EPTOn September 20 2011 22:37 clusen wrote:
They only played one series :p
And 2 matches @ GSTL, both won one match.
They only played one series :p
And 2 matches @ GSTL, both won one match.
My b. Though it was a BO7. And bomber won the most recent GSTL
[GSL] Oct Code S RO32 Day 1 - Page 102
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andaylin
United States10830 Posts
My b. Though it was a BO7. And bomber won the most recent GSTL | ||
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Biane
Australia645 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:37 Arceus wrote: go watch Polt v TOP on Daybreak. Thats the pinnacle of bio play imo. That also shows that Polt is miles better than MKP but ppl never give him enough credit while still hyping a weak terran with an outdated metagame btw gotta email Dr.Chae to make mvp vs bomber a bo9 As much as I love MKP the day i first saw him, you're right. Polt seems to play the bio style much better than MKP does, and of course, we've seen MVP play it even more perfectly against TOP. | ||
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clusen
Germany8702 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:38 andaylin wrote: My b. Though it was a BO7. And bomber won the most recent GSTL € Sorry misread you :p The outcome of that match didn't even matter a whole lot because at that point both had a secure place at Code S. | ||
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mikedebo
Canada4341 Posts
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bittman
Australia8759 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:33 Poopi wrote: Know you understand why blue flame is nerfed for TvT? ^_^ That's probably why Mvp got crushed against GanZi in the ST when he used bio or why Polt lost to Bomber & TOP. Oh wait. MVP beat TOP with Bio in game 4 of last Code S finals, he's not bad with it. And Polt beat MMA in the same ST that MKP lost to MMA. I'd say the statement that both MVP and Polt seem more compentant in bio is foundable. Being the best marine splitter a year ago doesn't give him permanent "Best Bio user of 20xx" status. Still, bio is such a hardly used style that it's hard to say who really uses it better until we see a bio vs bio game. Winning or Losing Bio vs Mech doesn't actually prove a point for bio control, since MM splits are almost less important than well set up flanks. | ||
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Tommylew
Wales2717 Posts
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Tehs Tehklz
United States330 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: Bio is stupid. You win if your opponent makes a big mistake and you lose if neither of you make mistakes. It's basically an easier but worse way of playing TvT. I have no idea why a pro would go for it right now - do you really lack confidence in your skill that you have to rely on your opponent fucking up every TvT you play? I actually think it is the opposite. I think MKP is supremely confident in his macro mechanics and thinks that he can just out produce other Terran players, so it is OK to trade armies cost-inefficiently. I think this is also the reason he sticks with bio: because that strategy probably works against a lot of Terran players. His macro and mechanics are so good that standard pro players get overwhelmed. Check his match history versus Terran players. He beats people like Hack and Jjakji and the STC and very nearly even GanZi using an inferior style because his mechanics are so good, Then he plays people like MVP or Bomber and their mechanics are just as good and suddenly he is unable to make bad army trades and macro his way ahead. Then he just looks foolish. I mean, look at how close the Ryung vs. Bomber game was. When both players are that good, sloppy play and bad trades make the other guy look streets ahead in terms skill, when it is really just his poor strategy. So, I guess my advice to MarineKing would be "beware of pride, boy." But, then again, what do I know? I suck at this game. | ||
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poorcloud
Singapore2748 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:33 Poopi wrote: Know you understand why blue flame is nerfed for TvT? ^_^ That's probably why Mvp got crushed against GanZi in the ST when he used bio or why Polt lost to Bomber & TOP. Oh wait. but why MVP crushed ensnare and top with bio? While MKP lost with his bio to taeja, ryung, bomber and many many other terrans. 1 match does not do justice to the actual level of the player. However, when we have a larger sample size, it is apparent that MVP is a better player than MKP at both styles and polt is better than mkp at bio. | ||
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Disquiet
Australia628 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:38 FuzzyJAM wrote: a) I said "big mistake", not simply "mistake". b) The point is that mech doesn't rely on a bio player making a big mistake. Bio, on the other hand, does. I don't get what you're trying to say. The only way anyone ever wins a mirror match is the opponent making a mistake. If everyone played perfect every mirror match would be a draw. and how is mech not reliant on mistake making? With mech you're hoping he won't out manuever you, you're hoping he won't hit you when you're unseiging, or with a big flank. Each time a bio player misses a chance its a mistake, and there ALWAYS chances no matter how good you are, you have to move your tanks sometime. | ||
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dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:27 wklbishop wrote: Actually, this makes me wonder how the hell Polt does it... Polt's Bio play is simply more refined than MKP's. He has better Bio Micro than MKP. He knows his attack timings better. He knows weaknesses in his opponent's builds and plays. He knows how to do Mech, so he knows the timings for Mech. He knows how to be all over the map. And probably the most importantly of all, he somehow can judge at the drop of a hat when his stimmed Bio army can come out on top in an engagement against Mech. Judgment calls that no one else would probably be able to make or see coming. I mean, I sure as hell am scratching my head whenever that happens and wondering how the hell his bio somehow came out on top. | ||
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andaylin
United States10830 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:41 clusen wrote: € Sorry misread you :p The outcome of that match didn't even matter a whole lot because at that point both had a secure place at Code S. Technically not true, because they had not adapted the winner of code A gets code S seed. Winner could pick their up and down groups so I doubt they weren't trying. Plus, I'm sure they are competitive against each other anyways. | ||
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Tehs Tehklz
United States330 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:29 Ysellian wrote: Bio is just another strategy which MVP and Polt have proven to be perfectly viable still. Who do they beat with bio, though? Usually, it is players that they can out macro based off mechanics. Polt's bio beat Keen and MMA (good, but often sloppy) and Maka, but it didn't beat SC and it didn't beat Bomber and I would bet that it won't beat MVP. You have to have better macro to win with bio - even equal macro gets you beat. On September 20 2011 22:46 dabom88 wrote: Polt's Bio play is simply more refined than MKP's. He has better Bio Micro than MKP. He knows his attack timings better. He knows weaknesses in his opponent's builds and plays. He knows how to do Mech, so he knows the timings for Mech. He knows how to be all over the map. And probably the most importantly of all, he somehow can judge at the drop of a hat when his stimmed Bio army can come out on top in an engagement against Mech. Judgment calls that no one else would probably be able to make or see coming. What great Terran players has he beaten that MKP hasn't? MMA and Top are the best Terran players Polt has beaten and MKP has beaten MMA before, too, and Top managed to beat Polt the second time around, after having 3 months to improve his macro. Other than those two, Polt's TvT victories come over Keen, Noblesse, Maka, the Stc and he looses to Bomber, SC, and MVP. These results look pretty similar, to me. Bio works against mid-tier Terran pro's, whom Polt and MKP can out macro, but against the other top-tier players, whose macro is equal or better, bio just doesn't cut it. | ||
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Maghetti
United States2429 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:37 Biane wrote: I understand you are an MKP Hater, okay that's clear. Now you're saying everything that isn't the conventional these days is gimmicky, well.....i'm sorry for wasting your time. You're right, MKP is a gimmicky player, he doesn't deserve my respect and admiration. I guess I should have you teach me what is gimmicky and what isn't gimmicky so that i can gain some respect in your eyes (cause that is very important in life is it not?). Those things I listed are in my opinion not just unconventional, but based on your opponents making a mistake. Mech beats bio 100% of the time if the mech playing makes no big mistakes. I do not like stylistic players very much. I have a similar issue with destiny for example. He relies basically on not being allined. If he is left to get up all his tech he is suddenly very hard to beat, but this is gimmicky. I get it, you're a MKP fan. And I do know why he has fans. He did stuff that people thought was not viable. He showed all sorts of stuff with marines, all kinds of good micro. I was made a "hater" of his play from watching his play. He is still around because he is capable of strong standard play. That is why I said he likes to be cheesy and gimmicky and not that he has to be. It is annoying to see a player with his talent 1base like 50% of the time. Even MKP fans should be annoyed by this. It isn't solid play and it isn't enjoyable for the fans. | ||
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marttorn
Norway5211 Posts
Poll: Which player in SC currently has the highest annual salary? Mules (20) Flash (5) Jaedong (1) Jangbi (1) Hwasin (1) 28 total votes Your vote: Which player in SC currently has the highest annual salary? (Vote): Flash Hope y'all enjoyed Code S | ||
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Telcontar
United Kingdom16710 Posts
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UserErrOr413
United States178 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:38 FuzzyJAM wrote: a) I said "big mistake", not simply "mistake". b) The point is that mech doesn't rely on a bio player making a big mistake. Bio, on the other hand, does. I think you could say losing 17 SCV is a big mistake... I feel like a lot of TvT Bio vs. Mech series either one person loses a ton of scvs to blue flames or it get completely shut down and in that regard it makes it hard to judge because 1 player then gets a distinguished advantage so early. | ||
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Dakkas
2550 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:53 marttorn wrote: Oh yes! One more Poll: Which player in SC currently has the highest annual salary? Mules (20) Flash (5) Jaedong (1) Jangbi (1) Hwasin (1) 28 total votes Your vote: Which player in SC currently has the highest annual salary? (Vote): Flash Hope y'all enjoyed Code S I laughed at that too much | ||
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Daniel C
Hong Kong1606 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:33 Demonace34 wrote: Thanks a ton, I guess after 1k you just want to start giving back. It was my first time trying to LR, so hopefully I didn't write too much or too little. Have a good night all. Much appreciated. Thanks heaps! | ||
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Chicane
United States7875 Posts
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usethis2
2164 Posts
On September 20 2011 22:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: Bio is stupid. You win if your opponent makes a big mistake and you lose if neither of you make mistakes. It's basically an easier but worse way of playing TvT. I have no idea why a pro would go for it right now - do you really lack confidence in your skill that you have to rely on your opponent fucking up every TvT you play? I did not watch the VODs yet but I can guess that's what Mr. Know-It-All (his name starts with A) said. I wish he shut up, really. It's amazing how many people repeats what he says as if they are braineless robots. | ||
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