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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. |
Is there a build out there (PvT combating the 1:1:1) that involves 1g robo + forge and quick armor upgrades? If so how effective, and if not would anyone be interested in testing out different variations of this concept?
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Canada13389 Posts
On September 24 2011 10:00 ChroMaTe_ wrote:
The hell is up with those stupid Zealot rushes on any map imaginable on ladder. Like seriously, nerf 4gate, so go 4 gate mass zealots. Jesus christ.
It is frustrating yes but as long as you deny the in base proxies and chrono your warpgate out you should be able to make enough zealots to hold so long as you fight with the ramp. If you realise there is no way to stop it with your own zealots then its much better to get a forge down and a cannon in the mineral line to help protect the probes (in my experience). Then again im only diamond so others may have better responses. Chronoing zealots only while trying to get warpgate up is another option? (not sure about this one I usually just chrono WG and try to keep them from warping in my base) Just be sure not to try and match them with 16 probes on minerals and none on gas since once they do a little bit of damage to you economically they can put probes in gas and eventually reinforce with stalkers.
Though the forge kind of puts you even whereas being able to hold while continuing to mine gas you are generally in a better position. If they can be denied high ground warp in, and you can keep them near the ramp then stalkers with zealots at the wall is very effective at winning.
Just be sure to scout their gas timing since its easy to stay alive and see if they pull units off of gas or not.
If others have better advice please give 
EDIT:
Just thinking out loud here but with regards to PvP:
Hmm. So now that its looking like its collossus wars again, would a build holding the 4 gate that gets stargate up be preferable with regards to giving you the option to expand vs. a build that relies on robo play? I feel with improved immortal range opening pheonix - expanding and then transitioning into robo play for that (once upon a time) unit composition of pheonix immortal be a good way to go. By forcing stalkers to deal with the pheonix getting immortals out in conjunction with zealots (excess minerals after all) would give you a reasonably mobile force while allowing you to safely defend your expansion. Providing the opponent goes one robo collossus you might have a timing available before lance is done or too many collossi are out to do some damage.
Perhaps transitioning into collossus yourself once a strong immortal base is there for you and assuming you can maintain a decent number of pheonix for scouting/harass.
Thoughts? I really hate mass collossus play in PvP and find it quite frustrating so I would rather find a different way of handling the matchup than simply making 2 robo collossus off 2 base.
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I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this?
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On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this?
I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition.
For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive.
If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest.
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On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest.
Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE.
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On September 24 2011 10:06 DanceSC wrote:
Is there a build out there (PvT combating the 1:1:1) that involves 1g robo + forge and quick armor upgrades? If so how effective, and if not would anyone be interested in testing out different variations of this concept?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=264470
It's pretty solid build ...
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On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE.
I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.)
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United States8476 Posts
On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.)
Cannons don't really help much at all if you don't have sentries, and you want some sentries versus a ghost opening anyways.
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On September 24 2011 08:14 k3m4 wrote:
Im searching for a 3 gate robo build thats safe against 4 gate, blink all-ins and all those aggressive styles and especially i'd like to know how to respond correctly to what you scout. Something like: if you scout fast 2nd gas and no energy on nexus you can get 1-gate robo or even nexus. I know about the compilation of anti 4 gate builds thread but the builds there only work when your opponent is 4-gating and if he isnt you r behind, so the most important thing would be how to change up the build to always be maximum greedy without dying.
I'm using a build where you choronoboost probes twice and then the first stalker once. This allows you to get zealot stalker stalker sentry out of your first gateway. With these units you should be able to deny any pylons under your ramp or close to it. The robo is at about 30 food which means it's still fast if your opponent is not 4gating. If you scout chrono on probes, a second gas or something like that you can also get the robo before gate 2 and 3.
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On September 24 2011 16:34 4kmonk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.) Cannons don't really help much at all if you don't have sentries, and you want some sentries versus a ghost opening anyways.
Yes, if he's pushing you with 2 ghosts that's 2 EMPs. make 4-5 sentries and spread them out so you can forcefield him anyways.
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Canada13389 Posts
On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.)
I find if I have an obs out and I see that he went fast expo into ghost play (ghost - stim timing) with bunkers at the front then you can easily expand and tech to collossus investing in getting one or two out and having 4 gateways down without worrying too much about having a huge ground force. Focusing on zealots and spreading the sentries helps really well. As long as you can micro the collossus from dying to marauders you should be fine since emp doesnt do too too much against them.
This is a greedy play to tech fast collossus but I do it when I see bunkers going down at the front i know im safe at least for the interim. I usually take this route if I have done a 2 gate robo fast obs opening.
As always if i am wrong let me know
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On September 24 2011 21:29 ZeromuS wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.) I find if I have an obs out and I see that he went fast expo into ghost play (ghost - stim timing) with bunkers at the front then you can easily expand and tech to collossus investing in getting one or two out and having 4 gateways down without worrying too much about having a huge ground force. Focusing on zealots and spreading the sentries helps really well. As long as you can micro the collossus from dying to marauders you should be fine since emp doesnt do too too much against them. This is a greedy play to tech fast collossus but I do it when I see bunkers going down at the front i know im safe at least for the interim. I usually take this route if I have done a 2 gate robo fast obs opening. As always if i am wrong let me know
That sounds about right. What do you guys do against a gasless FE into double medivac push off of 3 rax btw? My 3gate double forge always dies to it haha I think I might need a fourth gateway faster.
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Canada13389 Posts
On September 24 2011 21:48 Latedi wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 21:29 ZeromuS wrote:On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.) I find if I have an obs out and I see that he went fast expo into ghost play (ghost - stim timing) with bunkers at the front then you can easily expand and tech to collossus investing in getting one or two out and having 4 gateways down without worrying too much about having a huge ground force. Focusing on zealots and spreading the sentries helps really well. As long as you can micro the collossus from dying to marauders you should be fine since emp doesnt do too too much against them. This is a greedy play to tech fast collossus but I do it when I see bunkers going down at the front i know im safe at least for the interim. I usually take this route if I have done a 2 gate robo fast obs opening. As always if i am wrong let me know That sounds about right. What do you guys do against a gasless FE into double medivac push off of 3 rax btw? My 3gate double forge always dies to it haha I think I might need a fourth gateway faster.
For me against Gasless FE I go for a:
1 gate FE into 3 more gates + one forge for armour. I focus on zealots and some sentries. So I aim for a zealot archons type of gameplay but I get a robo up for an obs and I like to go DT instead of HT to begin with. I feel with DTs you can delay some pushes out on the map if they are walking about and I like to do DT drops with a warp prism. The nice thing about the DTs is they can defend early drops like the one you are describing and if a warp prism with one dt has made it to his base then you can usually do some economic damage while they are likewise dropping. The DT being dropped is less of an investment than the drop the terran is doing so if you trade even or ahead on your end the dt should be able to do some damage on the other. Most terrans dont put turrets in the mineral line and instead put it in front.
Probably wont work at your level but its worth trying DT tech instead of HT tech when doing zeal archon and see how it goes for ya . I find early on DTs are better than HT against Terran and the added benefit of being able to harass with the DT and warp prism is very fun and scans are more scarce before 3 base so i like to take advantage of that fact.
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On September 24 2011 08:49 Swad1000 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 08:14 k3m4 wrote:
Im searching for a 3 gate robo build thats safe against 4 gate, blink all-ins and all those aggressive styles and especially i'd like to know how to respond correctly to what you scout. Something like: if you scout fast 2nd gas and no energy on nexus you can get 1-gate robo or even nexus. I know about the compilation of anti 4 gate builds thread but the builds there only work when your opponent is 4-gating and if he isnt you r behind, so the most important thing would be how to change up the build to always be maximum greedy without dying. The Day9/Liquid Tyler PvP 1 gate robo build is a strong build if you really want to go robo every game. A strong timing off of 1 base robo is something like 3 immortals and 2 colossus with 4 gates warping in at your opponents front. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=238165Naniwa had a strong pvp robo build during Homestory Cup 3 but I never bothered to go back and rewatch him play with it.
I'd like to have a more standard build cuz you can see exactly whats coming from like the first ti
me you ever scout and then just go air/ zealot archon and the tyler 1 gate robo player is screwed
and i dont have to go robo every game if i scout a build thats kills a robo build id just do something else but i dont think there is one
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On September 23 2011 22:55 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 22:34 Latedi wrote:On September 23 2011 22:21 OskO wrote:On September 23 2011 14:18 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 12:37 ZeromuS wrote:On September 23 2011 06:30 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 06:15 ZeromuS wrote:
I havent won a PvZ in over 10 games with the exception of holding a 6 pool and following up for a win. Infestors,roaches, mutas, broodlords no matter what I have been completely and entirely losing. What build should I look to to bring me out of this terrible slump? Sounds like you're playing too passive. Try going Blink/Chargelot with a forge constantly upgrading (two forges once 3 base), and have a robo out for observers. In Diamond league, playing like this will really help you improve general playing skills due to the amount of things needed to be done in order to win. You can also use Warp Prisms from your Robotics once you have your Observers out. No Colossus or Immortals, and don't get more than 4-5 Sentries early game. You should be able to take a pretty fast third. Do you have replays? I don't see how even a well upgraded gateway only force would work for me without higher tech units. When should I incorporate stuff like High Templar, and other tech units - after I take a 3rd base? Also, when should I attack in order to make this army work for me? Should I turtle and use the warp prism as my main form of harass or be moving about the map to force the army of the Z to move so I can have a good warp prism based attack? How many gates should I be working off of? Im very lost PvZ now and need more than a simple blink/chargelot idea to work off of and would love to have a gameplan or idea of 1 gate fe vs forge fe vs 3 base before Teching (excluding the necessary obs) etc. You still have me added right? I'll play some games against a Diamond opponent around your skill level and get you a replay or two. I'd like to see those replays too :D I'm a mid Diamond lvl Protoss and I'm way out of shape due to my lack of time to play the past month. I'd like to know wich openers are recommended to play as a standard for each matchup with the current metagame, so I can start training asap.  I suggest you 1gate expand in PvT and PvZ while doing one of the safe builds for PvP, I think 4kmonk has a thread where he listed most of them. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=266786
Many thanks, that thread seems promising. I'll give it a shoot and be back if I need some advice on something more specific.
I still want to see Cecil's Replays tho.
Cheers!.-
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On September 25 2011 00:17 OskO wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 22:55 Geiko wrote:On September 23 2011 22:34 Latedi wrote:On September 23 2011 22:21 OskO wrote:On September 23 2011 14:18 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 12:37 ZeromuS wrote:On September 23 2011 06:30 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 06:15 ZeromuS wrote:
I havent won a PvZ in over 10 games with the exception of holding a 6 pool and following up for a win. Infestors,roaches, mutas, broodlords no matter what I have been completely and entirely losing. What build should I look to to bring me out of this terrible slump? Sounds like you're playing too passive. Try going Blink/Chargelot with a forge constantly upgrading (two forges once 3 base), and have a robo out for observers. In Diamond league, playing like this will really help you improve general playing skills due to the amount of things needed to be done in order to win. You can also use Warp Prisms from your Robotics once you have your Observers out. No Colossus or Immortals, and don't get more than 4-5 Sentries early game. You should be able to take a pretty fast third. Do you have replays? I don't see how even a well upgraded gateway only force would work for me without higher tech units. When should I incorporate stuff like High Templar, and other tech units - after I take a 3rd base? Also, when should I attack in order to make this army work for me? Should I turtle and use the warp prism as my main form of harass or be moving about the map to force the army of the Z to move so I can have a good warp prism based attack? How many gates should I be working off of? Im very lost PvZ now and need more than a simple blink/chargelot idea to work off of and would love to have a gameplan or idea of 1 gate fe vs forge fe vs 3 base before Teching (excluding the necessary obs) etc. You still have me added right? I'll play some games against a Diamond opponent around your skill level and get you a replay or two. I'd like to see those replays too :D I'm a mid Diamond lvl Protoss and I'm way out of shape due to my lack of time to play the past month. I'd like to know wich openers are recommended to play as a standard for each matchup with the current metagame, so I can start training asap. I suggest you 1gate expand in PvT and PvZ while doing one of the safe builds for PvP, I think 4kmonk has a thread where he listed most of them. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=266786 Many thanks, that thread seems promising. I'll give it a shoot and be back if I need some advice on something more specific. I still want to see Cecil's Replays tho. Cheers!.-
I was online most of yesterday and nobody messaged me to make them ><
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Canada13389 Posts
On September 25 2011 00:18 CecilSunkure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2011 00:17 OskO wrote:On September 23 2011 22:55 Geiko wrote:On September 23 2011 22:34 Latedi wrote:On September 23 2011 22:21 OskO wrote:On September 23 2011 14:18 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 12:37 ZeromuS wrote:On September 23 2011 06:30 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 23 2011 06:15 ZeromuS wrote:
I havent won a PvZ in over 10 games with the exception of holding a 6 pool and following up for a win. Infestors,roaches, mutas, broodlords no matter what I have been completely and entirely losing. What build should I look to to bring me out of this terrible slump? Sounds like you're playing too passive. Try going Blink/Chargelot with a forge constantly upgrading (two forges once 3 base), and have a robo out for observers. In Diamond league, playing like this will really help you improve general playing skills due to the amount of things needed to be done in order to win. You can also use Warp Prisms from your Robotics once you have your Observers out. No Colossus or Immortals, and don't get more than 4-5 Sentries early game. You should be able to take a pretty fast third. Do you have replays? I don't see how even a well upgraded gateway only force would work for me without higher tech units. When should I incorporate stuff like High Templar, and other tech units - after I take a 3rd base? Also, when should I attack in order to make this army work for me? Should I turtle and use the warp prism as my main form of harass or be moving about the map to force the army of the Z to move so I can have a good warp prism based attack? How many gates should I be working off of? Im very lost PvZ now and need more than a simple blink/chargelot idea to work off of and would love to have a gameplan or idea of 1 gate fe vs forge fe vs 3 base before Teching (excluding the necessary obs) etc. You still have me added right? I'll play some games against a Diamond opponent around your skill level and get you a replay or two. I'd like to see those replays too :D I'm a mid Diamond lvl Protoss and I'm way out of shape due to my lack of time to play the past month. I'd like to know wich openers are recommended to play as a standard for each matchup with the current metagame, so I can start training asap. I suggest you 1gate expand in PvT and PvZ while doing one of the safe builds for PvP, I think 4kmonk has a thread where he listed most of them. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=266786 Many thanks, that thread seems promising. I'll give it a shoot and be back if I need some advice on something more specific. I still want to see Cecil's Replays tho. Cheers!.- I was online most of yesterday and nobody messaged me to make them ><
I was online for less than an hour so i couldnt message you :X
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On September 24 2011 16:34 4kmonk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.) Cannons don't really help much at all if you don't have sentries, and you want some sentries versus a ghost opening anyways.
I generally have 2 sentries when the push comes. Usually my first colossus is coming out right about then so the cannon makes sure I live to see it.
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On September 24 2011 22:34 ZeromuS wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 21:48 Latedi wrote:On September 24 2011 21:29 ZeromuS wrote:On September 24 2011 16:22 sam!zdat wrote:On September 24 2011 13:57 CecilSunkure wrote:On September 24 2011 13:38 domooooooo wrote:On September 24 2011 11:30 Catchafire2000 wrote:
I'm losing to Terran because I don't know how to put on some early pressure/aggresion... How does one do this? I do believe you are suppose to use your stalker to poke in and out of the Terran's ramp every so often to find out what his unit composition. At least that is what I was taught and told to do. After that you make stuff that counters his unit composition. For example: If i go for a Gate Expand against Terran and I find MM. I place a forge and cannons to protect my natural expo so that my base stays alive. If you mean actual aggression, then just try to produce Gateway units, but make sure you have sentries to split his army. After that it should be really easy to take care of the rest. Pretty good advice except for the cannon part. I'd say only time I use cannons like that is against marine/banshee allins without tanks, but that's pretty rare. Usually just sentry+stalker/zeal can easily take car of pre-medivac aggression, even if you FE. I use a cannon sometime against that (frankly, kinda terrible) ghost push off of an expansion. That's so I can tech to colossus while playing a bit greedy on gateway units (since once I scout ghost I don't wanna build any sentry.) I find if I have an obs out and I see that he went fast expo into ghost play (ghost - stim timing) with bunkers at the front then you can easily expand and tech to collossus investing in getting one or two out and having 4 gateways down without worrying too much about having a huge ground force. Focusing on zealots and spreading the sentries helps really well. As long as you can micro the collossus from dying to marauders you should be fine since emp doesnt do too too much against them. This is a greedy play to tech fast collossus but I do it when I see bunkers going down at the front i know im safe at least for the interim. I usually take this route if I have done a 2 gate robo fast obs opening. As always if i am wrong let me know That sounds about right. What do you guys do against a gasless FE into double medivac push off of 3 rax btw? My 3gate double forge always dies to it haha I think I might need a fourth gateway faster. For me against Gasless FE I go for a: 1 gate FE into 3 more gates + one forge for armour. I focus on zealots and some sentries. So I aim for a zealot archons type of gameplay but I get a robo up for an obs and I like to go DT instead of HT to begin with. I feel with DTs you can delay some pushes out on the map if they are walking about and I like to do DT drops with a warp prism. The nice thing about the DTs is they can defend early drops like the one you are describing and if a warp prism with one dt has made it to his base then you can usually do some economic damage while they are likewise dropping. The DT being dropped is less of an investment than the drop the terran is doing so if you trade even or ahead on your end the dt should be able to do some damage on the other. Most terrans dont put turrets in the mineral line and instead put it in front. Probably wont work at your level but its worth trying DT tech instead of HT tech when doing zeal archon and see how it goes for ya . I find early on DTs are better than HT against Terran and the added benefit of being able to harass with the DT and warp prism is very fun and scans are more scarce before 3 base so i like to take advantage of that fact.
Hmm yeah that DT tech on 2 bases is pretty interesting, I'm not to good with using it but it gives you more archons. DT drops is also really fun to do I have been doing it a few times. Terran's are, like you say, not very fond of making more than 1 turret. Also the attack i mentioned is not a drop, its marine marauder produced from 3rax which attacks when the first 2 medivacs are done. This is a pretty strong terran timing but ghosts will be late. Defending this push with DTs might be worth a shot
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EPT
