On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
SangHo is good but he's by no means the equivalent of Peyton Manning or Drew Brees - going by his play today there are much better players in this tournament. Yes TLO was unlucky not to be drawn against 'ChickenCombo' or some other no name but at the same time he wasn't drawn up against Clide or Genius or any of the other dozen or so ridiculously good players in this tourney.
There's no fair way of ranking players because no one knows yet who is good or who isn't, there just isn't enough tournaments played yet to properly seed people. Things will settle down in 2011 and good players will be seeded accordingly once it's established who's good and who isn't.
On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
So on one hand you say the better player did not win today (implying TLO is better than Sangho,) yet on the other you complain that the system is luck based on who you play, implying TLO drew a bad hand and played someone as good or better than him?
Your complaints are ridiculous. Why even have tournaments? Let's just crown players as champions via popularity contests.
I can see where you'd interpret it that way. I meant that statement to imply that I was so pissed about SangHo and TLO facing each other in the prelims that I didn't walk away feeling satisfied when SangHo won the match as I normally would. I would have felt the SAME if TLO had won. Both players are absolutely amazing, and I will not be surprised if SangHo wins the Final. It's just ridiculous that we are robbed of watching the losers of these prelim matches.
I agree with this but we won't have true seeding until 2011. The first three GSLs are also qualifiers for S class pro status for the 2011 season
On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
It's an open with random seeding. Tlo will surely be at least a high "a" class a player even if he fails to qualify for gsl3 and with a ro16 showing in gsl 3 could easily be a class s player.
I was under the impression that this tournament WAS the leaque. But now people are writing that there will be a league in 2011 based off results here? Can anyone explain in more detail or lamens terms?
Wow the whining in here is unbelievable. To the guy complaining about seeding, you realize that SangHo is a proven ex-A team progamer and if anyone was seeded he was infact be a top seed, while TLO is just a guy everyone on here likes who has not achieved the same accomplishment or even close to it. The concept of even seeding players in a completely new game is stupid anyway.
On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
TLO and SangHo in the finals... as much as I'd like to see TLO in the finals, it definitely isn't finals worthy, as far as skill is concerned. I can name 5 players playing Terran and 5 playing Protoss better than them in this tourney.
Other than that, I kinda agree with your post, I'm also disappointed that better players go out early while mediocre ones can get to the next round.
Congrats to Babybyebye! TLO should have done better putting a supply to see the attack coming in but, maps like BS and JB are God awful when such mechanics as warp in and 4warp gate are soo strong and difficult to hold even in a normal map.
On October 19 2010 17:03 billyX333 wrote: for new players who hate sangho but dont actually know who he is!!! watch this:
hes a really chill guy and really good at starcraft. you'd like him.
I can't help but put in one final plug for sangho. hes a cool guy and he got trashed by the korean community because of false accusations from the betting scandal. it ruined his reputation and he quit BW. now hes getting trashed by new players who dont know anything about him but are blind fanboy fanatics of TLO. sangho is cool. you should root for him
On October 19 2010 17:25 Wargizmo wrote: SangHo is good but he's by no means the equivalent of Peyton Manning or Drew Brees - going by his play today there are much better players in this tournament. Yes TLO was unlucky not to be drawn against 'ChickenCombo' or some other no name but at the same time he wasn't drawn up against Clide or Genius or any of the other dozen or so ridiculously good players in this tourney.
Pretty unfair to Sangho, there. Considering he recently beat Shuttle, Kal and had a damn good game against Calm in the same day.
On October 19 2010 17:25 Wargizmo wrote: SangHo is good but he's by no means the equivalent of Peyton Manning or Drew Brees - going by his play today there are much better players in this tournament. Yes TLO was unlucky not to be drawn against 'ChickenCombo' or some other no name but at the same time he wasn't drawn up against Clide or Genius or any of the other dozen or so ridiculously good players in this tourney.
Pretty unfair to Sangho, there. Considering he recently beat Shuttle, Kal and had a damn good game against Calm in the same day.
SangHo is good but he's by no means the equivalent of Peyton Manning or Drew Brees - going by his play today there are much better players in this tournament. Yes TLO was unlucky not to be drawn against 'ChickenCombo' or some other no name but at the same time he wasn't drawn up against Clide or Genius or any of the other dozen or so ridiculously good players in this tourney.
There's no fair way of ranking players because no one knows yet who is good or who isn't, there just isn't enough tournaments played yet to properly seed people. Things will settle down in 2011 and good players will be seeded accordingly once it's established who's good and who isn't.
Ok,it was meant as an expression. I think these two are Peyton Manning and Drew Brees compared to the other players in the 1v1 bracket I saw tonight. They were definitely light years better. Even the commentators couldn't believe some of the play by the other competitors.
On October 19 2010 17:25 Wargizmo wrote: SangHo is good but he's by no means the equivalent of Peyton Manning or Drew Brees - going by his play today there are much better players in this tournament. Yes TLO was unlucky not to be drawn against 'ChickenCombo' or some other no name but at the same time he wasn't drawn up against Clide or Genius or any of the other dozen or so ridiculously good players in this tourney.
Pretty unfair to Sangho, there. Considering he recently beat Shuttle, Kal and had a damn good game against Calm in the same day.
On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
In my opinion, a system where TLO, SangHo and the rest of the top players are kept from each other till later in the tournament doesn't make for a fair tournament. It would make it a joke if you were'nt considered a top player, cause they'd intentionally feed you to the best players so you'd be eliminated, while the player who draws the most moves on. It adds a feeling of illegitimacy.
Good players should have to play other good players, depending on the brackets. Anything else is garbage. College Basketball is stupid for that reason, because the NCAA makes the brackets to get viewers, not get the best games.
Uhh yeah, ever heard of tennis? Good, proven players should never have to play each other in initial rounds. Its up to newcomers to break into the scene.
I can't help but put in one final plug for sangho. hes a cool guy and he got trashed by the korean community because of false accusations from the betting scandal. it ruined his reputation and he quit BW. now hes getting trashed by new players who dont know anything about him but are blind fanboy fanatics of TLO. sangho is cool. you should root for him
TLO fanboy's trashing on the beast that is Sangho, people don't have a clue about that game.
On October 19 2010 17:08 SF wrote: The match-up between TLO and SangHo prompted me to create a Liquid account just to post in this thread.
As a new fan to pro gaming, I've been thoroughly enthralled by the entertainment value in SC2. And especially entertained by the creative and obviously talented players.
After watching this round 64 live on GOMtv (for the first time ever), and seeing several mediocre players advance, I am disgusted that somehow the tournament designers managed to put two players that are clearly and obviously massively superior in skill to their round 64 counterparts against each other in a preliminary round, forcing an elimination.
This is the equivalent of having an NFL Quarterback Tournament, by which the winner is decided by elimination in 1v1, and in the very first round Peyton Manning is pitted against Drew Brees, while every other match-up involves a 2nd string nobody.
The outcome of this "GSL" now seems as much decided by pure luck as it is by actual skill. How can a tournament that forces the elimination of top players in the preliminaries be seen as credible whatsoever at all?
I didn't feel as if "the best player won" today, as I would hope to feel. I am a fan of both players, and I felt disgusted and cheated of the pleasure of watching one of my favorite stars play again in the tournament. The TLO vs. SangHo game should have been either in the final of the tournament, best out of 7, or at a minimum the Round of 8.
This needs to be fixed before pro 1v1 gaming becomes a joke. I'm sure a new system can be devised that pits players of appropriate skill at appropriate times in a tournament against each other.
P.S. The Rankings by GSL are pathetic. TLO = a "private", and a fake "Boxer" is now going to be a "Sergent" or something? That's like calling Babe Ruth a "little leaguer" and telling a bench warmer that he's "MVP" because the refs didn't know how to set up a fair game.
P.P.S. And yes, I'm very pissed right now, so apologies if any of this seems like "hating", but it's also important, because this is the "new guys" opinion on something that seemed so cool at first, and now seems lame.
In my opinion, a system where TLO, SangHo and the rest of the top players are kept from each other till later in the tournament doesn't make for a fair tournament. It would make it a joke if you were'nt considered a top player, cause they'd intentionally feed you to the best players so you'd be eliminated, while the player who draws the most moves on. It adds a feeling of illegitimacy.
Good players should have to play other good players, depending on the brackets. Anything else is garbage. College Basketball is stupid for that reason, because the NCAA makes the brackets to get viewers, not get the best games.
Uhh yeah, ever heard of tennis? Good, proven players should never have to play each other in initial rounds. Its up to newcomers to break into the scene.
Problem is the game is too new to have 'proven' players yet. How does someone in charge of seeding differentiate SangHo from Apple or BabyWerra when none of those players have actually achieved anything yet in Sc2.
EPT
Bleach < 
Loner
BabyWeRRa 
