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ZvT The Hellion Filter: Ultimate Anti-hellion Wall - Page 6

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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holycrapitsTony
Profile Joined October 2010
United States330 Posts
July 22 2011 23:51 GMT
#101
On July 23 2011 02:03 Honeybadger wrote:
Whatever happened to good scouting and a double queen block? It's really, really easy.

Lategame, however, It would work... but by then, your natural is mined out...



A Queen is 150 minerals. An Evolution Chamber and Spine Crawler equal up to about 275. It's not the most economically responsible thing to do, but I'd prefer to do that than potentially lose drones because of bad Queen micro.
NYE: when the match loading screen comes up "zvz" it's like finding out you have hiv
Zruku
Profile Joined February 2011
United States35 Posts
July 23 2011 00:50 GMT
#102
On July 23 2011 08:51 holycrapitsTony wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2011 02:03 Honeybadger wrote:
Whatever happened to good scouting and a double queen block? It's really, really easy.

Lategame, however, It would work... but by then, your natural is mined out...



A Queen is 150 minerals. An Evolution Chamber and Spine Crawler equal up to about 275. It's not the most economically responsible thing to do, but I'd prefer to do that than potentially lose drones because of bad Queen micro.

Assuming you always get an evo chamber in ZvT, the cost is reduced to 150, same as a queen.
Baeras
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States140 Posts
July 23 2011 02:01 GMT
#103
if you have a spine you can just you know kinda open the door.... and re close it at anytime how are people complaining that roaches cant get through
Bet on it!
Angry_Fetus
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada444 Posts
July 23 2011 02:27 GMT
#104
On July 22 2011 13:00 Catgroove wrote:Sure you can take back map control and pressure the terran, but how much pressure can 5 roaches really apply this late in the matchup? Not much.


I agree with the rest of your post, however, you really haven't seen how powerful early roach timings against terran can be. Watch Sheth play ZvT. He often does an early 4-6 roach push (roach warren on 26, stop droning until they are out) and then just pumps drones after. Those few roaches can do a ton of damage to a terran (especially if they open helion), and provide valuable scouting info.
shtdisturbance
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada613 Posts
July 23 2011 02:37 GMT
#105
This looks awesome.!
pwadoc
Profile Joined August 2010
271 Posts
July 23 2011 03:08 GMT
#106
Can't you do this with a roach warren and a spine crawler and have the best of both world?
Emporio
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States3069 Posts
July 23 2011 03:12 GMT
#107
On July 23 2011 11:27 Angry_Fetus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 13:00 Catgroove wrote:Sure you can take back map control and pressure the terran, but how much pressure can 5 roaches really apply this late in the matchup? Not much.


I agree with the rest of your post, however, you really haven't seen how powerful early roach timings against terran can be. Watch Sheth play ZvT. He often does an early 4-6 roach push (roach warren on 26, stop droning until they are out) and then just pumps drones after. Those few roaches can do a ton of damage to a terran (especially if they open helion), and provide valuable scouting info.



Yeah but you can't do the roach push AFTER the hellion opening happens. The roach push works because Terran cuts marine production to make hellions which can't do anything against roaches. Once he already had hellions he's not going to have only hellions by the time your roaches reach his front door.
How does it feel knowing you wasted another 3 seconds of your life reading this again?
Grampz
Profile Joined November 2010
United States2147 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-23 20:18:10
July 23 2011 03:29 GMT
#108
Lol a zerg who plays slag pits

EDIT: Lol slag pits
Dellward
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia138 Posts
July 23 2011 03:31 GMT
#109
Wow, what an amazing find. One of my main issues against Terran at the moment is when they mix in like 4-6 BF Hellions with their tank/marine composition during the 2-base push. I hate making roaches in ZvT past the initial few, and I find I'm often not prepared to counter both the Hellions and the push with all my zerglings - which usually results in them sneaking in and roasting my entire mineral line. This is a great reactionary countermeasure to that, which I'll definitely be using!
Honeybadger
Profile Joined August 2010
United States821 Posts
July 23 2011 05:18 GMT
#110



A Queen is 150 minerals. An Evolution Chamber and Spine Crawler equal up to about 275. It's not the most economically responsible thing to do, but I'd prefer to do that than potentially lose drones because of bad Queen micro.


Queen micro is using a single one to block your ramp. This is just parking two of those fat-arses anywhere at all on the ramp and hitting H.

Seriously. She's got some wide hips. Nobody will get by.
"I like to tape my thumbs to my hands to see what it would be like to be a dinosaur."
Honeybadger
Profile Joined August 2010
United States821 Posts
July 23 2011 05:25 GMT
#111
Seriously, guys. come on. This is not a good habit you' re instilling into yourselves. Clicking three times to move your queens and making a habit out of scouting the front will win you hundreds more games in the long run than another gimmicky idea (however interesting, the OP is on to something, I'll elaborate):

Use those buildings to better your simcity. Use your pool, roach warren, evo's, spines, etc. to funnel the hellions or block pathways they might squeeze by AROUND YOUR MINERAL LINE. Turning your front into a giant funnel is just silly for a race that needs 60 units out IMMEDIATELY. You're trying too hard to be protoss.

"I like to tape my thumbs to my hands to see what it would be like to be a dinosaur."
Jailbreaker
Profile Joined October 2010
United States62 Posts
July 23 2011 07:14 GMT
#112
On July 22 2011 06:42 nick00bot wrote:

But Nickbot, what if they drop hellions at my main AND the expansion AT THE SAME TIME???

ok well your pretty much screwed


hahahhaha, it made me laugh.
Anyway, I sim city my zerg buildings, but I noticed that when I try to make my drones flee all at once, they die because of the bottle-neck. I try to have 4 or some number of drones to hold them back while the others escape. It's still not a good scenario for me : (
ruthless69
Profile Joined May 2011
Australia18 Posts
July 23 2011 07:55 GMT
#113
I'm gonna incorporate this beautiful building placement into my games... thank you so much dear sir...
I might suck, but at least i'm trying my best :D
eXoGhost
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Australia98 Posts
July 23 2011 09:36 GMT
#114
why not just build some of dem der emergency spinez?
stream: www.livestream.com/pureghostsc2streaming // site: d2dgamer.com
MilesTeg
Profile Joined September 2010
France1271 Posts
July 23 2011 10:06 GMT
#115
I knew I was wrong to never read the strategy forum! Those who criticize it are missing the point IMO, it's not something you will do systematically but something to keep in mind when you make your evo and when you see those hellions coming. This allows you to be more reactive, and therefore lose less mining time, overall a nice find that I'll definitely try.
deathcount248
Profile Joined April 2010
Australia11 Posts
July 23 2011 11:18 GMT
#116
This is really cool - gotta try this
DooMDash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1015 Posts
July 23 2011 12:50 GMT
#117
As a Terran player .... NOOOOO!
S1 3500+ Master T. S2 1600+ Master T.
Catgroove
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden67 Posts
July 23 2011 15:01 GMT
#118
On July 23 2011 11:27 Angry_Fetus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 13:00 Catgroove wrote:Sure you can take back map control and pressure the terran, but how much pressure can 5 roaches really apply this late in the matchup? Not much.


I agree with the rest of your post, however, you really haven't seen how powerful early roach timings against terran can be. Watch Sheth play ZvT. He often does an early 4-6 roach push (roach warren on 26, stop droning until they are out) and then just pumps drones after. Those few roaches can do a ton of damage to a terran (especially if they open helion), and provide valuable scouting info.


I know and understand what you mean but won't that attack be really delayed if you get the roaches that late? Sheth's push comes before hellions are even out if I recall correctly, and if the terran sees that many roaches he will have the time to prepare if he isn't already. That's just my take on it.
Aterons_toss
Profile Joined February 2011
Romania1275 Posts
July 23 2011 16:26 GMT
#119
Wait i might be retarded but aren't the drones kinda lining up when they pass trough there... so won't 3 BFH just instantly fry all those drones if they are lined up like that.
A good strategy means leaving your opponent room to make mistakes
oOOoOphidian
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1402 Posts
July 23 2011 16:31 GMT
#120
I already put an Evo Chamber there, I guess I'll have to start putting the spine in that spot to wall it off.

I've seen some players build their macro hatch where the evo chamber is to form a semi-wall.
Creator of sc2unmasked.com
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