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On December 13 2016 12:27 geokilla wrote:
As a bio player, what's the best way to play against Roach Ravager now that we can't lift Tanks anymore? I find my Tanks die really easily to Corrosive Bile now. Been trying to watch Innovation stream but it's difficult to do when I'm at work.
You kind of have to play a bio mech style w/ liberators. You use drops to take the army out of position while you set up a very large siege arc. Make sure your tanks are spread out same with liberators or they will just die to bile. As well when I say bio mech I just mean like you want a lot of tanks now like 10-12 is a good # and then 4-6 liberators should do
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The way I have been playing mech is opening up 2 rax no gas. Zergs either think its a reaper rush or when they see the marines they overreact with lings.
If they open up hatch 1st you have time until ~3:30 to snipe ovies with ur constant marine production until speed finishes. Behind that you have your natural and a 3rd CC before taking any gases. The follow up is mech. Hellions let you take your 3rd very early.
If the 2 rax triggers a bane bust, it puts Zergs much more behind. You can defend it easily with marines and 2 to 3 bunkers outa 2 rax.
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On December 13 2016 22:21 Ryu3600 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2016 12:27 geokilla wrote:
As a bio player, what's the best way to play against Roach Ravager now that we can't lift Tanks anymore? I find my Tanks die really easily to Corrosive Bile now. Been trying to watch Innovation stream but it's difficult to do when I'm at work. You kind of have to play a bio mech style w/ liberators. You use drops to take the army out of position while you set up a very large siege arc. Make sure your tanks are spread out same with liberators or they will just die to bile. As well when I say bio mech I just mean like you want a lot of tanks now like 10-12 is a good # and then 4-6 liberators should do
With Marauders? Or no Marauders?
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On December 13 2016 23:35 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2016 22:21 Ryu3600 wrote:On December 13 2016 12:27 geokilla wrote:
As a bio player, what's the best way to play against Roach Ravager now that we can't lift Tanks anymore? I find my Tanks die really easily to Corrosive Bile now. Been trying to watch Innovation stream but it's difficult to do when I'm at work. You kind of have to play a bio mech style w/ liberators. You use drops to take the army out of position while you set up a very large siege arc. Make sure your tanks are spread out same with liberators or they will just die to bile. As well when I say bio mech I just mean like you want a lot of tanks now like 10-12 is a good # and then 4-6 liberators should do With Marauders? Or no Marauders?
So lets say you've got like 3-4 bases you basically want like
7-8 Rax
2-3 Factories
1-2 Starport (one having techlab for raven/librange)
and your rax should be like 4 reactors 4 techlab
Factories double Techlab
Starport Reactor Techlab
You do want marauders but eventually the marauders will begin to be outscaled so you want to transition into late game sky terran or like mech heavy. (Cause a 4 armor roach will take away 8 marauder damage...)
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hay I have a question, Im prity inexperienced with mech play but after watching Inovation vs Dark at IEM I want to try playing the cyclone hellion build ino uses. One thing I noticed about the series is inovations complete lack of anti air. He scans darks main, so maybe he is looking for the spire. How Does terran react when going this build to address mutalisks? What if zerg manages to sneak a spire in an odd location that you dont scan? do you build thors or vikings as an answer? When do you know when to stop building anti air, if the zerg tech switches out of spire tech.
For context: I'm a prity decent bio player, currently masters 3 but I have not played mech vs zerg since wings of liberty.
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On December 19 2016 15:57 washikie wrote:
hay I have a question, Im prity inexperienced with mech play but after watching Inovation vs Dark at IEM I want to try playing the cyclone hellion build ino uses. One thing I noticed about the series is inovations complete lack of anti air. He scans darks main, so maybe he is looking for the spire. How Does terran react when going this build to address mutalisks? What if zerg manages to sneak a spire in an odd location that you dont scan? do you build thors or vikings as an answer? When do you know when to stop building anti air, if the zerg tech switches out of spire tech.
For context: I'm a prity decent bio player, currently masters 3 but I have not played mech vs zerg since wings of liberty.
Well. you should probably use pretty instead of prity  aside from that you often want to make around 2-3 thors if you see mutas or at latest when your third is landed both gasses are being mined at it. Also INnoVation opens CC First on Vaani, and Whirlwind.
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On December 14 2016 05:45 Ryu3600 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2016 23:35 geokilla wrote:On December 13 2016 22:21 Ryu3600 wrote:On December 13 2016 12:27 geokilla wrote:
As a bio player, what's the best way to play against Roach Ravager now that we can't lift Tanks anymore? I find my Tanks die really easily to Corrosive Bile now. Been trying to watch Innovation stream but it's difficult to do when I'm at work. You kind of have to play a bio mech style w/ liberators. You use drops to take the army out of position while you set up a very large siege arc. Make sure your tanks are spread out same with liberators or they will just die to bile. As well when I say bio mech I just mean like you want a lot of tanks now like 10-12 is a good # and then 4-6 liberators should do With Marauders? Or no Marauders? So lets say you've got like 3-4 bases you basically want like 7-8 Rax 2-3 Factories 1-2 Starport (one having techlab for raven/librange) and your rax should be like 4 reactors 4 techlab Factories double Techlab Starport Reactor Techlab You do want marauders but eventually the marauders will begin to be outscaled so you want to transition into late game sky terran or like mech heavy. (Cause a 4 armor roach will take away 8 marauder damage...)
What if it's earlier when you have only 2 CCs? I'll be watching Innovation's stream and IEM to try and learn the builds but he does play in an unorthodox way, especially with his love for mech.
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On December 20 2016 02:56 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2016 05:45 Ryu3600 wrote:On December 13 2016 23:35 geokilla wrote:On December 13 2016 22:21 Ryu3600 wrote:On December 13 2016 12:27 geokilla wrote:
As a bio player, what's the best way to play against Roach Ravager now that we can't lift Tanks anymore? I find my Tanks die really easily to Corrosive Bile now. Been trying to watch Innovation stream but it's difficult to do when I'm at work. You kind of have to play a bio mech style w/ liberators. You use drops to take the army out of position while you set up a very large siege arc. Make sure your tanks are spread out same with liberators or they will just die to bile. As well when I say bio mech I just mean like you want a lot of tanks now like 10-12 is a good # and then 4-6 liberators should do With Marauders? Or no Marauders? So lets say you've got like 3-4 bases you basically want like 7-8 Rax 2-3 Factories 1-2 Starport (one having techlab for raven/librange) and your rax should be like 4 reactors 4 techlab Factories double Techlab Starport Reactor Techlab You do want marauders but eventually the marauders will begin to be outscaled so you want to transition into late game sky terran or like mech heavy. (Cause a 4 armor roach will take away 8 marauder damage...) What if it's earlier when you have only 2 CCs? I'll be watching Innovation's stream and IEM to try and learn the builds but he does play in an unorthodox way, especially with his love for mech.
He honestly played a game exactly like this earlier today...he had just added two more factories (tech labbed) to go up to 5 total and started making thors immediately when he saw the mutas...other than that he threw down a lot of missile turrets to dissuade the mutas from being too aggressive and continued defending until he had a strong force and then moved out at 180'ish supply with hellbats/cyclones/tanks/thors. He really didn't do too much with the starport. He also saw the muta numbers and knew it wasn't a huge commitment but was more of a harassing group to attempt to keep him at home defending which is why he had a good tank count.
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What is the best defensive opening in TvT?
I am trying to figure out which opening is best in TvT if you wish to open defensively and not attacking your opponent until mid game.
It needs to work against 3 rax reaper, 1-1-1 marine/viking/tank pushes, fast banshee and 2-1-1 double medivac drops.
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On December 20 2016 22:34 MockHamill wrote:
What is the best defensive opening in TvT?
I am trying to figure out which opening is best in TvT if you wish to open defensively and not attacking your opponent until mid game.
It needs to work against 3 rax reaper, 1-1-1 marine/viking/tank pushes, fast banshee and 2-1-1 double medivac drops.
http://lotv.spawningtool.com/build/41668/ (TvT Banshee Raven, a little hard to pull off but very good)
http://lotv.spawningtool.com/build/41761/ (TvT Cyclone Reaper pretty stupid but effective)
Also there is no definite counter to 3rax reaper. Just do a 17 scout every TvT no matter who its against.
also 2/1/1 should never work in TvT lmao reason? because you'll have a tank out or more to hold it off.
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On December 21 2016 00:46 Ryu3600 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2016 22:34 MockHamill wrote:
What is the best defensive opening in TvT?
I am trying to figure out which opening is best in TvT if you wish to open defensively and not attacking your opponent until mid game.
It needs to work against 3 rax reaper, 1-1-1 marine/viking/tank pushes, fast banshee and 2-1-1 double medivac drops. http://lotv.spawningtool.com/build/41668/ (TvT Banshee Raven, a little hard to pull off but very good) http://lotv.spawningtool.com/build/41761/ (TvT Cyclone Reaper pretty stupid but effective) Also there is no definite counter to 3rax reaper. Just do a 17 scout every TvT no matter who its against. also 2/1/1 should never work in TvT lmao reason? because you'll have a tank out or more to hold it off.
Yeaaaaaaaah, and the fact that 2-1-1 opens with rax expand...in tvt that's a very good way of losing to any agression so you shouldn't see it often, if ever.
You can't hold everything while opening exactly the same though, otherwise literally everyone would be doing the same exact build. You have to learn how to adapt.
If you suspect 3 rax just make a second reaper, a bunker near your rax at the top of your ramp and wait until you get enough hellions to be safe (number depends on well you defend early on)
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How should you position your army on overgrowth if you play mech vs bio?
I expand horizontally and it seems really hard to defend both my 3rd and my main in the first 1-2 minutes after taking my third.
Either I position my army near my third and then he doom drops in my main and I lose the game or
I position my army in my main and then he kill my third (or at least forces a lift off) before I can get my army in place.
I have turrets in my main but I can not invest in enough turrets this early in the game to be safe from doom drops.
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Are there any tips on how to face 2 base muta? I feel a bit dumb playing vs it, i am to scared to move out, and by the time i feel safe enough to do so, he already got a lot of stuff to defend any aggression
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37072 Posts
How is TvT these days? Now that tankivacs have been removed, what is the new meta?
I'm trying to figure out whether or not I need to go back to my HotS roots or if I need to learn a new LotV meta. Are people meching more these days for TvT?
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On December 22 2016 05:30 AleXusher wrote:
Are there any tips on how to face 2 base muta? I feel a bit dumb playing vs it, i am to scared to move out, and by the time i feel safe enough to do so, he already got a lot of stuff to defend any aggression
If you open hellions and you scout it early enough you can throw down an armory and go for a quick hellbat timing before the mutas are out which should usually do a lot of damage and buys enough time for you to get turrets and a bunch of marines out.
Also a 2 base allin can be very strong against it, Heromarine said that with proper control a 2 base allin should be a 100% win against 2 base muta.
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On December 23 2016 18:34 Seeker wrote:
How is TvT these days? Now that tankivacs have been removed, what is the new meta?
I'm trying to figure out whether or not I need to go back to my HotS roots or if I need to learn a new LotV meta. Are people meching more these days for TvT?
mech is more common than it used to be but the majority of my opponents still play bio
nearly everyone is going for some variation of reaper cyclone expand (some 15/17 double gas, some gas first reaper expand)
VIKINGS are super strong and need to be emphasized, also pretty much everyone is getting 1 raven because autoturrets are so strong
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Has anyone got mech to work in TvP?
I have tried two different styles, hellbat/tank/viking and mine/tank/viking. With both compositions I aim to kill them shortly after I have taken my 3rd. I do one big push and try to hit them before they get carriers out.
Now I have gotten much better results when I use widow mines instead of hellbats as they are much more versatile and protect your tanks from adept much better then what hellbats do.
The problem is either my push kills them of they manage to get Carriers out which means I typically lose a few minutes later.
The only way to kill Carriers is with Battlecruicers since Vikings are so vulnerable to splash.
So I have changed my style to trying to play for the long game instead and start to get BCs as soon as I have 3 bases. This means that if they start to mass Carriers I have a decent chance since BCs beat Carriers given equal numbers. The problem is that if they just invest in in ground units instead of Carriers they can just a-move through my 3rd and kill me since the investment in star ports and a few BCs weaken my ground army at that stage in the game.
Unfortunately Protoss do not seem to suffer the same fate, adding a few Carriers do not make the vulnerable since Carriers are a better unit in small numbers, especially since the interceptors mess with your units targeting system.
So what are your thoughts on this? Is it better to to kill them before Carriers or try to go for the BCs? Is there any point to using hellbats instead of mines since hellbats suck so much against adepts? Which upgrades should you prioritize? I always get armour first now in order to be able to fight carriers better but this means the tanks will dish out less damage.
Is there any other mech style that is better in TvP?
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What's the counter to mutalisks after the nerf of liberators? All zergs abuse on massive mutalisk and not even mines are able to hold them.
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On December 24 2016 20:01 Damien wrote:
What's the counter to mutalisks after the nerf of liberators? All zergs abuse on massive mutalisk and not even mines are able to hold them.
Against big muta flocks you want thors just like in HotS. Alongside with anything else you can get that shoots up (marines, mines, turrets, vikings/libs).
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On December 24 2016 20:01 Damien wrote:
What's the counter to mutalisks after the nerf of liberators? All zergs abuse on massive mutalisk and not even mines are able to hold them.
I really don't understand why ppl just read "Lib nerf" and stop considering it an anti-Muta tool anymore. Before the nerf they absolutely demolished mutas. Now they are a decent counter. Get 6 to 10 libs and watch the muta flock die instantly. Did you even try it? If they go mass muta then libs are more than great. Thors are good as well.
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EPT
