EPTI think that you can overlord at 18 and not miss out on anything whatsoever. It's slightly more economical i think.
A Second Overview of HotS Zerg - Page 10
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Zorkmid
4410 Posts
I think that you can overlord at 18 and not miss out on anything whatsoever. It's slightly more economical i think. | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 05 2013 07:38 Lobotomist wrote: Blade, how do you feel about 3 hatch before pool vs gate expands? I've seen pros use it pretty frequently, and it seems to work vs the late scouting that toss usually do. to me it seems risky, and very vulnerable to pylon blocks or zealot/stalker/msc pokes. When and how should one execute a 3-hatch before pool build? only when toss doesn't scout and you suspect a gate expand? if you see a gate expand? Only to metagame your opponent? Hm I am not a fan of 3 hatch before pool because of how late the ling upgrade is and I feel vulnerable. It's viable, just my cup of tea I swear every time I do it I get punished for it lol. I would 3 hatch before pool if I scout it (or nexus first), if protoss doesn't scout at all I would as well (I would scout for potential proxies though). On November 05 2013 17:27 Zorkmid wrote: In the Hatch into Pool - vs 1 Rax expand, also viable against reaper expand. I think that you can overlord at 18 and not miss out on anything whatsoever. It's slightly more economical i think. by hatch into pool do you mean can you do it vs rax expand? Any kind of expand is good versus that I guess I am not sure what you are saying/asking here. No if you overlord at 18 you will be supply blocked once your pool finishes (unless you 3 hatch before pool) for a few seconds. It's not better. | ||
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Zorkmid
4410 Posts
On November 05 2013 17:27 Zorkmid wrote: No if you overlord at 18 you will be supply blocked once your pool finishes (unless you 3 hatch before pool) for a few seconds. It's not better. I'm talking about 15 hatch, 16 pool, 18 overlord vs Terran. Ovie pops at same time the pool finishes. | ||
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THAmarx
65 Posts
If i like to do hatch first vs toss.... but how do i deal with pylon blocks? | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 08 2013 18:52 THAmarx wrote: hey blade, If i like to do hatch first vs toss.... but how do i deal with pylon blocks? If a protoss is committing to a pylon block you will have to pool first. Unless you want to take the 3rd as your base first which he can still pylon block as well which then just forces you to pool first. | ||
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SkullZ9
Belgium2048 Posts
Do you think your ZvP build is still the best ? I see nowadays that pros use a lot of hydras timing push with a lot of mutas switches as well. I really need to improve my ZvP to punish protoss players, after Jaedong lost yesterday :p | ||
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Moonsalt
267 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 10 2013 21:59 SkullZ9 wrote: Hi Blade, Do you think your ZvP build is still the best ? I see nowadays that pros use a lot of hydras timing push with a lot of mutas switches as well. I really need to improve my ZvP to punish protoss players, after Jaedong lost yesterday :p There are a lot of ways to play zvp now, I think playing like the style jaedong plays is good and then doing some of the styles I written is good as well. Don't look that hard at jaedongs losses to sos yesterday, game 1 he just messed up badly, game 2 cannon rush through him and did a lot more damage and sos just played really cheesy and did some weird stuff that threw jaedong off. Jaedongs style of zvp is really strong would definitely look at him if you want to see other zvp builds. | ||
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Solanek
Romania7 Posts
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Umpteen
United Kingdom1570 Posts
On November 11 2013 01:13 blade55555 wrote: Don't look that hard at jaedongs losses to sos yesterday, game 1 he just messed up badly, game 2 cannon rush through him and did a lot more damage and sos just played really cheesy and did some weird stuff that threw jaedong off. Jaedongs style of zvp is really strong would definitely look at him if you want to see other zvp builds. Don't remind me. For me that was the least satisfying end to WCS imaginable. If you can imagine Rita Skeeter wandering in and shooting Harry Potter just after he kills Voldemort, that's what it felt like. No disrespect to SoS implied. It's just that I'd followed JD all year and never seen SoS play a single match, and then he wins (partly) by doing the most infuriating thing a Protoss can do. Kinda hard to get behind that  + Show Spoiler + | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 14 2013 18:24 Solanek wrote: This guide will be update with new patch changes like widow mine nerf,,oracle boost speeed etc?? Great guide !! There isn't really a need to update with the mine nerf or oracle boost speed. Playing against oracles is same as before (spore at each base with some queens). Widow mine same thing except if you mess up it doesn't punish you as hard. | ||
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Salient
United States876 Posts
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AFSpeeDy
126 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 15 2013 22:16 ArkanTos wrote: How do i take the third against reapers? They just camp on my third and when my queens are there, the hellions are already there and start damaging my queens. I always lose all my queens against reapers + 6 hellions. But if i dont to my third they kill my third with the reapers and hellions. How do i deal with that? (Mid Master Level) I take my third before the hellions are out. Metabolic boost upgrade should be done before they arrive (and if not just send 6-8 slow lings at the reaper and then a drone behind it to take it). That's how I take my third before hellion/reaper. | ||
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AFSpeeDy
126 Posts
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Rotodyne
United States2263 Posts
But I have a question, I just played a guy who called me a dirty whore after I said gl hf. As soon as I knew I won the game, (when he made like 10 drones at his expo) I started talking shit to him. I easily overran him with lings and he claimed I won because he was high. Did I respond correctly? I was pretty drunk at the time. I think that an experienced high player will usually beat a drunk player. But it really depends on a lot of other factors. I can't believe I just wrote this all out, fuck me. | ||
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Destruktor
Spain60 Posts
On a standar macro game against Toss I use the standard gasless opening and I try to make drones until 8:00 ( 3 saturated bases) but usually I lose vs 2 base all-ins like 7 gates, inmortal all-in and stuff like this I think because overdrone. Question: When I have to cut my drone production vs 2 base all-in to have enough economy to hold it? Maybe when I see it or when I have 2 base saturation? Thanks in advanced. | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On November 17 2013 06:21 Destruktor wrote: Hi Blade! Plat. Zerg here! On a standar macro game against Toss I use the standard gasless opening and I try to make drones until 8:00 ( 3 saturated bases) but usually I lose vs 2 base all-ins like 7 gates, inmortal all-in and stuff like this I think because overdrone. Question: When I have to cut my drone production vs 2 base all-in to have enough economy to hold it? Maybe when I see it or when I have 2 base saturation? Thanks in advanced. You should be droning based on what your opponent is doing. Don't always drone until 8:00 because a 7 gate hits before that and you will just die. Scouting with overlords and having good map awareness is very important, especially versus protoss (you see a probe leaving you want to follow it, want to know when protoss moves out and what he's doing). If you sacrifice an overlord and see 5 gateways being morphed in (and he's on 2 bases) you don't want to continue droning, that's a situation you start making units to prepare for the all in. Knowing when to stop droning all depends on what you scout and what your opponent is up to. For example a protoss who takes a greedy 3rd you can either try to punish it or be extremely greedy yourself. I Just have to react to what you scout! On November 16 2013 15:18 Rotodyne wrote: Okay, so first of all, I haven't played starcraft seriously in a while. I played "seriously" in late 2012, and I did pretty well thanks to blades youtube guides and was playing people high on the masters ladder (thanks blade!). But I have a question, I just played a guy who called me a dirty whore after I said gl hf. As soon as I knew I won the game, (when he made like 10 drones at his expo) I started talking shit to him. I easily overran him with lings and he claimed I won because he was high. Did I respond correctly? I was pretty drunk at the time. I think that an experienced high player will usually beat a drunk player. But it really depends on a lot of other factors. I can't believe I just wrote this all out, fuck me. A good response to greedy play can be an all in, but there could be other situations to look out for as he probably could have held it if he had a baneling nest and you started making units after he made 10 drones he could have held assuming he wasn't being super super super greedy. Not really sure what else to say xD | ||
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theonlyshaft
United States581 Posts
One thing I've always disliked about writing though is it doesn't have a visual element; it's hard to read a book about learning to cook, for instance, unless you're already pretty damn good at it In that vain, I took the most game changing part of this guide, for me at least, and made a video about it that I hope everyone else can enjoy. Namely, it's the ZvZ style blade seems to advocate, mutaling blind swarmhost into fast ultralisks. Simply amazing Hope I did it justice, but here's a link to my TL thread on it if anyone wants to check it out: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434913#6 | ||
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theonlyshaft
United States581 Posts
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