EPTi'm trying more infestor play but i only use fungals.
gold zerg here.
The HotS Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 48
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hearters
Singapore224 Posts
i'm trying more infestor play but i only use fungals. gold zerg here. | ||
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Glon
United States569 Posts
On May 10 2013 13:08 hearters wrote: what are the uses of infested terrans in hots for ZvT and ZvP? i'm trying more infestor play but i only use fungals. gold zerg here. ZvT Infested Terrans are almost exclusively used to trigger widow mines. ZvP Infested terrans are used for Harass I guess. Not much other use. | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
In Muta wars, why don't Zergs ever go Corruptors? Corruptors aren't that much slower than Mutas, cost the same amount of gas, and a Muta/Corruptor army would surely win in a straight fight vs. pure Muta, and you already have the Spire. | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On May 10 2013 14:54 Salivanth wrote: Protoss here, who is curious about ZvZ's that I've watched. In Muta wars, why don't Zergs ever go Corruptors? Corruptors aren't that much slower than Mutas, cost the same amount of gas, and a Muta/Corruptor army would surely win in a straight fight vs. pure Muta, and you already have the Spire. Corruptors are slow (yes they are quiet a bit slower then mutalisks). They also can't attack ground. So the zerg player would avoid corruptors and then get a roach army and then you have corruptors which are useless in a main fight so you end up losing as corruptors are also a little more expensive then mutalisks as well. | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
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hearters
Singapore224 Posts
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Giganthrax
Serbia19 Posts
I heard you need to check if they take gases in their natural. Supposedly, if they get early gas, they're turtling. If they don't, they're going for 2 base big push/all-in. But from my experience, sometimes toss gets double gas and then dt rushes me and often catches me unprepared because I thought he was making a deathball. This gets me into a rather confused state where sometimes I make roaches/lings to defend, but then the attack doesnt come and when the deathball arrives it just kills me outright because I don't have higher tier units to defend with. What do I do? How the hell do I scout this? Also, on maps where the gases are positioned so that overlord scouting them is nearly impossible, how do you keep track of them? | ||
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Hiwashi
United States43 Posts
I know that several Zergs have been successfully winning or doing tons of damage with this roach timing and wanted to try it out myself. | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
Midmaster EU zerg here Simple question : How do you beat the tank/raven with viking/BC support composition of terrans ? | ||
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logic13
Sweden128 Posts
On May 11 2013 00:33 Insoleet wrote: Hello, Midmaster EU zerg here Simple question : How do you beat the tank/raven with viking/BC support composition of terrans ? By mirroring his composition and scouting.. He's got a little bit of everything, and you need to have it to. The important thing is to scout it in time for the transition so you dont end up remaxing on roaches or something. When you see the starport transition, i'd go for ultra/ling/hydra/queen/infestor/corruptor/viper.. a little bit of everything as I said. But scouting here is your friend. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
On May 11 2013 01:21 Cry4Me wrote: By mirroring his composition and scouting.. He's got a little bit of everything, and you need to have it to. The important thing is to scout it in time for the transition so you dont end up remaxing on roaches or something. When you see the starport transition, i'd go for ultra/ling/hydra/queen/infestor/corruptor/viper.. a little bit of everything as I said. But scouting here is your friend. imo corruptor are VERY bad vs raven viking because of PDD and vikings itself. imo its better to either go ultra ling hydra infestor viper and do a lot of counter attacking and nydus play or go for turtling SH queen hydra spore infestor viper also with a lot of nydusplay. what you really need to look for is ghosts. once T starts adding emp, snipes and nukes to that comp i am not sure if you can beat it. | ||
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Diks
Belgium1880 Posts
On May 10 2013 15:58 Salivanth wrote: What if you just mixed in a few corruptors? Like, when both sides have 20+ Mutas, a round of even 6-8 Corruptors would make a huge difference, and at that stage a roach switch just wouldn't work, right? I've been splashing some corruptors in my muta compositions in zvz for a long time. They are awesome for winning the air battle ! Your mutas can dance around them, abuse the range, get advantage of the fact that they are tanky, they really are great units to take over the air battle. Yes, if you do too many and the opponent tech switch, you feel bad, but if you saw 15+ mutalisks and you want to win the air battle, splashing a few in the muta composition is very cost effective in an air to air fight. I know pros don't do that, but in my experience, this is a good way to win the muta war | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
On May 11 2013 01:21 Cry4Me wrote: By mirroring his composition and scouting.. He's got a little bit of everything, and you need to have it to. The important thing is to scout it in time for the transition so you dont end up remaxing on roaches or something. When you see the starport transition, i'd go for ultra/ling/hydra/queen/infestor/corruptor/viper.. a little bit of everything as I said. But scouting here is your friend. Well the problem is not really scouting, its more "how to beat this comp in a straight up fight" What would be the ideal comp... Maybe a good comp would be like vP : a bit of swarmhosts, ultra/hydra/vipers... But how do you beat this stupid mass seeker missiles.... When the terrans got 12 Ravens, it seems impossible to micro against it, you can just try to disengage, but thats means you eat free tanks shot and lose everything... Maybe you can only try to counter attack a lot with a lot of nydus play yeah... That seems crazy ^^' | ||
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ManiacTheZealot
United States490 Posts
On May 11 2013 00:33 Insoleet wrote: Hello, Midmaster EU zerg here Simple question : How do you beat the tank/raven with viking/BC support composition of terrans ? Alright so like if he gets to a comp like this you're best bet I think would be to turtle it out with corruptor/viper swarmhost/infestor and just be more cost efficient. Building spine/spore forests and sniping units with vipers whenever you can. Yamoto cannon will probably be annoying but hopefully you can snipe off bc's everytime he tries that. Follow your locust in so you have vision. You never actually engage him in a straight up fight. You run away from seeker missles back to your spines and spores. It would be a long ass game. But you'd probably win because you wouldn't lose much and he would lose a lot to abduct. | ||
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Superiorwolf
United States5509 Posts
On May 10 2013 23:25 Hiwashi wrote: Is there any good written or video material teaching/explaining how to execute the Roach/Baneling/Zergling "allin" vs Terran that that Suppy used 2 times to beat Ryung and how to transition out of it if it doesn't kill the Terran but still does tons of economical damage? I know that several Zergs have been successfully winning or doing tons of damage with this roach timing and wanted to try it out myself. Here's my notes for the build order Hatch Gas Pool, ling speed 5:50 resume gas mining 6:00 hatch 6:10 add 2nd + 3rd gas 6:10 RW Stop drone production at 2 base full saturation Baneling nest at RW completion 13 roaches, rally lings behind Hit at about 8:45 | ||
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rustypipe
Canada206 Posts
On May 10 2013 16:21 hearters wrote: how do i micro zerglings and banelings from widow mines when they are in a group? anyone has tips? the korean pros make it look so easy. I've been having problems with this as well when the big mid game pushes come at you with a ton of marine rauder mine combo's. I was finding it really hard to get 5+ mines to all trigger before engaging with the mnm army over it or near it. So what I started experimenting with is sacing 2-3 over lords since I always have OL speed anyhow and usually have a really high bank by then. 3 OL can usually survive long enough to execute most of the mines. Aside from that I try to catch the army before it can get setup kinda like catching siege before they create the seige line. That way even if the terran still burrows the mines it will detonate on his own army killing yours and his. Hope this helps some | ||
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DilemaH
Canada402 Posts
On May 10 2013 21:04 Giganthrax wrote: How can you scout if toss is going for 2 base all-in or just turtling in his base, making a deathball? I heard you need to check if they take gases in their natural. Supposedly, if they get early gas, they're turtling. If they don't, they're going for 2 base big push/all-in. But from my experience, sometimes toss gets double gas and then dt rushes me and often catches me unprepared because I thought he was making a deathball. This gets me into a rather confused state where sometimes I make roaches/lings to defend, but then the attack doesnt come and when the deathball arrives it just kills me outright because I don't have higher tier units to defend with. What do I do? How the hell do I scout this? Also, on maps where the gases are positioned so that overlord scouting them is nearly impossible, how do you keep track of them? Early game ZvP post FFE (until 7-9 minutes) is a very difficult time for lower league zergs because of the huge variety that protoss can be doing. If they take gas, they still may all in or not. Gas only limits their options. Heres a list of things that can happen. Name: +1 4-Gate Goal/description: To take out the zerg's third base off of 4 gateways with zealots, sentries, the msc and somethimes stalkers to get a macro lead How to read: First 100 gas invested into forge, lots of chronos on warp gate and forge Reaction: roach warren, take faster gas, spine crawlers Name: Phoenix expand/play Goal/description: To create 4-5 phoenixes to assure map control, killing overlords and some drones How to read: Fast double gas on the expo, usualy a stalker is prefered over a sentry. Reaction: Spore crawler and spire/hydra mid game transition Name: Immortal sentry all in Goal/description: Move out at 9:00-10:00 minutes with 3 immortals and 7 sentries, eventualy warp prism and 7 gateways to end the game with a brutal and powerful all in. How to read: Fastish +1 attack and warp gate with some chronos, robotics facility and chrono boosts on the robo facility and no expand at 9:00 - 10:10 with fastish double gas. (NOTE: Immortal sentry expand is another option with more chrono boosts on probes, therefore having less army, but enough to expand at 10:00) Reaction: Lots of methods. A swell of speedlings before 9:00 to bait forcefields and deny moving out until roaches/hydras are out. You can also spam spine crawlers at the natural choke/main choke and base race. If they have an msc, making them mass recall isnt bad as you can then get out the tech needed to sweep this all in if they push back. You can then take your third (if you lost it) and 4th. Recommended hydra transition and with corrupters as colossus pushes are next on their list of death. Name: Fast third Goal/description: take advantage of the zerg's macro oriented early game by taking a risky and greedy 3rd base off of a handful of units (usualy zealots and sentries). How to read: 7:00 expand, no early double gas at expo Reaction: Stop droning early, get fast gas and attack or macro up to par with them thats quite a bit of them. | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
On May 11 2013 05:57 DilemaH wrote: Early game ZvP post FFE (until 7-9 minutes) is a very difficult time for lower league zergs because of the huge variety that protoss can be doing. If they take gas, they still may all in or not. Gas only limits their options. Heres a list of things that can happen. Name: +1 4-Gate Goal/description: To take out the zerg's third base off of 4 gateways with zealots, sentries, the msc and somethimes stalkers to get a macro lead How to read: First 100 gas invested into forge, lots of chronos on warp gate and forge Reaction: roach warren, take faster gas, spine crawlers Name: Phoenix expand/play Goal/description: To create 4-5 phoenixes to assure map control, killing overlords and some drones How to read: Fast double gas on the expo, usualy a stalker is prefered over a sentry. Reaction: Spore crawler and spire/hydra mid game transition Name: Immortal sentry all in Goal/description: Move out at 9:00-10:00 minutes with 3 immortals and 7 sentries, eventualy warp prism and 7 gateways to end the game with a brutal and powerful all in. How to read: Fastish +1 attack and warp gate with some chronos, robotics facility and chrono boosts on the robo facility and no expand at 9:00 - 10:10 with fastish double gas. (NOTE: Immortal sentry expand is another option with more chrono boosts on probes, therefore having less army, but enough to expand at 10:00) Reaction: Lots of methods. A swell of speedlings before 9:00 to bait forcefields and deny moving out until roaches/hydras are out. You can also spam spine crawlers at the natural choke/main choke and base race. If they have an msc, making them mass recall isnt bad as you can then get out the tech needed to sweep this all in if they push back. You can then take your third (if you lost it) and 4th. Recommended hydra transition and with corrupters as colossus pushes are next on their list of death. Name: Fast third Goal/description: take advantage of the zerg's macro oriented early game by taking a risky and greedy 3rd base off of a handful of units (usualy zealots and sentries). How to read: 7:00 expand, no early double gas at expo Reaction: Stop droning early, get fast gas and attack or macro up to par with them thats quite a bit of them. To complete this small list, I strongly suggest to read the awesome Belial ZvP guide, particularly the "scouting" section. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=320038 Its from WoL, but mostly still valid. | ||
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greenroom
United States20 Posts
I was wondering if there's any good early pressure builds I can do in zvp? I used to play a good amount in wings of liberty but I'm just starting to play again and I've found that if toss makes a mothership core, or any air really, I'm forced to stay in my base until I'm at lair tech. I've tried to do bane busts, which can be successful, but only in niche situations. I haven't really explored roach rushes too much, but I imagine they would be very similar to a bane bust, except more effective vs zealots. Any good recommendations for me? Links to build orders would be amazing too! Thanks! | ||
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DilemaH
Canada402 Posts
On May 11 2013 06:10 greenroom wrote: Hi all, plat zerg here. I was wondering if there's any good early pressure builds I can do in zvp? I used to play a good amount in wings of liberty but I'm just starting to play again and I've found that if toss makes a mothership core, or any air really, I'm forced to stay in my base until I'm at lair tech. I've tried to do bane busts, which can be successful, but only in niche situations. I haven't really explored roach rushes too much, but I imagine they would be very similar to a bane bust, except more effective vs zealots. Any good recommendations for me? Links to build orders would be amazing too! Thanks! My favorite playstyle. Highly recommend it if youre into mid game pressure. | ||
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