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On July 18 2011 18:37 FiWiFaKi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:34 Phyxx wrote:
Puzzle almost caught up, but tassadar had the BO advantage. It was an even build. Everyone knows your opponent will 4 gate on this map so there is no build order advantage, maybe puzzle had a larger advantage as it was agressive 4 gate vs 3 stalker into defensive 4 gate.
It was a maybe even a very slight bo advantage for puzzle imo. ^^
Puzzle should have retreated further in his base instead of fighting so close to the choke.
EDIt: He microed his proxy zealot very poorly.
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cmon puzzle, wake up. you can do this
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On July 18 2011 18:38 Pyre wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:38 Medrea wrote:On July 18 2011 18:36 Pyre wrote:
Protoss needs like a rock paper scissors in this match up. Like a unit that owns stalkers but dies quickly to zealots. Immortal says hi. Or wait, are you trolling? when do you have a chance to get a immortal in a 4 gate push? I mean something that could be warped in around the same time.
Exactly. tons of people are saying Immortal, duh, but if he does go immortal that's less gas for sentries/stalkers, and it gets out later or at the same time as the 4gate at best, but GL trying to hold it with fewer or no stalkers, an immortal, and however many zealots you can afford left over.
edit- I mean for Tal'darim not in general.
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I can't agree with people saying PvP is a better mirror than TvT.
ZvZ and TvT have those "Oh shit!" moments where things can all go incredibly wrong in an instant. The 4g v 4g matchup's "Oh Shit!" moment is when one stalker dies, and that doesn't interest me.
Really, unless you go an anti-4g build it basically comes down to who has the first warp in. You might see epic micro wars, but I just see 4 stalkers getting off the first shot and think "Well it's bad micro to lose from here".
Anyway, rant done. (hopes for Puzzle to smack Tassadar around now)
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Just got in to watch this. PvP in the finals...
Is this living up to GSL's Code A or Code S reputation? (Code A = great, Code S = sucks)
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On July 18 2011 18:38 Pyre wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:38 Medrea wrote:On July 18 2011 18:36 Pyre wrote:
Protoss needs like a rock paper scissors in this match up. Like a unit that owns stalkers but dies quickly to zealots. Immortal says hi. Or wait, are you trolling? when do you have a chance to get a immortal in a 4 gate push? I mean something that could be warped in around the same time.
I always open 2gate robo then add a 3rd gate in PvP. I can have a sentry before warp gates is done, a second one right away, and an immortal done just by the time they're in position to warp units up my ramp.
You're not forced to 4gate in PvP.
On retarded maps like Tal'Darim though, there's no choice. 4gate or die.
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On July 18 2011 18:37 Serpico wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:35 Medrea wrote:On July 18 2011 18:34 425kid wrote:
how do people downvote that game? sick micro wars Lot of TL folks dont like to see attacking unless 3 bases are had by both sides. Most of SC 2 so far has been early aggression, dont really care to see more.
As I stated earlier. Lots of people dont care to see players play the game Base Builder 2: Now it Gets Real, for 10 minutes before doing somethign.
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i want immortal warp in! :D
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On July 18 2011 18:35 Ker wrote:
What's wrong with you, guys? Such a micro intensive games, how can you not love it?
You would really rather watch a 40 min TvT where they each take a half of the map and can't move out of base because of a zillion sieged tanks everywhere? ffs
In a word: yes. At least it's not a build designed to end the game in under 7 minutes. I'd rather watch a 6 pool.
A shame really since I'd love to see either of these players shine in a more interesting matchup. The state of PvP isn't their fault, and they can hardly be blamed for using a highly successful strategy.
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maybe make photon cannon avail once gateway is done?
similar to that of spawning pool - spine crawler
and barracks bunker?
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On July 18 2011 18:38 DystopiaX wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:37 Serpico wrote:On July 18 2011 18:35 Medrea wrote:On July 18 2011 18:34 425kid wrote:
how do people downvote that game? sick micro wars Lot of TL folks dont like to see attacking unless 3 bases are had by both sides. Most of SC 2 so far has been early aggression, dont really care to see more. Not even that, it just sucks to see a player lose because he didn't 4gate and his opponent did. Build order losses of any kind suck. Great micro but the deciding factor wasn't control, it was the fact that Tassadar decided to 4gate and puzzle didn't.
they both 4 gated. puzzle just did it a little later and for defense. that should have given him the game if he hadn't made a couple bad decisions.
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On July 18 2011 18:37 Pyre wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:36 shabby wrote:On July 18 2011 18:36 Pyre wrote:
Protoss needs like a rock paper scissors in this match up. Like a unit that owns stalkers but dies quickly to zealots. Like the immortal? like a early game immortal that gets warped in
Or a shield battery? 
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This might actually be the first Code A final that's worse than the Code S finals
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On July 18 2011 18:37 Pyre wrote:
like a early game immortal that gets warped in
who would make stalkers?
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On July 18 2011 18:40 Isaac wrote:
maybe make photon cannon avail once gateway is done?
similar to that of spawning pool - spine crawler
and barracks bunker?
Those can be reused, a 4 gater sees a cannon they throw down a nexus and giggle because you spend 300 minerals and they didn't.
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If hardened shield was removed, damage was reworked, size etc. I could see the immortal being warped in.
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On July 18 2011 18:32 ShootingStars wrote:
puzzle WHY YOU PUT ZELOT AND STALKER SAME HOETKEY -_-
maybe he uses ctrl click to select stalkers, and 1 to use both, i dunno. i think that zealots and stalkers on seperate keys kinda important, but obviously he knows about it and has a reason not too. its not like you can get to Code A finals and be ignorant of something like that
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On July 18 2011 18:40 Ketch wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 18:37 Pyre wrote:On July 18 2011 18:36 shabby wrote:On July 18 2011 18:36 Pyre wrote:
Protoss needs like a rock paper scissors in this match up. Like a unit that owns stalkers but dies quickly to zealots. Like the immortal? like a early game immortal that gets warped in Or a shield battery?
Omg omg. A shield battery would be such a cool building to have in PvP in SC2. Was this ever suggested before? It could potentially make cannon rushes actually powerful, but Im sure it could be balanced around it.
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among other solution, i propose 25% chance of diablo spawning in your base if 4 gates are produced before the 6 minute mark. probably the only way to solve the matchup.
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EPT
