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On October 17 2012 04:21 Bahajinbo wrote:Now I just hope Rain will destroy DRG in the finals. Zerg has to be stopped.  Anways, congratz to DRG, MC is a very inconsistent player with many strange (but sometimes very cool) decisions I think. And he got his revenge for GSL.
If DRG win: Bahajinbo curse
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On October 17 2012 04:23 Rulker wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 04:21 Bahajinbo wrote:Now I just hope Rain will destroy DRG in the finals. Zerg has to be stopped. Anways, congratz to DRG, MC is a very inconsistent player with many strange (but sometimes very cool) decisions I think. And he got his revenge for GSL. If DRG win: Bahajinbo curse
:D
Don't take it too seriously. I'm pretty happy we don't see a PvP finals again.
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On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 -y0shi- wrote:I guess Im angry cause Im a protoss fan but I could live with this result if the games wouldve been any good, but this was a waste of time, really bad games  Game 1 was depressing... whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them.
PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins.
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On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 -y0shi- wrote:I guess Im angry cause Im a protoss fan but I could live with this result if the games wouldve been any good, but this was a waste of time, really bad games Game 1 was depressing... whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins.
If you play Protoss, PvT is the best. If you don't, it's probably third worst (behind other toss match ups.) Terran only has a small window to do anything and only god mode TvPers can play in late game.
TvZ is by far the best IMO, then TvT then ZvZ.
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On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 -y0shi- wrote:I guess Im angry cause Im a protoss fan but I could live with this result if the games wouldve been any good, but this was a waste of time, really bad games Game 1 was depressing... whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins.
PvT is potentially the best only if you're toss, and I still know a high majority of Ps who strongly dislike PvT. I believe you're much of an exception on this one.
The vast consensus on 'what's the best race to watch' is that T > Z > P.
It's not you protoss' players fault, it's Blizzard's.
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Didn't get to watch the games, but congrats to DRG!
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28103 Posts
GJ DRG. Congrats on your win
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On October 17 2012 04:57 TommyP wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 -y0shi- wrote:I guess Im angry cause Im a protoss fan but I could live with this result if the games wouldve been any good, but this was a waste of time, really bad games Game 1 was depressing... whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins. If you play Protoss, PvT is the best. If you don't, it's probably third worst (behind other toss match ups.) Terran only has a small window to do anything and only god mode TvPers can play in late game. TvZ is by far the best IMO, then TvT then ZvZ.
Agreed. Protoss is killing esports. It's terrible to watch any match-up involving Protoss. SC2 would be more popular if Protoss had some dynamic units.
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On October 17 2012 06:55 unteqair wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 04:57 TommyP wrote:On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:
[quote]
whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins. If you play Protoss, PvT is the best. If you don't, it's probably third worst (behind other toss match ups.) Terran only has a small window to do anything and only god mode TvPers can play in late game. TvZ is by far the best IMO, then TvT then ZvZ. Agreed. Protoss is killing esports. It's terrible to watch any match-up involving Protoss. SC2 would be more popular if Protoss had some dynamic units.
I dont think Protoss is killing esports lol.
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On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 -y0shi- wrote:I guess Im angry cause Im a protoss fan but I could live with this result if the games wouldve been any good, but this was a waste of time, really bad games Game 1 was depressing... whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins.
I have never seen anyone who likes pvt more than tvz, pvt has less action, multitasking, interesting engagements compared to any other terran matchup. Protoss games are boring because if you lose an engagement and the toss has even 25% of his army left, they can come over and roll you because they can reinforce on the battlefield as opposed to in their base. Protoss matchups are way more about engagements since defenders advantage is way too small. This is why builds considered standard in pvt or pvz matchups are considered super greedy in pvp.
edit: i'm not saying protoss is op, nor am i commenting on balance, I actually think zerg is the strongest race atm due to map changes and the patches.
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On October 17 2012 06:58 TommyP wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:55 unteqair wrote:On October 17 2012 04:57 TommyP wrote:On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:
[quote]
PvZ is depressing.
If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins. If you play Protoss, PvT is the best. If you don't, it's probably third worst (behind other toss match ups.) Terran only has a small window to do anything and only god mode TvPers can play in late game. TvZ is by far the best IMO, then TvT then ZvZ. Agreed. Protoss is killing esports. It's terrible to watch any match-up involving Protoss. SC2 would be more popular if Protoss had some dynamic units. I dont think Protoss is killing esports lol.
Then I only partly agree with you.
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Funny how they almost looks like brothers in those pictures! ;D
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On October 17 2012 06:55 unteqair wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 04:57 TommyP wrote:On October 17 2012 04:51 Wingblade wrote:On October 17 2012 02:06 Rui.S wrote:On October 17 2012 01:38 mrtomjones wrote:On October 17 2012 01:08 HowardRoark wrote:On October 17 2012 00:37 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 23:29 jellyjello wrote:On October 16 2012 23:03 QRhere wrote:On October 16 2012 21:45 Boonbag wrote:
[quote]
whole set was depressing PvZ is depressing. If I were Korean and had just transitionned from watching Brood War I'd be seriously pissed off at how shitty SC2 sometimes it. It's not just PvZ. Any match up with P is just depressing to watch. Very true my friend. Protoss is so wrongly designed it's actually killing the game from a spectator POV. Yes, Protoss design makes for horrible spectating. Luckily, there is an expansion coming that hopefully address the glaring design flaws of P from a spectator POV. I hope Colossus, Sentry and Warpgates are removed when HotS is released. It is not Protoss design which is ruining matches. It is Zerg design. Brood and infestor is boring as heck to watch and very hard to beat. PvT and PvP have improved hugely since the earlier days of the matchup. pvp is still super boring compared to zvz tvz and tvt, while pvt is around the same as zvz, but worse than tvz and tvt. Protoss is a badly designed race because your entire army is centered around 2 or 3 units. Warpgate and forcefields are also super gimmicky and don't belong in an rts game, but the protoss race is balanced around them. PvT is the best matchup in SC2 by far. TvZ is now blatantly predictable on both sides of the matchup. Terran goes hellion banshee into either bio or mech, and Zerg goes quick third into ling infestor. Terran still has a variety of early game options, and different ways to play out the midgame. Likewise with Protoss. Plus, it's impossible to watch Tvz without seeing Terran players everywhere shedding massive tears when a Zerg wins. If you play Protoss, PvT is the best. If you don't, it's probably third worst (behind other toss match ups.) Terran only has a small window to do anything and only god mode TvPers can play in late game. TvZ is by far the best IMO, then TvT then ZvZ. Agreed. Protoss is killing esports. It's terrible to watch any match-up involving Protoss. SC2 would be more popular if Protoss had some dynamic units.
It all comes down to warpgate. It's weird how such an idea got into the end product to be honest.
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Why were all the games so downrated? Were they all broodlord/infestor turtles and 2 base timings?
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On October 17 2012 07:09 Tachion wrote:
Why were all the games so downrated? Were they all broodlord/infestor turtles and 2 base timings?
no not at all. for ZvP they were about as good as it can get. Probably a mixture of MC bias (cant blame them, hes awesome) and people hating the match up in general or people who still think zerg is imba for some reason.
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Northern Ireland27448 Posts
Poor Protoss getting so much hate these days High level PvT isn't actually a terrible matchup these days, been a lot of good games I've enjoyed there lately. PvZ is terrible granted, but that's not just an issue with Protoss but Zerg.
Anyway, Rain's PvZ looks reminiscent of the warp-prism centric styles of HerO and JYP and is the best PvZ style to watch in my view, and DRG is pretty fearsome so the final could see some good games
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Meh, don't worry about it, Wombat. A lot of the hate is misdirected, wrong, or just stupid (and sometimes, all three).
Thankfully, Blizzard will ignore most of the "feedback".
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Northern Ireland27448 Posts
On October 17 2012 07:16 aZealot wrote:
Meh, don't worry about it, Wombat. A lot of the hate is misdirected, wrong, or just stupid (and sometimes, all three).
Thankfully, Blizzard will ignore most of the "feedback".
Well, especially when people are claiming TvZ is comparable to how it was months ago. I also facepalm with PvP whining. There are issues with the matchup, but people complained that there were no macro games, and now we see long macro games it's 'oh boring war of the worlds'
Myself I preferred PvP before they completely neutered warpgate pressure builds, but I will accept I'm very in the minority on this one 
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No, you aren't the only one. Personally, I prefer PvP as a 1 base micro-fest. That said, the neutering of 4 Gate (at least at the highest levels) has meant the slow development of PvP into the range of builds and playstyles prevalent today.
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On October 17 2012 07:16 aZealot wrote:
Meh, don't worry about it, Wombat. A lot of the hate is misdirected, wrong, or just stupid (and sometimes, all three).
Thankfully, Blizzard will ignore most of the "feedback".
You seem to believe the complaints about PvX are isolated. It's actually a widely spread tendency.
Then again you're a Protoss player.
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EPT
