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Nice to see KESPA players winning GSL pros. Can imagine what will happen after BW/SC2 hybrid PL will end.
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I dont understand why people are even debating if the kespa players shown here are good. What I also don't understand is why people are pretending that the gom players played at their full ability. If people seriously believe that what happy coca yugioh etc displayed over the last couple of days is indicative of what they normally display then that's just as silly. Effort beating gumiho was a fantastic display of ability, as was effort beating drg (even if i think drg normally plays better then what was displayed).
What I'm really looking forward to is seeing flash and stork, and also the results of the asia finals!
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On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games.
What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good in such a short time, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account.
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Perhaps more interesting is the effect that a coach with knowledge of the game imparts on a team.
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despite whether some people think if the gom/gsl players are intimidated or not playing at their best. the fact remains that kespa players have improved tremendously and are nowhere near the top potential yet.
interesting to see how things play out in a 1-2months+
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On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account.
what's your point exactly?
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On August 16 2012 23:28 Boonbag wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account. what's your point exactly?
My point is for people to stop mentioning the 2 years GOM vs 6 months Kespa as if it proves anything.
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On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good in such a short time, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account.
Lol do you just copy-paste this babble every 10 pages or so?
Spin city.
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On August 16 2012 23:29 how2TL wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good in such a short time, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account. Lol do you just copy-paste this babble every 10 pages or so? Spin city.
45 pages ago.
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On August 16 2012 23:29 Apolo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:28 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account. what's your point exactly? My point is for people to stop mentioning the 2 years GOM vs 6 months Kespa as if it proves anything.
A good RTS game, as shown with bw, is constantly evolving, therefore your point doesn't really stands.
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Canada13410 Posts
On August 16 2012 23:14 Grumbels wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 22:48 letian wrote:On August 16 2012 22:41 seansye wrote:
DId anyone see Genius take a peek at Jaedong after he won game 1? It absolutely didn't look like much, but I just felt there was a huge intimidation factor. Genius was also breathing heavily after his loss in game two and was shaking his hands and all. I mean this is Genius, the guy who likes to Manner BM his opponents and do ceremonies against big opponents.
I get pretty intimidated when I face certain pros on ladder(not bragging =P), but one can wonder how Genius feels having to go up against The Tyrant.
Imagine yourself playing a game against a guy who literally was a fucking machine for several years. His mechanics thinking and general mentality is miles better than yours and you are damn well aware of that. In fact his victories over several years, that inspired thousands of players and spawned so many fans, cannot be compared to your puny achievements. The only thing you have to offer is that you are better at this particular game and your know that not for long. They are kids after all, nothing to be ashamed of. Poor Jaedong. o.o Btw, anyone who thinks that this week heralds the domination of the elephants, there is no solid reason for why KeSPA players can lose horribly for weeks on end and suddenly turn it around like this. Maybe that would be the case for one or two players, but it makes no sense that suddenly all of them start winning because they have increased in skill. In that case we would see a different pattern, where in the timespan of a few months more and more players would start losing to KeSPA players, not just like this where within a week there is complete domination. More than likely it's a few bad results that lead to insane pressure on GOM players, who then proceed to play horribly. Because Effort played so horribly against Hero just last week, don't tell me he's code S quality now.
I think its nerves on the gom side, coupled with the fact that the kespa players can study and rpepare whereas the gom players can study and prepare for nothing.
How they went from losing and showing terrible strats in the proleague and in the first round of WCS to 9-0 in the LB... I don't know lol
Its a crazy crazy turn around that can only be described by very good match preparation something they are better at than most pro sc2 teams.
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On August 16 2012 23:32 Boonbag wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:29 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 23:28 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account. what's your point exactly? My point is for people to stop mentioning the 2 years GOM vs 6 months Kespa as if it proves anything. A good RTS game, as shown with bw, is constantly evolving, therefore your point doesn't really stands.
We'll see.
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On August 16 2012 23:32 ZeromuS wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:14 Grumbels wrote:On August 16 2012 22:48 letian wrote:On August 16 2012 22:41 seansye wrote:
DId anyone see Genius take a peek at Jaedong after he won game 1? It absolutely didn't look like much, but I just felt there was a huge intimidation factor. Genius was also breathing heavily after his loss in game two and was shaking his hands and all. I mean this is Genius, the guy who likes to Manner BM his opponents and do ceremonies against big opponents.
I get pretty intimidated when I face certain pros on ladder(not bragging =P), but one can wonder how Genius feels having to go up against The Tyrant.
Imagine yourself playing a game against a guy who literally was a fucking machine for several years. His mechanics thinking and general mentality is miles better than yours and you are damn well aware of that. In fact his victories over several years, that inspired thousands of players and spawned so many fans, cannot be compared to your puny achievements. The only thing you have to offer is that you are better at this particular game and your know that not for long. They are kids after all, nothing to be ashamed of. Poor Jaedong. o.o Btw, anyone who thinks that this week heralds the domination of the elephants, there is no solid reason for why KeSPA players can lose horribly for weeks on end and suddenly turn it around like this. Maybe that would be the case for one or two players, but it makes no sense that suddenly all of them start winning because they have increased in skill. In that case we would see a different pattern, where in the timespan of a few months more and more players would start losing to KeSPA players, not just like this where within a week there is complete domination. More than likely it's a few bad results that lead to insane pressure on GOM players, who then proceed to play horribly. Because Effort played so horribly against Hero just last week, don't tell me he's code S quality now. I think its nerves on the gom side, coupled with the fact that the kespa players can study and rpepare whereas the gom players can study and prepare for nothing. How they went from losing and showing terrible strats in the proleague and in the first round of WCS to 9-0 in the LB... I don't know lol Its a crazy crazy turn around that can only be described by very good match preparation something they are better at than most pro sc2 teams.
BW A teamers have the fastest hands on this planet. It's no big surprise tbh. I really doubt they already have the in-team logistics to prepare for their opponents like they can in BW.
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On August 16 2012 23:34 Boonbag wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:32 ZeromuS wrote:On August 16 2012 23:14 Grumbels wrote:On August 16 2012 22:48 letian wrote:On August 16 2012 22:41 seansye wrote:
DId anyone see Genius take a peek at Jaedong after he won game 1? It absolutely didn't look like much, but I just felt there was a huge intimidation factor. Genius was also breathing heavily after his loss in game two and was shaking his hands and all. I mean this is Genius, the guy who likes to Manner BM his opponents and do ceremonies against big opponents.
I get pretty intimidated when I face certain pros on ladder(not bragging =P), but one can wonder how Genius feels having to go up against The Tyrant.
Imagine yourself playing a game against a guy who literally was a fucking machine for several years. His mechanics thinking and general mentality is miles better than yours and you are damn well aware of that. In fact his victories over several years, that inspired thousands of players and spawned so many fans, cannot be compared to your puny achievements. The only thing you have to offer is that you are better at this particular game and your know that not for long. They are kids after all, nothing to be ashamed of. Poor Jaedong. o.o Btw, anyone who thinks that this week heralds the domination of the elephants, there is no solid reason for why KeSPA players can lose horribly for weeks on end and suddenly turn it around like this. Maybe that would be the case for one or two players, but it makes no sense that suddenly all of them start winning because they have increased in skill. In that case we would see a different pattern, where in the timespan of a few months more and more players would start losing to KeSPA players, not just like this where within a week there is complete domination. More than likely it's a few bad results that lead to insane pressure on GOM players, who then proceed to play horribly. Because Effort played so horribly against Hero just last week, don't tell me he's code S quality now. I think its nerves on the gom side, coupled with the fact that the kespa players can study and rpepare whereas the gom players can study and prepare for nothing. How they went from losing and showing terrible strats in the proleague and in the first round of WCS to 9-0 in the LB... I don't know lol Its a crazy crazy turn around that can only be described by very good match preparation something they are better at than most pro sc2 teams. BW A teamers have the fastest hands on this planet. It's no big surprise tbh. I really doubt they already have the in-team logistics to prepare for their opponents like they can in BW.
So when drg comes out with 250 eapm and 500+ apm he loses because his hands aren't fast enough?
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On August 16 2012 23:34 Apolo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:32 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:29 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 23:28 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:25 Apolo wrote:On August 16 2012 22:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 16 2012 21:52 mh_no_idea wrote:
lol i dont even care for gom or kespa, i just want to see good games and i am fine.
But this hype is just to much. We are in the losers bracket , just look how the winners bracket looks like...
Lets see how the top 10 or so at the end of the tournament look like! Lol Kespa players have already proven themselves and may I remind you that they did so in three 1/2 months while concurrently practicing and simultaneously playing two games while your GSL players had 2 years. There is no excuse for the GSL players, they are simply being...how do you say...outplayed. Sure, Kespa lost round 1 but since then they have had more time to focus on SC2 and it is starting to show. Just except the reality because the sole key of Kespa players was to learn from their mistakes and put more effort into their next games. What some of you seem to be forgetting, is that GOM players (+foreigners) had to develop all the strategies, timings, builds, and metagame changes that Kespa are now using. Kespa started from a point with a lot of knowledge already available, while GOM players had to figure everything out. Not to mention all the strategy setbacks due to balance patch changes. Kespa came here with more money, years of experience in practicing with professional teams, a game now almost close to balanced, and using all the extensive knowledge created by GOM players. It's no suprise Kespa players seem so good, and suddenly 2 years for the GOM players doesn't seem that much if you take all these factors into account. what's your point exactly? My point is for people to stop mentioning the 2 years GOM vs 6 months Kespa as if it proves anything. A good RTS game, as shown with bw, is constantly evolving, therefore your point doesn't really stands. We'll see.
See what ? I don't get your answers at all.
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On August 16 2012 23:35 bo1b wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:34 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:32 ZeromuS wrote:On August 16 2012 23:14 Grumbels wrote:On August 16 2012 22:48 letian wrote:On August 16 2012 22:41 seansye wrote:
DId anyone see Genius take a peek at Jaedong after he won game 1? It absolutely didn't look like much, but I just felt there was a huge intimidation factor. Genius was also breathing heavily after his loss in game two and was shaking his hands and all. I mean this is Genius, the guy who likes to Manner BM his opponents and do ceremonies against big opponents.
I get pretty intimidated when I face certain pros on ladder(not bragging =P), but one can wonder how Genius feels having to go up against The Tyrant.
Imagine yourself playing a game against a guy who literally was a fucking machine for several years. His mechanics thinking and general mentality is miles better than yours and you are damn well aware of that. In fact his victories over several years, that inspired thousands of players and spawned so many fans, cannot be compared to your puny achievements. The only thing you have to offer is that you are better at this particular game and your know that not for long. They are kids after all, nothing to be ashamed of. Poor Jaedong. o.o Btw, anyone who thinks that this week heralds the domination of the elephants, there is no solid reason for why KeSPA players can lose horribly for weeks on end and suddenly turn it around like this. Maybe that would be the case for one or two players, but it makes no sense that suddenly all of them start winning because they have increased in skill. In that case we would see a different pattern, where in the timespan of a few months more and more players would start losing to KeSPA players, not just like this where within a week there is complete domination. More than likely it's a few bad results that lead to insane pressure on GOM players, who then proceed to play horribly. Because Effort played so horribly against Hero just last week, don't tell me he's code S quality now. I think its nerves on the gom side, coupled with the fact that the kespa players can study and rpepare whereas the gom players can study and prepare for nothing. How they went from losing and showing terrible strats in the proleague and in the first round of WCS to 9-0 in the LB... I don't know lol Its a crazy crazy turn around that can only be described by very good match preparation something they are better at than most pro sc2 teams. BW A teamers have the fastest hands on this planet. It's no big surprise tbh. I really doubt they already have the in-team logistics to prepare for their opponents like they can in BW. So when drg comes out with 250 eapm and 500+ apm he loses because his hands aren't fast enough?
Some B-teamers are just as fast, they're just not as good at translating their speed. The A-teamers are fast and smarter and wiser with that speed.
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THE ELEPHANT IS COMING.
Gogogogoggo Jaedong FIGHTING!
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On August 16 2012 23:35 bo1b wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2012 23:34 Boonbag wrote:On August 16 2012 23:32 ZeromuS wrote:On August 16 2012 23:14 Grumbels wrote:On August 16 2012 22:48 letian wrote:On August 16 2012 22:41 seansye wrote:
DId anyone see Genius take a peek at Jaedong after he won game 1? It absolutely didn't look like much, but I just felt there was a huge intimidation factor. Genius was also breathing heavily after his loss in game two and was shaking his hands and all. I mean this is Genius, the guy who likes to Manner BM his opponents and do ceremonies against big opponents.
I get pretty intimidated when I face certain pros on ladder(not bragging =P), but one can wonder how Genius feels having to go up against The Tyrant.
Imagine yourself playing a game against a guy who literally was a fucking machine for several years. His mechanics thinking and general mentality is miles better than yours and you are damn well aware of that. In fact his victories over several years, that inspired thousands of players and spawned so many fans, cannot be compared to your puny achievements. The only thing you have to offer is that you are better at this particular game and your know that not for long. They are kids after all, nothing to be ashamed of. Poor Jaedong. o.o Btw, anyone who thinks that this week heralds the domination of the elephants, there is no solid reason for why KeSPA players can lose horribly for weeks on end and suddenly turn it around like this. Maybe that would be the case for one or two players, but it makes no sense that suddenly all of them start winning because they have increased in skill. In that case we would see a different pattern, where in the timespan of a few months more and more players would start losing to KeSPA players, not just like this where within a week there is complete domination. More than likely it's a few bad results that lead to insane pressure on GOM players, who then proceed to play horribly. Because Effort played so horribly against Hero just last week, don't tell me he's code S quality now. I think its nerves on the gom side, coupled with the fact that the kespa players can study and rpepare whereas the gom players can study and prepare for nothing. How they went from losing and showing terrible strats in the proleague and in the first round of WCS to 9-0 in the LB... I don't know lol Its a crazy crazy turn around that can only be described by very good match preparation something they are better at than most pro sc2 teams. BW A teamers have the fastest hands on this planet. It's no big surprise tbh. I really doubt they already have the in-team logistics to prepare for their opponents like they can in BW. So when drg comes out with 250 eapm and 600+ apm he loses because his hands aren't fast enough?
Fast isn't the proper word, the hands thing is just a metaphore.
DRG was a practice partner for CJ team, meaning he had the skill to train with pro gamers without actually beeing good enough to warrant a salary from a team.
When BW coaches would scout for new talents at courages tournaments in Korea, they would often pick the fastest players rather than the winning ones, because they always said raw hand talent >everything.
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EPT
