• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:13
CEST 19:13
KST 02:13
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism3Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?114Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over3New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!46
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) SC4ALL: II Winner Will Earn a Spot at HSC 30! Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) 2026 GSTL Announcement Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 542 The Ascended Mutation # 541 Binary Choice The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 540 Dodge This
Brood War
General
Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon? Pros React To: Calm's Big Brain Play Vs Mini New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery! ASL22 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
2v2v2v2 Tournament [ASL22] Ro16 Group B [ASL22] Ro16 Group A [ASL22] Ro24 Group F
Strategy
Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread EVE Corporation Diablo IV [Maplestory Hardcore] Let's Play~!! General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
F* the Children and Get Off …
TrAiDoS
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Regacy Esports: The Bh…
regacyesports
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7609 users

[G] ZvZ Hatch first vs a 14/14 - Page 4

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 17 18 19 Next All
dave333
Profile Joined August 2010
United States915 Posts
March 09 2011 23:19 GMT
#61
Scrap, backwater, slag, delta are basically impossible to do 15 hatch. Scrap's ramp is far too large.

Xel naga is a bit iffy but you can probably do it.
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
March 10 2011 00:06 GMT
#62
Hey just to let you guys know OP is updated and thanks to Chaosvuistje looks a lot nicer. Huge thanks to him for doing this for me as it now looks way more organized :D
When I think of something else, something will go here
BlazedHydra
Profile Joined March 2011
United States67 Posts
March 10 2011 02:04 GMT
#63
how does this build fare against 13 gas 12 pool super fast speedling timing pushes???
boredoms not a burden anyone should bare
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
March 10 2011 02:07 GMT
#64
On March 10 2011 11:04 BlazedHydra wrote:
how does this build fare against 13 gas 12 pool super fast speedling timing pushes???


Tbh I don't think I have faced that yet. I imagine you can still hold it fine as long as your making enough lings early. Would ask a friend and try it I might ask titan or someone to do that vs me and see but I imagine you'll hold just fine with this build but would have to test to say for sure ^_^
When I think of something else, something will go here
apalemorning
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada509 Posts
March 10 2011 02:42 GMT
#65
thanks bro. i used to go hatch first all the time in zvz, using a variation of spines/double queen on ramp. i kept losing to baneling aggression so i started going 14g/14p/20 baneling nest and cheesing all my zvz wins out of frustration. im high diamond and this build basically holds any kind of cheese short of 7pools that are super easy to defend by just using drones until lings pop. thanks bro. i would kiss you in real life.
immortal/roach is pretty good against stalkers
majestouch
Profile Joined December 2010
United States395 Posts
March 10 2011 02:55 GMT
#66
zvz is bo wars. it is.
here is a replay of me doing 15hatch against CELLAWERAA doing 14/14. I win.
http://replayfu.com/r/LQB4nk

here is a replay played 5 min later of cellawerra 9pooling me after i 15hatch on close positons.
http://replayfu.com/r/vn1g0p
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-10 03:05:15
March 10 2011 02:58 GMT
#67
On March 10 2011 11:55 majestouch wrote:
zvz is bo wars. it is.
here is a replay of me doing 15hatch against CELLAWERAA doing 14/14. I win.
http://replayfu.com/r/LQB4nk

here is a replay played 5 min later of cellawerra 9pooling me after i 15hatch on close positons.
http://replayfu.com/r/vn1g0p


I disagree with you saying zvz is bo win/lose. If you drone scout you can adjust so as not too die to silly things. In the game you lost vs 9 pool you defended kinda poorly could have defended better not letting the drones die to the zerglings and make a spine of your own.
When I think of something else, something will go here
B34ST
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom150 Posts
March 10 2011 04:05 GMT
#68
Did this on Slag Pits across positions, really nice. Something to add to my bag of tricks, I have found it funny playing people after I annouce no zerg can stop me FE'ing in zerg strat channel.

falstag
Profile Joined November 2010
United States55 Posts
March 10 2011 04:14 GMT
#69
Great idea and good replays.
Think you will be Grandmasters in 1.3 blade
If he looks weird, its his placement match
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-10 04:17:29
March 10 2011 04:17 GMT
#70
On March 10 2011 13:14 falstag wrote:
Great idea and good replays.
Think you will be Grandmasters in 1.3 blade


If I ladder enough on NA i'm close to top 200 just I prefer playing on Korea then NA but do plan on getting top 200 for grandmaster before the patch hopefully ^_^.

Thanks for the positive feedback guys glad to see its helping people out :D
When I think of something else, something will go here
RJ231
Profile Joined January 2011
Canada19 Posts
March 10 2011 04:31 GMT
#71
Thx for the guide, clears up some confusion about holding various attacks when doing this build. Just curious though, I do 15h/14p quite a bit and sometimes I find I lose to players who do 14/14 and go for my expo. On some maps coming down off the ramp exposes you to a surround or a run by, I'm assuming this is just bad build order by me?
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
March 10 2011 04:34 GMT
#72
On March 10 2011 13:31 RJ231 wrote:
Thx for the guide, clears up some confusion about holding various attacks when doing this build. Just curious though, I do 15h/14p quite a bit and sometimes I find I lose to players who do 14/14 and go for my expo. On some maps coming down off the ramp exposes you to a surround or a run by, I'm assuming this is just bad build order by me?


You should be able to have about 5 roaches come out at the same time which will stop it so they can't surround. Just sounds like a slight mess up on your part.
When I think of something else, something will go here
apalemorning
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada509 Posts
March 10 2011 10:03 GMT
#73
man, i can hold this vs almost everything easy. but on the ladder it seems i get my roaches, drone a bit. i find it really, really hard to scout what the zerg is doing. almost every zerg on the ladder goes 14g/14pool. so they get speed well before me, take their expo, and then im blind. i've literally been mass linged/baneling busted all-in'ed with this build. how do you adapt if he contains ur scout with speedlings? this ling/baneling comes before lair, its so frustrating. halp
immortal/roach is pretty good against stalkers
Jwfort
Profile Joined January 2011
Australia36 Posts
March 10 2011 10:11 GMT
#74
Great post man to be honest, I've been using this build with a few tweaks based around using baneling micro-management to weaken my opponents economy whilst massing my army, so that when the 'major battle' happens, I have a much easier time re-building my force.

I'm new here so i am having issues quoting people, but i see people asking about 6-11 pools if you scout them. simply put I think by the time you scout it out, your pool will probably be too far behind already to bother cancelling the hatch, and i find that chucking down a spine in the mineral line of your main and natural, as wlel as your 8 lings SHOULD be able to keep you alive long enough for the roaches to come out.

Once more, thanks for the post this build has actually helped me fix up a few nicks i had with my ZvZ!
decaf
Profile Joined October 2010
Austria1797 Posts
March 10 2011 10:34 GMT
#75
I did a 15 hatch 15 poool 14 gas agaisnt a ling bling yesterday. I threw down the roach warren right att the time my pool finished, but somehow I didnt have any money left over queens or zerglings. Maybe because I researched the metabolic boost upgrade?
And I also think a 9 drone scout is quite an eco loss, but it's needed for this build :/
Valckrie
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom533 Posts
March 10 2011 10:51 GMT
#76
I do mine a little different:

15 hatch
14 pool
17 gas
16 ovie
*pool finishes*
16 queen
18 ling
19 ling
20 ling
20 warren
(basically 1 queen at main, 6 lings, warren)
another overlord

inject with queen move to ramp
once roach warren finishes build as many roaches as possible

it's a little different as it takes gas later but for a few roaches - I don't feel you need that early gas, the more minerals is quite beneficial
Fear is a 4 letter word. Why be afraid?
terr13
Profile Joined April 2007
United States298 Posts
March 10 2011 10:57 GMT
#77
Does anybody just skip gas for more drones, and then just drop down like 2-5 spines at your nat, and wall in with 2 Queens?
Valckrie
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom533 Posts
March 10 2011 11:01 GMT
#78
I've seen some people do that, but roaches give you the ability to counterattack if he doesn't have enough lings or roaches.
Fear is a 4 letter word. Why be afraid?
transience
Profile Joined February 2011
Belgium74 Posts
March 10 2011 11:09 GMT
#79
I 15 Hatch in every match-up. The idea to delay my Queen to get my Roaches up faster in ZvZ will definitely help!
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
MilesTeg
Profile Joined September 2010
France1271 Posts
March 10 2011 12:39 GMT
#80
On March 10 2011 19:57 terr13 wrote:
Does anybody just skip gas for more drones, and then just drop down like 2-5 spines at your nat, and wall in with 2 Queens?


I am doing this all the time as well. I wonder which is best in what situation?
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 17 18 19 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h 47m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Trap 38
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 30959
Calm 3962
EffOrt 977
Mini 576
Light 478
Larva 302
Soulkey 291
Stork 230
Rush 225
hero 112
[ Show more ]
Hyun 73
BRAT_OK 62
soO 44
Sharp 30
Terrorterran 25
Bale 25
Yoon 23
HiyA 19
Aegong 17
Dota 2
qojqva5314
420jenkins979
Counter-Strike
ScreaM1179
x6flipin527
byalli5
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu185
Other Games
Liquid`RaSZi1683
Beastyqt582
ceh9488
XaKoH 217
Hui .195
TKL 88
C9.Mang088
FrodaN70
QueenE43
Trikslyr40
KnowMe32
Organizations
Other Games
WardiTV347
BasetradeTV29
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile154
• Adnapsc2 3
• intothetv
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• IndyKCrew
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki5
• ZZZeroYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1903
League of Legends
• Nemesis2162
• TFBlade670
Other Games
• WagamamaTV331
• Shiphtur233
• imaqtpie51
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
6h 47m
Kung Fu Cup
17h 47m
Replay Cast
1d 6h
The PondCast
1d 16h
KCM Race Survival
1d 16h
Escore
2 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
4 days
Spirit vs Mixu
Clem vs TBD
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
GSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-02
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
RSL Revival: Season 6
Calamity Invitational
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: King of Kings
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.