno if that would be a factor.
We are united by a common hatred for Japan!
seriously though it's not an issue since Kespa hardly as a political agenda nowadays, even if they did, having to compete for an international audience with international companies means they have to branch out to survive.
On June 21 2013 09:27 Dodgin wrote: The chinese should create an allstar team and join Proleague, too bad that costs a bunch of money that nobody is willing to spend. I think it would be awesome though.
I don't know if you remember, but at the beginning of 2012, there was talk of having a Chinese all star team in the GSTL that year. Obviously it didn't happen, and now I don't expect much now.
Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
Suppy is ethnically Chinese, so he's 0.5 for both sides :p
what was JD doing there? That was horrible macro >< I mean, he ran his units into mines when he should've tried to trade effectively and left his 3rd to just die to 7-8 marines when he had enough units to defend it ... thanks for the info about Jim^
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And Korea has more than both combine with 13 (and the potential of 15 with JD and Hwangsin)
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
Suppy is ethnically Chinese, so he's 0.5 for both sides :p
Illusion is Korean, so once again, same ruling :p
Vibe, Minigun, Neeb, Theognis, and Puck are the Americans that he's talking about in premier league right now.
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
Suppy is ethnically Chinese, so he's 0.5 for both sides :p
Illusion is Korean, so once again, same ruling :p
Vibe, Minigun, Neeb, Theognis, and Puck are the Americans that he's talking about in premier league right now.
stream is acting up on my end as well but it looks like it stabilized. btw, I think Jaedong said that if he lost, he can't show his face anymore so let's hope he wins lol
On June 21 2013 10:00 BigFan wrote: stream is acting up on my mind as well but it looks like it stabilized. btw, I think Jaedong said that if he lost, he can't show his face anymore so let's hope he wins lol
in that moment you see the difference between foreigners and koreans. A Korean terran would have redropped the hellbats and killed all the drones without hesitation
On June 21 2013 10:04 sitromit wrote: Drunkenboi took a game off Jaedong?..
Sjow beat Life in a bo3 on LAN
Drunkenboi taking 1 game off JD online shouldn't blow any minds.
Well, Sjow was pretty well known. I literally have never heard of Drunkenboi until today. Still not too surprising, but strange seeing JD lose to a no-name (not meant to be insulting to Drunkenboi, I just mean that he was a no-name in the sense that I personally never heard of him before)
On June 21 2013 10:04 sitromit wrote: Drunkenboi took a game off Jaedong?..
Sjow beat Life in a bo3 on LAN
Drunkenboi taking 1 game off JD online shouldn't blow any minds.
Well, Sjow was pretty well known. I literally have never heard of Drunkenboi until today. Still not too surprising, but strange seeing JD lose to a no-name (not meant to be insulting to Drunkenboi, I just mean that he was a no-name in the sense that I personally never heard of him before)
welcome to sc2
just saying, when a b.net randomer beat a pro at b.net attack was some surprising result. not so much now.
On June 21 2013 10:04 sitromit wrote: Drunkenboi took a game off Jaedong?..
Sjow beat Life in a bo3 on LAN
Drunkenboi taking 1 game off JD online shouldn't blow any minds.
Bunny 2-0'ed Violet today as well. It's not really that I'm surprised anymore, I'm just wondering how long before people begin to admit there seems to be a common theme here.
On June 21 2013 10:04 sitromit wrote: Drunkenboi took a game off Jaedong?..
Sjow beat Life in a bo3 on LAN
Drunkenboi taking 1 game off JD online shouldn't blow any minds.
Bunny 2-0'ed Violet today as well. It's not really that I'm surprised anymore, I'm just wondering how long before people begin to admit there seems to be a common theme here.
On June 21 2013 10:04 sitromit wrote: Drunkenboi took a game off Jaedong?..
ya, second game. It was really weird. It's like JD kept throwing units and Drunkenboi had the better micro. This game is just as weird. JD's decision making while good is being held by his micro :/
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And technically you can call these two Chinese as well, Suppy was born in Shanghai, he was back home playing BWC last year there.
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And technically you can call these two Chinese as well, Suppy was born in Shanghai, he was back home playing BWC last year there.
Pretty sure Illusion has a Korean background, not Chinese
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And technically you can call these two Chinese as well, Suppy was born in Shanghai, he was back home playing BWC last year there.
Pretty sure Illusion has a Korean background, not Chinese
Oh I mean Suppy only, wasn't going to call Illusion haha, just woke up so my mind is a bit messed up.
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And technically you can call these two Chinese as well, Suppy was born in Shanghai, he was back home playing BWC last year there.
On June 21 2013 09:49 juicyjames wrote: Fun fact: WCS AM S2 Premier League currently has as many Chinese players (4) as it does American players (4). Suppy and Illusion are in the last group, though!
Edit: Three of those Americans are on ROOT Gaming.
And technically you can call these two Chinese as well, Suppy was born in Shanghai, he was back home playing BWC last year there.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/shiroiusagi/wcs/wcs_na_lr.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/thumb/3/30/Writers_Icon.png/15px-Writers_Icon.png){kind=icon}
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/r9ZH0.png)
![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/7/7f/Twitch_ico.png)
WCS America![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/6wl40.png)
![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/c/cd/Cn.png)
Jim vs. ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/4/42/Ca.png)
Drunkenboi![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/8/8b/Tw.png)
Ian vs. ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/3/36/Kr.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bv8Kw.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/l5YZ8.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3wcCS.png)
JD looking good. 
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