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MLG Columbus Day 3 - Page 1414

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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We will be moderating harshly in this thread. Think twice before you post. Things we are watching for: image macros, balance whining, "eagles", player bashing etc. We encourage civil and reasoned critique of our moderation - please post it in the website feedback forum.

Please don't complain about MLG stream quality or MLG itself. They work very hard to provide you with an enjoyable service.

Enough with the racism discussions, this is a LR Thread. Cut it out.
-- updated 7:55 KST
FataLe
Profile Joined November 2010
New Zealand4557 Posts
June 06 2011 07:54 GMT
#28261
On June 06 2011 16:49 TAMinator wrote:
This is what happens when latency is not involved, koreans win.

Wouldn't go that far. A few of the foreigners had really close series with the koreans. They're ahead of us but to imply that lag is the deciding factor in inter-continental tournaments is pretty silly imo.
hi. big fan.
bennyaus
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Australia1833 Posts
June 06 2011 07:54 GMT
#28262
On June 06 2011 16:51 Serpico wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 16:46 bennyaus wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:42 fartdra wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:38 doffe wrote:
I just want to point out, to everyone maintaining that foreigners have nothing against Koreans that HuK in the last GSL beat MMA 2-0 in the up and down matches... something to consider. Such a shame huk didnt attend MLG


mma didn't scout a proxy 4gate and died in 5 min, great build by huk but it doesn't say as much as you want it to. having a nifty proxy build for one game doesn't win a whole tourney


Luckily HuK massively outplayed his allin with his fast expand build in game 1 then.

And it was still more about MMA playing that horribly than anything else.


Therefore showing that MMA isn't always a fantastic player.... seriously some people will do whatever they can to bring other players down. If MMA played horribly in one game, it still means he was outplayed, and it means he isn't consistent enough to show that he is a better player consistently.
I play Random - HuK, DRG + Liquid fan
baoluvboa
Profile Joined December 2010
743 Posts
June 06 2011 07:55 GMT
#28263
On June 06 2011 16:54 FataLe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 16:49 TAMinator wrote:
This is what happens when latency is not involved, koreans win.

Wouldn't go that far. A few of the foreigners had really close series with the koreans. They're ahead of us but to imply that lag is the deciding factor in inter-continental tournaments is pretty silly imo.


If they have close series then even a small factor such as latency makes all the difference. Your post is pretty much self-contradictory.
fartdra
Profile Joined June 2011
92 Posts
June 06 2011 07:55 GMT
#28264
On June 06 2011 16:46 bennyaus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 16:42 fartdra wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:38 doffe wrote:
I just want to point out, to everyone maintaining that foreigners have nothing against Koreans that HuK in the last GSL beat MMA 2-0 in the up and down matches... something to consider. Such a shame huk didnt attend MLG


mma didn't scout a proxy 4gate and died in 5 min, great build by huk but it doesn't say as much as you want it to. having a nifty proxy build for one game doesn't win a whole tourney


Luckily HuK massively outplayed his allin with his fast expand build in game 1 then.


one series doesn't define a player. what else has huk done in korea besides a set on mma? hwaiting for response
Munchkin
Profile Joined May 2011
Finland99 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 07:57:34
June 06 2011 07:57 GMT
#28265
On June 06 2011 16:48 Labil wrote:
Show nested quote +
Is it possible to lead a balanced life style while being a pro nhl hockey player?

Is it possible to lead a balanced life style while being a pro race car driver?

Is it possible to lead a balanced life style while being a pro tennis player?

etc.etc.etc.

I think you get my point.
If you want to be the best in the world at something, it'll take quite a bit of sacrifices.


That is an absolute joke, being a professional tennis player- and knowing the pratice routine of others, 5 days a week physical training about 2*3 hours. And other times some mental practice and so on, but i still have time for alot of other stuff, i play starcraft 1-2 hours a day for instance, and i seriously think that Starcrat 2 professionals practice alot more then a sport-professional, however, i seriously doubt spending more then 8 hours every day infront of a screen is far from healthy


First off, I never claimed it was healthy.
Being a pro athlete rarely is tho... I've never seen a group of people with as bad knees then Pro footballers.

Have I ever heard of you? (I'm seriously asking, I'm not trying to be an ass)
Because what I meant was people who aspire to be the best in the world.
They are usually not "balanced" people. If you want to be a guitar virtioso it'll take roughyl 10.000h of practice.
If you want to be a virtioso at a video game that has such a a high skill cap as SC:BW / SC2, it'll probably take as much.

Also.. the american / european pros make a very comfortable living (like you I imagine?) but are not the best of the world (also like you I imagine?).
So they are pro players, just not elite pro players (apart from a handful of exceptions (arguably huk,idra,thorzain and a couple of more)) like their Korean counterparts.

edit.

But I think we are going way off topic
Cheeser is as cheeser does.
karpo
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1998 Posts
June 06 2011 07:58 GMT
#28266
On June 06 2011 16:54 bennyaus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 16:51 Serpico wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:46 bennyaus wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:42 fartdra wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:38 doffe wrote:
I just want to point out, to everyone maintaining that foreigners have nothing against Koreans that HuK in the last GSL beat MMA 2-0 in the up and down matches... something to consider. Such a shame huk didnt attend MLG


mma didn't scout a proxy 4gate and died in 5 min, great build by huk but it doesn't say as much as you want it to. having a nifty proxy build for one game doesn't win a whole tourney


Luckily HuK massively outplayed his allin with his fast expand build in game 1 then.

And it was still more about MMA playing that horribly than anything else.


Therefore showing that MMA isn't always a fantastic player.... seriously some people will do whatever they can to bring other players down. If MMA played horribly in one game, it still means he was outplayed, and it means he isn't consistent enough to show that he is a better player consistently.


And some people will do anything to defend their hero. Someone tried to use the fact that Huk beat MMA as some kind of proof that foreigners aren't doing that bad against koreans and someone responded to that, no need to get defensive. There's a difference between having a bad day and just being outplayed.
thoradycus
Profile Joined August 2010
Malaysia3262 Posts
June 06 2011 07:59 GMT
#28267
lol few hrs ago someone said that lebron james gave a shoutout to losira? can ne1 verify this?
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
June 06 2011 08:00 GMT
#28268
Hey Is there a way to watch yesterdays semifinal and final?
You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
FataLe
Profile Joined November 2010
New Zealand4557 Posts
June 06 2011 08:01 GMT
#28269
On June 06 2011 16:55 baoluvboa wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 16:54 FataLe wrote:
On June 06 2011 16:49 TAMinator wrote:
This is what happens when latency is not involved, koreans win.

Wouldn't go that far. A few of the foreigners had really close series with the koreans. They're ahead of us but to imply that lag is the deciding factor in inter-continental tournaments is pretty silly imo.


If they have close series then even a small factor such as latency makes all the difference. Your post is pretty much self-contradictory.

It does, but at the same time only puts more emphasis on my point in that latency is not the deciding factor in which all Koreans lose.
hi. big fan.
StyLeD
Profile Joined January 2011
United States2965 Posts
June 06 2011 08:01 GMT
#28270
On June 06 2011 16:59 thoradycus wrote:
lol few hrs ago someone said that lebron james gave a shoutout to losira? can ne1 verify this?

lol keep dreaming
"Even gophers love Starcraft" - Tasteless. || Davichi | IU <3
skipgamer
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Australia701 Posts
June 06 2011 08:01 GMT
#28271
I loved this tourny, the storylines were amazing. The korea vs the rest of the world rivalry is amazing, and still creating heated debate.

I just hope this display presses non-koreans to train harder than ever before, and put their best foot forward the next time they meet. I'm hoping especially MC's overly arrogant taunting particularly lights some fires.

Good games all round and great job by MLG, was a pleasure to follow.
lintan81
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden20 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 08:04:17
June 06 2011 08:02 GMT
#28272
Praise to MLG!
Probably best SC2-event so far!

edit: hoped they payed the casters and JP top dollar, they deserve it!
Being me is a full time job and I have not missed a day
weeA
Profile Joined October 2010
India442 Posts
June 06 2011 08:03 GMT
#28273
what insane games!!! I had nerd chills every almost every game from the ro 8
Lim Yo Hwan I love U
Loljke
Profile Joined January 2011
Ukraine246 Posts
June 06 2011 08:05 GMT
#28274
!400 pages jesus christ Btw who won ?
o.o
Kleinmuuhg
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Vanuatu4091 Posts
June 06 2011 08:06 GMT
#28275
perfect tourney gg
This is our town, scrub
Veldril
Profile Joined August 2010
Thailand1817 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 08:07:05
June 06 2011 08:06 GMT
#28276
Damn, I missed the game. Need to watch the VoD really soon!!!

BTW, what happened to the TL's Relay Race Challenge?
Without love, we can't see anything. Without love, the truth can't be seen. - Umineko no Naku Koro Ni
Logjamming
Profile Joined April 2011
United States37 Posts
June 06 2011 08:07 GMT
#28277
Who are the top 16 seeds for Anaheim? I can't seem to find the points standings.
fant0m
Profile Joined May 2010
964 Posts
June 06 2011 08:07 GMT
#28278
On June 06 2011 12:43 Nyor wrote:
Let's compare the StarCraft 2 scene with the Marathon running scene. Marathon running scene? Why am I bringing this up here? Let's have a look at a typical sight you will see at most Marathon races around the world. Obviously, this is the front pack:

[image loading]

Just like in StarCraft 2, the best Marathon runners come from one geographical region. In this case, this would be Eastern Africa, Kenya and Ethiopia in particular. Why is this the case? Kenyans and Ethiopians train extremely hard. Marathon running is one way for them to get out of poverty. If they are part of the international elite, they can live from the price money they get at the Marathon races, and support their families as well. Consequently, the elite runners from Kenya and Ethiopia are extremely motivated, and thus work very hard to achieve success. The environment they live also helps them to improve and do better.

Now, let's look at the Europe, or Northern America... Is Marathon running a viable career choice there? No.... The price money one may earn at races in most cases not enough to cover living expenses. The few elite Western Marathon runners highly depend on sponsorship deals in order to keep training; since becoming an elite Marathon runner requires a lot of effort. For all other marathon runners, it's a hobby, not a professions.

While Marathon running and StarCraft 2 are completely different, one may notice a few similarities here and there. The dominating nation in the case of StarCraft 2 is Korea, becoming a pro-gamer is socially accepted in Korea; being a pro-gamer might also be financially rewarding from their point of view. In the "West" however, e-sports isn't really a viable career choice, it is not socially accepted, and financial-wise very risky. It's a hobby, but nothing more. Let's face it, e-sports, will probably never (never say never) achieve the same level of influence that e-sports such have in Korea.

Can/Should you blame the Ethiopians/Kenyans for doing well at Marathons? Absolutely not. Likewise, can/should you blame the the Koreans for playing well in SC2? Absolutely not, either. As long as you see tournaments with reasonably high price moneys, pro-gamers in Korea will continue to exist, and coonsequently do well in tournaments in the West.

Some people say "OMG, but Koreans winning all the time will hurt e-sports growth in the West". I don't think so. First of all, Koreans pro-gamers aren't unbeatable. Secondly, people who get discouraged by these results aren't really into e-sports anyways. Thirdly, Koreans pro's draw in bigger audiences to the tournaments. The success of the Koreans should be a motivation to play better/train harder, not a discouragement. Bigger Audiences -> More Sponsorship Money -> Higher Price Moneys -> More Competition. I think I can safely say that one reason that the MLG drew in such a big audience (both at Columbus and on the internet streams) is because of MC, Moon, MMA, July or Losira. People were excited to see those matches, and were curious to see whether "foreigners" could beat them. Again, bigger audiences were a result of their presence. Fourthly... eSports is not only about the select few winning the big tournaments; it's also about the majority, the "normal skilled" players. This big chunk of players will not simply go awayjust because a few Koreans did well at a big tournament.
Have people in the West completely stopped running marathons just because a few Kenians won some big marathons?


Great post. I didn't think about it, but this analogy makes a lot of sense.

White people used to be able to win marathons, but in the last 30 years it's become common knowledge that there are no white people that can consistently compete for a win most of the time.

And yet the Boston Marathon is still the most popular marathon in the world, not an Ethiopian Marathon. I personally ran in a popular 10k race this spring, the Cooper River Bridge Run. There were 40,000 people registered, and from what I saw the vast majority of those people showed up. Guess who won? A man and a woman from Ethiopia. So what? That didn't stop the 39,000 white people there from still running.
KaRath_
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Australia245 Posts
June 06 2011 08:09 GMT
#28279
I lol'd at the fact that Final 4 was three koreans and Idra

Idra, you can proudly join the ranks of the Koreans <3

MC vs Idra, new rivalry (hopefully friendly?????)
I wasted my nights, you turned out the lights, now I'm paralysed, still stuck in that time...
fant0m
Profile Joined May 2010
964 Posts
June 06 2011 08:10 GMT
#28280
On June 06 2011 16:54 bennyaus wrote:
Therefore showing that MMA isn't always a fantastic player.... seriously some people will do whatever they can to bring other players down. If MMA played horribly in one game, it still means he was outplayed, and it means he isn't consistent enough to show that he is a better player consistently.


MMA has terrible early game in general. I don't think that anyone can really argue that. I would say the vast majority of his losses are due to falling behind early. The insane part is how he wins though. His wins aren't just the games that he manages to stay ahead or even early, but that at least half the time he can crawl out of the early game hole that he dug himself and win.

If MMA can train enough to shore up his early game.... he will be a very, very scary SC2 pro in the years to come.
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