|
On June 09 2013 15:37 Kentredenite wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:34 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:31 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:20 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same Alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. I've always wondered about this- because i've assumed the link between the European languages were stronger than the root between Asian languages. However having said this- old Chinese script serves as major foundation for the 3 major Eastern languages (Chinese, Korean and Japanese). The Chinese script doesn't serve as the foundation for anything; it's just the way things are (sometimes) written. Japanese is as unrelated linguistically to Chinese as Finnish is to Swedish, There are a lot of Chinese loanwords and the writing system is ultimately derived from Chinese characters, but base vocabulary, grammar, etc. are a lot different. Korean is similarly considered part of a completely different language family. That said, I think the main reason why Koreans (and other East Asians) aren't as good at English as Europeans is really the level of exposure they get to media with native English speakers. Things like American movies, English-language video games, etc. Even going on English-language forums to talk about these things. I might be presuming a bit much, but English skill in European countries seems to correlate with how much native media that country consumes -- the French, who seem to be generally English-averse, and the Germans, who dub everything are on the lower end, while Scandinavians seem to have the best English. Koreans mostly play Korean games, watch Korean shows/movies, etc. And sometimes Japanese. Compare it to how good an American's Spanish would be, or an Englishman's French. Ugh me being a hypocrite. If you understood any Korean vocab (Which I do fortunately) then you would know that many many Chinese words were used as a basis or in some cases the exact same word. If you look at King SaeJyong (The creator of the Korean language) and his works he specifically cites the old Chinese script as a basis upon which the Korean language was created. Please know what you talk about before you talk bro There's a difference between having vocabulary derived from a language (English has like 70% derived from Latin but isn't a Romance language) and being based on it. Yes, Korean has lots of loanwords from Chinese (similar to English and Latin). So does Japanese. But from a linguistic perspective, the language structures are complete different. And you're confusing the script with the language. SaeJyong didn't create the language. He created the script (which yes, was based on Chinese).
If people are reading this, please ignore this guy. Do your own independent research if you are curious about the origins and status of the Korean language (it is quite fascinating), but this person is purposely spreading false information that he may have garnered from unreliable sources, friends, bad Wikipedia articles and general ignorance.
Don't ask me to refute him, doing a simple 10-15 minute reading into the matter will not only make you feel better but prepare you better to know that they are people who spout nonsense to look intelligent. This guy being a prime example.
|
On June 09 2013 15:40 Lunareste wrote:
I'm honestly disappointed that more of you don't sign up for the Soulkey fan club. He says he wants more to do with his foreign fans, but on the biggest foreign Starcraft website in the world he is only at 12 pages?
Imagine if anyone ever shows him TL fanclubs, and he has such a small one; he'd be so disappointed.
Sign your asses up. He's an amazing player throughout BW and his new SC2 career, and he's just shown he has an awesome personality on OGN2, too.
If some guy says so, i will do it.
|
|
|
On June 09 2013 15:42 YourHarry wrote:
In vegas: a lot of money being wagered on sOs. Innovation payout moved from 1.25 to 1.67 in the last hour or so.
Where do you see the lines?
|
TLADT24920 Posts
On June 09 2013 15:42 Douillos wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:28 Kommander wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. German and English are related but French isn't, it's a Romance language so it's related to Spanish, Italian and Romanian ROmance language? What does that mean? We say Latin here, because you know, of Latin :D
I think what he means is that English is from Germanium and French is from Latin. I never bothered to look why French is called the romance language though lol
|
Even if Chobras korean is a bit lacking, he can always improve that. He has done an awesome job showing the korean progamers personalities this weekend, something we haven't really seen from any other translator.
|
On June 09 2013 15:43 BigFan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:42 Douillos wrote:On June 09 2013 15:28 Kommander wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. German and English are related but French isn't, it's a Romance language so it's related to Spanish, Italian and Romanian ROmance language? What does that mean? We say Latin here, because you know, of Latin :D I think what he means is that English is from Germanium and French is from Latin. I never bothered to look why French is called the romance language though lol
Romance language just means from latin basically. I don't know why.
ROMANce maybe?
|
On June 09 2013 15:43 BigFan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:42 Douillos wrote:On June 09 2013 15:28 Kommander wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. German and English are related but French isn't, it's a Romance language so it's related to Spanish, Italian and Romanian ROmance language? What does that mean? We say Latin here, because you know, of Latin :D I think what he means is that English is from Germanium and French is from Latin. I never bothered to look why French is called the romance language though lol
It's 'cause it's easy to get laid when you speak french :p
|
On June 09 2013 15:42 Namenlos wrote:Just dropping that here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_IndexSouth Korea higher rated than France. But even if you have good English it is hard to communicate if you don't speak English ever. Also Progamers are known for their gaming and not for their school education, many of them drop out of school early to focus on Starcraft.
Another thing to keep in mind (and I believe this has been mentioned by other posters) is that Koreans know English as learned from a text book. They memorize grammar rules. They memorize vocabs and their parts of speech. They form sentences like programmers write code. Often, the result is awkwardly structured sentences.
|
On June 09 2013 15:43 zodde wrote:
Even if Chobras korean is a bit lacking, he can always improve that. He has done an awesome job showing the korean progamers personalities this weekend, something we haven't really seen from any other translator.
Hmm I don't find his Korean lacking, my problem with him was his nauseating personality. The ONLY error i picked up on the lounge show was: Soulkey said "It would be better/less waste of a time for you to assume we only practice" in response to "What does an average day look like at the Woongjin house". Chobra translate what Soulkey said to "They basically only practice".
|
On June 09 2013 15:42 Partha wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:37 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:34 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:31 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:20 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same Alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. I've always wondered about this- because i've assumed the link between the European languages were stronger than the root between Asian languages. However having said this- old Chinese script serves as major foundation for the 3 major Eastern languages (Chinese, Korean and Japanese). The Chinese script doesn't serve as the foundation for anything; it's just the way things are (sometimes) written. Japanese is as unrelated linguistically to Chinese as Finnish is to Swedish, There are a lot of Chinese loanwords and the writing system is ultimately derived from Chinese characters, but base vocabulary, grammar, etc. are a lot different. Korean is similarly considered part of a completely different language family. That said, I think the main reason why Koreans (and other East Asians) aren't as good at English as Europeans is really the level of exposure they get to media with native English speakers. Things like American movies, English-language video games, etc. Even going on English-language forums to talk about these things. I might be presuming a bit much, but English skill in European countries seems to correlate with how much native media that country consumes -- the French, who seem to be generally English-averse, and the Germans, who dub everything are on the lower end, while Scandinavians seem to have the best English. Koreans mostly play Korean games, watch Korean shows/movies, etc. And sometimes Japanese. Compare it to how good an American's Spanish would be, or an Englishman's French. Ugh me being a hypocrite. If you understood any Korean vocab (Which I do fortunately) then you would know that many many Chinese words were used as a basis or in some cases the exact same word. If you look at King SaeJyong (The creator of the Korean language) and his works he specifically cites the old Chinese script as a basis upon which the Korean language was created. Please know what you talk about before you talk bro There's a difference between having vocabulary derived from a language (English has like 70% derived from Latin but isn't a Romance language) and being based on it. Yes, Korean has lots of loanwords from Chinese (similar to English and Latin). So does Japanese. But from a linguistic perspective, the language structures are complete different. And you're confusing the script with the language. SaeJyong didn't create the language. He created the script (which yes, was based on Chinese). If people are reading this, please ignore this guy. Do your own independent research if you are curious about the origins and status of the Korean language (it is quite fascinating), but this person is purposely spreading false information that he may have garnered from unreliable sources, friends, bad Wikipedia articles and general ignorance. Don't ask me to refute him, doing a simple 10-15 minute reading into the matter will not only make you feel better but prepare you better to know that they are people who spout nonsense to look intelligent. This guy being a prime example.
I'm done.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_family
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language
|
I hope more tournaments steal the OGN lounge concept (but don't force it), it's such a phenomenal time-fill.
It's thoroughly entertaining and a great way to meet the players.
|
Soulkey has been added to my sig. That was awesome. I hope we get more of this couch shit because it really builds characters and removes the facelessness that some people think koreans have.
|
On June 09 2013 15:43 zodde wrote:
Even if Chobras korean is a bit lacking, he can always improve that. He has done an awesome job showing the korean progamers personalities this weekend, something we haven't really seen from any other translator.
It's odd though, if his korean isn't that great then just how bad are these other sc2 translators? The answers chobra got out were extremely elaborate, is he just making stuff up? Didn't look like it at all.
|
On June 09 2013 15:43 BigFan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:42 Douillos wrote:On June 09 2013 15:28 Kommander wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. German and English are related but French isn't, it's a Romance language so it's related to Spanish, Italian and Romanian ROmance language? What does that mean? We say Latin here, because you know, of Latin :D I think what he means is that English is from Germanium and French is from Latin. I never bothered to look why French is called the romance language though lol
The romance languages (i.e. French, Spanish, etc.) are based on Latin, which was the language of Rome. The original term roughly meant "to speak in Roman."
|
On June 09 2013 15:45 Kentredenite wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:42 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:37 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:34 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:31 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:20 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same Alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. I've always wondered about this- because i've assumed the link between the European languages were stronger than the root between Asian languages. However having said this- old Chinese script serves as major foundation for the 3 major Eastern languages (Chinese, Korean and Japanese). The Chinese script doesn't serve as the foundation for anything; it's just the way things are (sometimes) written. Japanese is as unrelated linguistically to Chinese as Finnish is to Swedish, There are a lot of Chinese loanwords and the writing system is ultimately derived from Chinese characters, but base vocabulary, grammar, etc. are a lot different. Korean is similarly considered part of a completely different language family. That said, I think the main reason why Koreans (and other East Asians) aren't as good at English as Europeans is really the level of exposure they get to media with native English speakers. Things like American movies, English-language video games, etc. Even going on English-language forums to talk about these things. I might be presuming a bit much, but English skill in European countries seems to correlate with how much native media that country consumes -- the French, who seem to be generally English-averse, and the Germans, who dub everything are on the lower end, while Scandinavians seem to have the best English. Koreans mostly play Korean games, watch Korean shows/movies, etc. And sometimes Japanese. Compare it to how good an American's Spanish would be, or an Englishman's French. Ugh me being a hypocrite. If you understood any Korean vocab (Which I do fortunately) then you would know that many many Chinese words were used as a basis or in some cases the exact same word. If you look at King SaeJyong (The creator of the Korean language) and his works he specifically cites the old Chinese script as a basis upon which the Korean language was created. Please know what you talk about before you talk bro There's a difference between having vocabulary derived from a language (English has like 70% derived from Latin but isn't a Romance language) and being based on it. Yes, Korean has lots of loanwords from Chinese (similar to English and Latin). So does Japanese. But from a linguistic perspective, the language structures are complete different. And you're confusing the script with the language. SaeJyong didn't create the language. He created the script (which yes, was based on Chinese). If people are reading this, please ignore this guy. Do your own independent research if you are curious about the origins and status of the Korean language (it is quite fascinating), but this person is purposely spreading false information that he may have garnered from unreliable sources, friends, bad Wikipedia articles and general ignorance. Don't ask me to refute him, doing a simple 10-15 minute reading into the matter will not only make you feel better but prepare you better to know that they are people who spout nonsense to look intelligent. This guy being a prime example. I'm done. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_familyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language
You realize by linking a large Wikipedia article without citing any part of it makes you look worse? Yes I am done I have had my measure of you and I find it quite accurate.
|
On June 09 2013 15:38 edgeOut wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:34 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:31 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:20 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:On June 09 2013 15:05 JP Dayne wrote:
guys, is there a particular reason why there are like no pro players that can actually speak english? I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English. Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem. That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same Alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. I've always wondered about this- because i've assumed the link between the European languages were stronger than the root between Asian languages. However having said this- old Chinese script serves as major foundation for the 3 major Eastern languages (Chinese, Korean and Japanese). The Chinese script doesn't serve as the foundation for anything; it's just the way things are (sometimes) written. Japanese is as unrelated linguistically to Chinese as Finnish is to Swedish, There are a lot of Chinese loanwords and the writing system is ultimately derived from Chinese characters, but base vocabulary, grammar, etc. are a lot different. Korean is similarly considered part of a completely different language family. That said, I think the main reason why Koreans (and other East Asians) aren't as good at English as Europeans is really the level of exposure they get to media with native English speakers. Things like American movies, English-language video games, etc. Even going on English-language forums to talk about these things. I might be presuming a bit much, but English skill in European countries seems to correlate with how much native media that country consumes -- the French, who seem to be generally English-averse, and the Germans, who dub everything are on the lower end, while Scandinavians seem to have the best English. Koreans mostly play Korean games, watch Korean shows/movies, etc. And sometimes Japanese. Compare it to how good an American's Spanish would be, or an Englishman's French. Ugh me being a hypocrite. If you understood any Korean vocab (Which I do fortunately) then you would know that many many Chinese words were used as a basis or in some cases the exact same word. If you look at King SaeJyong (The creator of the Korean language) and his works he specifically cites the old Chinese script as a basis upon which the Korean language was created. Please know what you talk about before you talk bro Yes, I think Korean is a language created on purpose to replace Chinese as their official language. And they still use a lot of Chinese words and idioms for posters and art work etc, even young kids can understand them.
I am not sure dude... Yeah a lot of people still use Chinese language for things sometimes. But it's like it depends on the person. If they can read it or not.
|
On June 09 2013 15:38 Prince_Stranger wrote:
Soulkey lost
MVP lost
Why am I still want to watch finals?
Because sHy and Bogus are beasts?
|
On June 09 2013 15:47 Partha wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:45 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:42 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:37 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:34 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:31 Kentredenite wrote:On June 09 2013 15:20 Partha wrote:On June 09 2013 15:19 DustbinBieber wrote:On June 09 2013 15:16 Wegandi wrote:On June 09 2013 15:08 dsousa wrote:
[quote]
I agree its odd. We all think of these guys as super smart, but not a one can do an interview in English.
Look at Dimaga, TLO and Stephano. They all had a different first language than English, but they all can also do English interviews without problem.
That's because French and German are very close to English. They share the same lineage, whereas Korean does not. Not entirely true. We share the same Alphabet, but you're quoting 3 languages with different roots here. Regardless, it's true that the whole 'european' melting-pot of the past two milleniums has brought things together. Would have been better to compare French with Spanish and Italian though. I've always wondered about this- because i've assumed the link between the European languages were stronger than the root between Asian languages. However having said this- old Chinese script serves as major foundation for the 3 major Eastern languages (Chinese, Korean and Japanese). The Chinese script doesn't serve as the foundation for anything; it's just the way things are (sometimes) written. Japanese is as unrelated linguistically to Chinese as Finnish is to Swedish, There are a lot of Chinese loanwords and the writing system is ultimately derived from Chinese characters, but base vocabulary, grammar, etc. are a lot different. Korean is similarly considered part of a completely different language family. That said, I think the main reason why Koreans (and other East Asians) aren't as good at English as Europeans is really the level of exposure they get to media with native English speakers. Things like American movies, English-language video games, etc. Even going on English-language forums to talk about these things. I might be presuming a bit much, but English skill in European countries seems to correlate with how much native media that country consumes -- the French, who seem to be generally English-averse, and the Germans, who dub everything are on the lower end, while Scandinavians seem to have the best English. Koreans mostly play Korean games, watch Korean shows/movies, etc. And sometimes Japanese. Compare it to how good an American's Spanish would be, or an Englishman's French. Ugh me being a hypocrite. If you understood any Korean vocab (Which I do fortunately) then you would know that many many Chinese words were used as a basis or in some cases the exact same word. If you look at King SaeJyong (The creator of the Korean language) and his works he specifically cites the old Chinese script as a basis upon which the Korean language was created. Please know what you talk about before you talk bro There's a difference between having vocabulary derived from a language (English has like 70% derived from Latin but isn't a Romance language) and being based on it. Yes, Korean has lots of loanwords from Chinese (similar to English and Latin). So does Japanese. But from a linguistic perspective, the language structures are complete different. And you're confusing the script with the language. SaeJyong didn't create the language. He created the script (which yes, was based on Chinese). If people are reading this, please ignore this guy. Do your own independent research if you are curious about the origins and status of the Korean language (it is quite fascinating), but this person is purposely spreading false information that he may have garnered from unreliable sources, friends, bad Wikipedia articles and general ignorance. Don't ask me to refute him, doing a simple 10-15 minute reading into the matter will not only make you feel better but prepare you better to know that they are people who spout nonsense to look intelligent. This guy being a prime example. I'm done. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_familyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language You realize by linking a large Wikipedia article without citing any part of it makes you look worse? Yes I am done I have had my measure of you and I find it quite accurate.
If you're gonna call him out on his source, you better have a superior one.
|
On June 09 2013 15:45 Partha wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 15:43 zodde wrote:
Even if Chobras korean is a bit lacking, he can always improve that. He has done an awesome job showing the korean progamers personalities this weekend, something we haven't really seen from any other translator. Hmm I don't find his Korean lacking, my problem with him was his nauseating personality. The ONLY error i picked up on the lounge show was: Soulkey said "It would be better/less waste of a time for you to assume we only practice" in response to "What does an average day look like at the Woongjin house". Chobra translate what Soulkey said to "They basically only practice".
Ooh, interestingly nuanced.
Does the literal translation intend to sound cocky? (at least it does to me) or is it just something that's added in the translation?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
