EPTJust wondering if any are viable with MSCs around.
The HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 285
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yido
United States350 Posts
Just wondering if any are viable with MSCs around. | ||
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Jazzman88
Canada2228 Posts
On June 13 2014 10:56 yido wrote: Are there any pre medvac TvP timings anymore? Just wondering if any are viable with MSCs around. Polt does a build where he goes Reaper FE into 3-rax, but adds on a second Tech Lab really quickly and gets Concussive Shell as well as Stim and really quick Marauder production. Poke at the natural with your first Marauder and about 6 Marines (assuming no proxy Oracle), force the Overcharge and pick off something if possible, and get out. Return at something like 8:30-9:00 or so with a lot of Marauders. If the Protoss underprepares for this (for example, by getting Colossi AND double Forge or just skipping everything to get Colossi out really fast with no support units), you can quite easily score a kill on the Nexus. Downsides to this are if they recognize it early and go for a few Immortals and Sentries in addition to their normal play. It slows their Colossi down, but that army can fight a bio one with no Medivacs, and your Medivacs are going to be quite delayed thanks to this, leaving you in a somewhat awkward position. | ||
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geokilla
Canada8252 Posts
I should note I am like Polt and only play Bio. I don't really like Mech because it is so immobile. Plus I just don't play Mech so I don't know the builds or timings. http://www.ggtracker.com/matches/5131580 | ||
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Dreamer.T
United States3584 Posts
On June 13 2014 13:13 Jazzman88 wrote: Polt does a build where he goes Reaper FE into 3-rax, but adds on a second Tech Lab really quickly and gets Concussive Shell as well as Stim and really quick Marauder production. Poke at the natural with your first Marauder and about 6 Marines (assuming no proxy Oracle), force the Overcharge and pick off something if possible, and get out. Return at something like 8:30-9:00 or so with a lot of Marauders. If the Protoss underprepares for this (for example, by getting Colossi AND double Forge or just skipping everything to get Colossi out really fast with no support units), you can quite easily score a kill on the Nexus. Downsides to this are if they recognize it early and go for a few Immortals and Sentries in addition to their normal play. It slows their Colossi down, but that army can fight a bio one with no Medivacs, and your Medivacs are going to be quite delayed thanks to this, leaving you in a somewhat awkward position. I've actually been doing this most of my tvp, seems to work most of the time on ladder. What is the standard medivac timings though? Also this is unrelated to tvp, but more for tvz. Does anyone know polt's 4 marauder dropship build vs zerg? | ||
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
Also this is unrelated to tvp, but more for tvz. Does anyone know polt's 4 marauder dropship build vs zerg? Yeah and it's quite bad tbh. | ||
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Dreamer.T
United States3584 Posts
So only works under certain situations, of which rarely occur? | ||
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mau5mat
Northern Ireland461 Posts
On June 14 2014 03:37 Dreamer.T wrote: So only works under certain situations, of which rarely occur? It's just sub par really, if you want to do something with marauders maybe look into a marauder/hellbat/banshee timing or similar. | ||
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PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
On June 14 2014 06:28 mau5mat wrote: It's just sub par really, if you want to do something with marauders maybe look into a marauder/hellbat/banshee timing or similar. To add to this, most of Polt's builds are really inefficient in terms of army, econ, and tech (they dont get up a ton of army really quickly yet sacrifice econ and tech anyway) but they are extremely efficient in terms of their map control benefits. However, thinking of map control as a resource and using it efficiently and well to offset loss of econ, tech, and army is so high level and difficult to do correctly that basically no one does it besides Polt, so unless you are a strategic genius you probably shouldn't try it. | ||
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B-rye88
Canada168 Posts
On June 14 2014 06:35 PinheadXXXXXX wrote: To add to this, most of Polt's builds are really inefficient in terms of army, econ, and tech (they dont get up a ton of army really quickly yet sacrifice econ and tech anyway) but they are extremely efficient in terms of their map control benefits. However, thinking of map control as a resource and using it efficiently and well to offset loss of econ, tech, and army is so high level and difficult to do correctly that basically no one does it besides Polt, so unless you are a strategic genius you probably shouldn't try it. OTOH, playing this style and attempting to get better at capitalizing on map control might MAKE you a strategic genius. Ladder is just practice, after all  | ||
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Dreamer.T
United States3584 Posts
On June 14 2014 06:35 PinheadXXXXXX wrote: To add to this, most of Polt's builds are really inefficient in terms of army, econ, and tech (they dont get up a ton of army really quickly yet sacrifice econ and tech anyway) but they are extremely efficient in terms of their map control benefits. However, thinking of map control as a resource and using it efficiently and well to offset loss of econ, tech, and army is so high level and difficult to do correctly that basically no one does it besides Polt, so unless you are a strategic genius you probably shouldn't try it. Tbh, I think polt just free styles it on NA ladder. You can get away with these builds, and I actually find them pretty simple to use compared to more focused and optimized ones. | ||
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GumBa
United Kingdom31935 Posts
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Dreamer.T
United States3584 Posts
On June 14 2014 21:31 GumBa wrote: So what do you guys think about the new hellbat timings which Flash Zaeja etc have been using? I have been having alot of fun with them but what kind of transitions do you do in the case of not outright winning? Mech? 3rdcc and macro? Stim and extra rax to continue the attack? Would like to hear what you guys do Just add on extra rax and continue hellion production to keep pressure or have some map control. You should do enough damage that even if it failed to kill, the zerg shouldn't immediately be able to hit you. If you feel it's safe, just play it out like a standard macro game and get a 3rd CC. | ||
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NexT_SC2
United States117 Posts
http://drop.sc/382757 In that game, he goes for an early siege tank doom drop and I clean it up without too much trouble. Then I go for a counter attack to find that he has turtled hard so I start changing to mech only to find he has gone mass ravens...never seen that before. | ||
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geokilla
Canada8252 Posts
On June 14 2014 01:49 geokilla wrote: My macro and micro slipped a bit in the beginning. Is that the reason why I lost in this game? How am I supposed to win in a TvZ match such as this after that bad start? I'm looking for my Masters promotion and I just can't seem to get it. That mass Muta ball and mass Baneling ball is very difficult to deal with and I really don't know how to deal with it. Thors are too slow, though they were great in this particular game. Widow Mines deal more damage against my Marines than against Zerglings and Banelings. I don't have the Godly micro of Polt, Taeja, or Bomber either. Reading a couple posts above, it seems that I need more Marauders and have them at the front of the line to tank the Baneling explosions? I should note I am like Polt and only play Bio. I don't really like Mech because it is so immobile. Plus I just don't play Mech so I don't know the builds or timings. http://www.ggtracker.com/matches/5131580 bump | ||
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t0ssboy
Bulgaria681 Posts
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Bulugulu
Israel250 Posts
On June 15 2014 16:50 t0ssboy wrote: How do you deal with DT Openeres vs Protoss? They usually hide their tech quite well and when the DTs come the game goes quite bad,because the scans are going to be too few.Any ideas on how to react or recongnise a DT opener? If it's proxied on the 3rd pylon, then you should be scouting the map with scv/reaper while getting an engibay for potential oracles. Then you can get a single defensive turret anywhere and you should be good if it does happen to be dts. Scout your opponents chronoboost - with DTs he will be chronoing his cybercore or maybe his nexus, but not his gate or an unseen building. If you see him expending chrono on a building you can't see, assume twilight/stargate - Otherwise DT. Second, watch unit production. He will want to conserve his gas for DTs, that probably means no more than 1 stalker and no sentries. Also he will try to deny your scout aggressively and get a probe out on the map. Have you seen a probe out on the map? Did a scout probe leave your base and not return to the protoss base? Was there no scout probe? All these are tells for a possible proxy pylon. Finally, if you're still uncertain after collecting all this information - Save energy for a scan around 6:30-7ish (fastest dts are around 6:30 or slightly earlier). Also, learn to recognize when your scv scout gets to his base - whether he is mining with 3 probes per gas or just 2. 2 = MSC expand most likely, or delayed pressure. 3 = almost certainly some kind of cheese or pre-expand aggression. If you see 3, simply save a scan at the right time and you should be fine. | ||
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mau5mat
Northern Ireland461 Posts
On June 15 2014 16:50 t0ssboy wrote: How do you deal with DT Openeres vs Protoss? They usually hide their tech quite well and when the DTs come the game goes quite bad,because the scans are going to be too few.Any ideas on how to react or recongnise a DT opener? Seen quite a lot of pro Terrans just build a safety turret at the front of their nat at around 7min, just food for thought. | ||
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KingofGods
Canada1218 Posts
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Jer99
Canada8159 Posts
On June 16 2014 07:05 KingofGods wrote: The 7 min turret is for oracles on 2 base. It's more like 8:30 for dts on 2 base. 2 base DT can hit earlier than 8:30 | ||
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Pursuit_
United States1330 Posts
2 base DT hits a lot earlier than 8:30, iirc Tail's 2 base DT Warp Prism drop hits around 7:30. | ||
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