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SHOUTcraft Invitational 3 - Catchy Title - Page 90

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
September 11 2011 14:34 GMT
#1781
On September 11 2011 23:31 dani` wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 11 2011 23:28 Rabiator wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:25 dani` wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:20 Rabiator wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:19 Sated wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:17 Rabiator wrote:
Why are Protoss players not building a ring of cannons around their bases when faced by a Terran? Its a pain to move from A to B on many maps with all your forces and a minimal investment of a few hundred minerals can neutralize those evil Terran drops because Medivacs are somewhat squishy.

Tyler got punished by drops severely yesterday and today White-Ra does have to divert his attention from "the front" as well; its a mess nonetheless.

Probably because cannons cost money and because Marauders destroy builds far too quickly with stim.

Said Marauders have to be dropped first and if the cannons are placed at the rim of the landmass they get 2-3 shots off on the Medivac (at least) before those nasty Marauders are dropped ...

On maps with long cliffs like Shattered you need like 4 - 5 Cannons to cover everything, i.e. 600-750 minerals. That's absolutely not worth it, better get some extra Gateways to always be able to warp in there, or leave a couple of Stalkers. Blink Stalkers are the 2nd best counter to drops imo, Phoenix being #1 but that's a big investment as well.


Obviously you need "enough cannons" and if you build too few it is bad and you have to think about it this way: 3 cannons are just 5 Zealots preemptively warped in to defend which dont even cost supply and which can shoot air. Every time a Protoss warps in defensive forces he has the resources to build cannons and Marauders are able to deal with a round of those if supported by Medivacs.

Shattered Temple has a pretty long "cliffline" which is open to space, but there are maps where 2-3 cannons would be enough defense.

No supply is the only thing the Cannon has going for it, other than that Blink Stalkers are better in every way, you should agree with that. They can actually chase a dropship AND Blink away to avoid death. In the late late game where you are maxed and have spare minerals, sure throw down Cannons but in the mid game you should invest in a better army imo and just leave some Stalkers.


You could use cannons to say zone out areas so you have less surface area for your blink stalkers to cover. That seems like a smarter way than just trying to cover everything with stalkers or cannons.
Leviance
Profile Joined November 2009
Germany4079 Posts
September 11 2011 14:35 GMT
#1782
On September 11 2011 23:33 DiaBoLuS wrote:
thats why i dont like white-ras play.

its like a beta tlo playing strange builds every game that are completly fragile.


I fixed that for you

"Blizzard is never gonna nerf Terran because of those American and European fuck" - Korean Netizen
Ragoo
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany2773 Posts
September 11 2011 14:35 GMT
#1783
Been watching the last two games and can't say that I like what I see, dde's multitasking when dropping is pretty horrible and wtf was that last fight...
Member of TPW mapmaking team/// twitter.com/Ragoo_ /// "goody represents border between explainable reason and supernatural" Cloud
ondik
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Czech Republic2908 Posts
September 11 2011 14:35 GMT
#1784
On September 11 2011 23:33 Papulatus wrote:
The fuck? Why did White-Ra attack?...

so what was he supposed to do? let him make a siege contain with bunkers?
Bisu. The one and only. // Save the cheerreaver, save the world (of SC2)
Montana[TK]
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
1624 Posts
September 11 2011 14:36 GMT
#1785
On September 11 2011 23:25 tree.hugger wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 11 2011 23:18 Montana[TK] wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:14 tree.hugger wrote:
Dde is so irritating, he just does the exact same thing again and again, and it keeps working.


I hear a little fanboyism there ;p

WhiteRa's build seemed pretty thin, can't lose stalkers in the middle.

Not really. Just pointing out a fact. When I said Dde is irritating, I meant that he'd be really irritating to play. I have a friend who plays this exact same style, and I can't stand it; you have to be watching carefully the entire time or you just lose the game, while he just has to focus once. Just the way it is, gotta be more aggressive about splitting your army. Phoenix help too.


"He has to focus just once" is a bit of an understatement, don't you think? The same thing could be said about drop defense, Protoss can just put a couple of units into the mineral, and be safe + afk while Terran has to maintain production and watch the mini-map should his drop get spotted but in reality it's a bit more complicated.

It's certainly annoying to play against, DDE has solid style, not many Terrans understand how to micro against Protoss (Select, Thorzain come to mind) and it's a great skill toi have. He should cut out the factory play though imo. His bio-only play is much more effective.
Plexa: "It's not [caster] bashing when its the truth."
Mowr
Profile Joined November 2010
Sweden791 Posts
September 11 2011 14:37 GMT
#1786
Charge the half-made bunkers! lol
Kill one man and they'll call you a murderer. Kill an army of men and they'll call you a general. But kill all men and they'll call you a god.
RHoudini
Profile Joined October 2009
Belgium3627 Posts
September 11 2011 14:37 GMT
#1787
White-Ra's play in a way resembles July's style.
If he wins, he's a genius.
If he loses, everybody says WTF was that...
Lee Jae Dong fighting!
Montana[TK]
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
1624 Posts
September 11 2011 14:39 GMT
#1788
would be a sick comeback.

It's WhiteRa's choice though, DDE's play has been kinda sloppy, so I wouldn't get my hopes up. (although the momentum is swinging in his favor now :D)
Plexa: "It's not [caster] bashing when its the truth."
ZAiNs
Profile Joined July 2010
United Kingdom6525 Posts
September 11 2011 14:40 GMT
#1789
Is anyone else getting a lot of lag now that the stream restarted? It was laggy for me yesterday too, but perfect earlier today.
Montana[TK]
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
1624 Posts
September 11 2011 14:40 GMT
#1790
close pos Metalo, pretty sick for Terran in general, and even more so with drop-heavy play
Plexa: "It's not [caster] bashing when its the truth."
Derez
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Netherlands6068 Posts
September 11 2011 14:41 GMT
#1791
On September 11 2011 23:40 ZAiNs wrote:
Is anyone else getting a lot of lag now that the stream restarted? It was laggy for me yesterday too, but perfect earlier today.


It's like watching a powerpoint presentation currently.
Ragoo
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany2773 Posts
September 11 2011 14:41 GMT
#1792
On September 11 2011 23:40 ZAiNs wrote:
Is anyone else getting a lot of lag now that the stream restarted? It was laggy for me yesterday too, but perfect earlier today.


Yeah unwatchable now
Member of TPW mapmaking team/// twitter.com/Ragoo_ /// "goody represents border between explainable reason and supernatural" Cloud
Montana[TK]
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
1624 Posts
September 11 2011 14:41 GMT
#1793
240p is working
Plexa: "It's not [caster] bashing when its the truth."
Montana[TK]
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
1624 Posts
September 11 2011 14:41 GMT
#1794
maka rax! don't think WR has seen it
Plexa: "It's not [caster] bashing when its the truth."
Toadvine
Profile Joined November 2010
Poland2234 Posts
September 11 2011 14:43 GMT
#1795
On September 11 2011 23:36 Montana[TK] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 11 2011 23:25 tree.hugger wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:18 Montana[TK] wrote:
On September 11 2011 23:14 tree.hugger wrote:
Dde is so irritating, he just does the exact same thing again and again, and it keeps working.


I hear a little fanboyism there ;p

WhiteRa's build seemed pretty thin, can't lose stalkers in the middle.

Not really. Just pointing out a fact. When I said Dde is irritating, I meant that he'd be really irritating to play. I have a friend who plays this exact same style, and I can't stand it; you have to be watching carefully the entire time or you just lose the game, while he just has to focus once. Just the way it is, gotta be more aggressive about splitting your army. Phoenix help too.


"He has to focus just once" is a bit of an understatement, don't you think? The same thing could be said about drop defense, Protoss can just put a couple of units into the mineral, and be safe + afk while Terran has to maintain production and watch the mini-map should his drop get spotted but in reality it's a bit more complicated.

It's certainly annoying to play against, DDE has solid style, not many Terrans understand how to micro against Protoss (Select, Thorzain come to mind) and it's a great skill toi have. He should cut out the factory play though imo. His bio-only play is much more effective.


That's not even true... Putting units in your mineral line is the worst possible thing to do against drops. You want them on the edge of the base to intercept the medivac. After it unloads you need more supply to clean it up in the midgame.

Drops in TvP are really much easier to execute than to defend.
"There are always some Eskimos ready to instruct the Congolese on how to cope with heat waves." - S.J.Lec
sixfour
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
England11061 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-11 14:45:39
September 11 2011 14:43 GMT
#1796
On September 11 2011 23:40 ZAiNs wrote:
Is anyone else getting a lot of lag now that the stream restarted? It was laggy for me yesterday too, but perfect earlier today.


yeah, unfortunately i think the stream restart has made things worse, sucks as it's beyond their control

good god my typing is terrible today
p: stats, horang2, free, jangbi z: soulkey, zero, shine, hydra t: leta, hiya, sea
HaXXspetten
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Sweden15718 Posts
September 11 2011 14:43 GMT
#1797
Stream lagging for anyone else?
Telcontar
Profile Joined May 2010
United Kingdom16710 Posts
September 11 2011 14:44 GMT
#1798
On September 11 2011 23:43 HaXXspetten wrote:
Stream lagging for anyone else?

720+p was streaming perfectly before they reset it. Now, it's lagging like mad. The 720p is a little better though.
Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta.
Mowr
Profile Joined November 2010
Sweden791 Posts
September 11 2011 14:45 GMT
#1799
360 works for me.
Kill one man and they'll call you a murderer. Kill an army of men and they'll call you a general. But kill all men and they'll call you a god.
hugman
Profile Joined June 2009
Sweden4644 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-11 14:46:08
September 11 2011 14:45 GMT
#1800
360p is better than the GOM stream anyway lol
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