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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. |
On December 28 2011 05:53 eugalp wrote:
In PvT, if I scout double gas, should I add a second gas myself and get a stargate asap? I feel like with a 1 gas 30 food FE, I don't have nearly the amount of gas I need to get a proper unit composition to fight banshees (stalkers, obs, phoenixes).
You only really need 3 stalkers in your mineral line to ward of banshees, and cloak will come late enough for you to have your observer, and have scouted it.
Sounds like you're overreacting to banshees a bit.
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50-55 is waaaaay too many for playing vs 1 base play. he's probably investing ~4.5k in scvs MAX. are you really gonna invest more than twice that and try to have it pay off by the time he hits? not gonna happen TT 40, and even that is a lot, does quite fine
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omg horrible typo, sorry bout that ^^
I obviously meant 30-35 workers 
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I thought 30s was good to stop against 1 base play? :o
There we go :D
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Well we could teach Alej some math too.
~4.5k invested in SCVs is 90 of them, that's a late game zerg
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On December 28 2011 08:57 Latedi wrote:Well we could teach Alej some math too. ~4.5k invested in SCVs is 90 of them, that's a late game zerg
LOL some how 30*50 came out to be 4.5k hahaha
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I've been trying FFE lately, going for some 6 gate timings to either snipe third or cause some amount of damage. But, aside from working out gas timings/cannon timings, i seem to get rolled by ling/muta play. Any suggestions on how to ease the mass muta?
Should I get a stargate into phoenix/void?
What else would someone suggest to counter muta play?
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On December 28 2011 09:28 BretZ wrote:
I've been trying FFE lately, going for some 6 gate timings to either snipe third or cause some amount of damage. But, aside from working out gas timings/cannon timings, i seem to get rolled by ling/muta play. Any suggestions on how to ease the mass muta?
Should I get a stargate into phoenix/void?
What else would someone suggest to counter muta play?
a relatively quick 3rd, blink asap obviously, and ht eventually is the best way to deal with it.
you're going to have to split into 2 groups. i find a good split is one group of pure stalker and the other your sentries, whatever stalkers you need to at least hold off the flock with cannon assistance until your other group arrives, and the rest of your shit like zealot/immortals.
once you have storm and 6 ht, cannons at each mineral line (3 or 4 should be able to at least delay muta flock for a second) and you hit max, just fucking go for it! they will probably try to base trade you, but your army should be stronger. take out the mining bases and keep on warping in stalkers/cannons/ht to whatever base(s) you have left and reestablish your infrastructure while sniping his 4th/5th/3rd. these games are never pretty. here's one i just played as an example
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/16638
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Hello teamliquid I am a high gold protoss and I have been doing terrible againts terran recently. I am mainly losing to hellion and banshee harass and I cant find a solution againts it. While I am getting harassed the terran is getting ahead of me and I lose to a push after the harassment so my question is how do I deal with this kind of harassment? I have been going 1g FE btw
Replay: http://drop.sc/80260
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Recently on some player streams I've seen players go gate robo gate expand in PvT. This used to be a common build but I thought it got phased out because it gave a fairly late expo and sets you behind?
Is this true? or is it actually plausible to use this build for standard PvT.
I've seen this mostly on Yong's and Artosis' streams.
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On December 28 2011 09:58 DropTester wrote:
Recently on some player streams I've seen players go gate robo gate expand in PvT. This used to be a common build but I thought it got phased out because it gave a fairly late expo and sets you behind?
Is this true? or is it actually plausible to use this build for standard PvT.
I've seen this mostly on Yong's and Artosis' streams.
It's not as good economically but it allows you to be safer and put on some pressure. For example you might not want to 1gate FE on maps like metalopolis in close air positions as 2rax will be very dangerous. Also you can chronoboost immortals and get some gateway units and see if you can bust any bunkers or kill something else off if you find a weak spot. If terran is still in his main for some reason it's nice to get an observer too and snipe whatever you can from his wall.
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On December 28 2011 09:55 TNK wrote:Hello teamliquid I am a high gold protoss and I have been doing terrible againts terran recently. I am mainly losing to hellion and banshee harass and I cant find a solution againts it. While I am getting harassed the terran is getting ahead of me and I lose to a push after the harassment so my question is how do I deal with this kind of harassment? I have been going 1g FE btw Replay: http://drop.sc/80260
I may not be that good, but I think you really are simply misinterpreting why you are losing. It isn't because you lost 13 probes, but because you were inconsistent to make them, and the opponent macrod relatively much better. To be honest, he didn't do enough damage to justify that late of a CC. In the time that you ahve the extra nexus, you probably could have produced enough more to justify the loss. (I may be wrong here)
In order to avoid that kind of hellion harass, surround the edge of your base with pylons to spot for shenanigans and drops. But again, if you were constantly producing probes you would have only been slightly behind in probe count at that point. And if you chronod double nexus probes you would have soon caught up.
That major engage was bad. You ahd half the army up the ramp, you didn't spot the attack coming. Also, you needed some sort of AOE, whether it be archons, storm, etc. you didn't really have upgrades either. Mostly you didn't make probes, and your army comp was extremely ill suited to kill his mass bio.
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On December 28 2011 09:58 DropTester wrote:
Recently on some player streams I've seen players go gate robo gate expand in PvT. This used to be a common build but I thought it got phased out because it gave a fairly late expo and sets you behind?
Is this true? or is it actually plausible to use this build for standard PvT.
I've seen this mostly on Yong's and Artosis' streams.
Gate robo gate nexus is wonderful for fending off conc shell pressure and 2gate. I use it on metal and shattered, especially if I scout rax -> gas.
Totally viable.
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On December 28 2011 06:03 mizU wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2011 05:53 eugalp wrote:
In PvT, if I scout double gas, should I add a second gas myself and get a stargate asap? I feel like with a 1 gas 30 food FE, I don't have nearly the amount of gas I need to get a proper unit composition to fight banshees (stalkers, obs, phoenixes). You only really need 3 stalkers in your mineral line to ward of banshees, and cloak will come late enough for you to have your observer, and have scouted it. Sounds like you're overreacting to banshees a bit.
Perhaps I am overreacting but I was under the impression that fast double gas means they are probably going for a 2 port banshee or some kind of ski-terran build. In that case 3 stalkers will be nearly enough, especially since you need to cover 2 bases.
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I played a PvZ earlier on Antiga Shipyard, I saw no pool so I went for nexus first FFE, I pull back my scouting probe to the corner of his third and lo and behold he is going for his third. I think to myself, "If he is sticking down his hatch now he cannot have afforded to have built his pool yet" so I plant down my third as well.
Long story short I end up slaughtering the poor zerg. But I actually don't know if I made a good decision or if i just got incredibly lucky (he was a league below me and he didn't spot my third until the 8minute mark).
Did I make the right decision?
Or should I stick to punishing such greed (like I have always done in the past) ?
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On December 28 2011 10:39 Latedi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2011 09:58 DropTester wrote:
Recently on some player streams I've seen players go gate robo gate expand in PvT. This used to be a common build but I thought it got phased out because it gave a fairly late expo and sets you behind?
Is this true? or is it actually plausible to use this build for standard PvT.
I've seen this mostly on Yong's and Artosis' streams. It's not as good economically but it allows you to be safer and put on some pressure. For example you might not want to 1gate FE on maps like metalopolis in close air positions as 2rax will be very dangerous. Also you can chronoboost immortals and get some gateway units and see if you can bust any bunkers or kill something else off if you find a weak spot. If terran is still in his main for some reason it's nice to get an observer too and snipe whatever you can from his wall.
On December 28 2011 13:37 mizU wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2011 09:58 DropTester wrote:
Recently on some player streams I've seen players go gate robo gate expand in PvT. This used to be a common build but I thought it got phased out because it gave a fairly late expo and sets you behind?
Is this true? or is it actually plausible to use this build for standard PvT.
I've seen this mostly on Yong's and Artosis' streams. Gate robo gate nexus is wonderful for fending off conc shell pressure and 2gate. I use it on metal and shattered, especially if I scout rax -> gas. Totally viable.
thanks I never thought it was viable in the past but its good to know it is and I can use it in my games.
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On December 28 2011 18:04 Selendis wrote:
I played a PvZ earlier on Antiga Shipyard, I saw no pool so I went for nexus first FFE, I pull back my scouting probe to the corner of his third and lo and behold he is going for his third. I think to myself, "If he is sticking down his hatch now he cannot have afforded to have built his pool yet" so I plant down my third as well.
Long story short I end up slaughtering the poor zerg. But I actually don't know if I made a good decision or if i just got incredibly lucky (he was a league below me and he didn't spot my third until the 8minute mark).
Did I make the right decision?
Or should I stick to punishing such greed (like I have always done in the past) ?
I think that's kind of risky as you will have to cover 2 bases with cannons. It can get quite expensive. What you can do is just drop a forge and cannon rush him for easy denial. Since he made no pool make sure the hatch finishes before the cannons does 
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On December 28 2011 14:13 eugalp wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2011 06:03 mizU wrote:On December 28 2011 05:53 eugalp wrote:
In PvT, if I scout double gas, should I add a second gas myself and get a stargate asap? I feel like with a 1 gas 30 food FE, I don't have nearly the amount of gas I need to get a proper unit composition to fight banshees (stalkers, obs, phoenixes). You only really need 3 stalkers in your mineral line to ward of banshees, and cloak will come late enough for you to have your observer, and have scouted it. Sounds like you're overreacting to banshees a bit. Perhaps I am overreacting but I was under the impression that fast double gas means they are probably going for a 2 port banshee or some kind of ski-terran build. In that case 3 stalkers will be nearly enough, especially since you need to cover 2 bases.
Dude, you know it's been snowing hard when they bring out their skis.
Sorry, couldn't help myself ;D
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On December 28 2011 18:04 Selendis wrote:
I played a PvZ earlier on Antiga Shipyard, I saw no pool so I went for nexus first FFE, I pull back my scouting probe to the corner of his third and lo and behold he is going for his third. I think to myself, "If he is sticking down his hatch now he cannot have afforded to have built his pool yet" so I plant down my third as well.
Long story short I end up slaughtering the poor zerg. But I actually don't know if I made a good decision or if i just got incredibly lucky (he was a league below me and he didn't spot my third until the 8minute mark).
Did I make the right decision?
Or should I stick to punishing such greed (like I have always done in the past) ?
General rule of thumb I've found is if they pool 1st, go nexus 1st, they hatch 1st, go forge 1st & cannon to deny him a base.
As for taking a quick 3rd like that, its very risky and I'm pretty sure it would lose to any well executed all in (roach/ling or roach/bane) as these allins are generally hard enough to hold on just 2 base for toss. Rather just cannon & go some sort of 2 base strat based on what you scout
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EPT
