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On April 26 2011 02:37 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I play as Protoss, and my biggest weakness in PvP is hidden dark templar tech.
What is the fastest time that dark templars can appear on the field?
Also, what time should I throw down a forge or robo (to make sure I have enough time to get a cannon up or observer out) to be certain that I stop the dark templar rush?
Fastest time to get 3 DTs out is about ~ 6:10
However if you don't see ti coming, that would mean that you didn't even probe scout his base.
If he is opening seemingly standard, and chases out your probe with a stalker while still on one gas, the earliest you should fear DTs is somewhere around 7:45.
If he is on 2 gas with standard 12-13 gate, at about 7:10 earliest DTs (delayed by how long he takes to kill your probe).
As a general rule, Dts are possible to be made at ~ 2 minutes and 30 seconds after your scouting probe dies if opponent has 2 gas. (that is assuming you are scouting the map for hidden tech). How long you have until they are in your base is up to you (scout for proxy pylons). Crossing the whole map with DTs is pretty long and you can easily win an extra 30 secs by just having map awareness.
It takes 1 min 30 secs to get forge + cannon, and 1 min 45 to get robo + observer (1 min 35 if you chrono obs)
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Hey,
I've been having trouble with the new Z metagame (ling, infestor) lately as terran.
Are ghosts really the best counter? If not, what is? Thanks.
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On April 26 2011 02:49 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 02:37 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I play as Protoss, and my biggest weakness in PvP is hidden dark templar tech.
What is the fastest time that dark templars can appear on the field?
Also, what time should I throw down a forge or robo (to make sure I have enough time to get a cannon up or observer out) to be certain that I stop the dark templar rush? Fastest time to get 3 DTs out is about ~ 6:10 However if you don't see ti coming, that would mean that you didn't even probe scout his base. If he is opening seemingly standard, and chases out your probe with a stalker while still on one gas, the earliest you should fear DTs is somewhere around 7:45. If he is on 2 gas with standard 12-13 gate, at about 7:10 earliest DTs (delayed by how long he takes to kill your probe). As a general rule, Dts are possible to be made at ~ 2 minutes and 30 seconds after your scouting probe dies if opponent has 2 gas. (that is assuming you are scouting the map for hidden tech). How long you have until they are in your base is up to you (scout for proxy pylons). Crossing the whole map with DTs is pretty long and you can easily win an extra 30 secs by just having map awareness. It takes 1 min 30 secs to get forge + cannon, and 1 min 45 to get robo + observer (1 min 35 if you chrono obs)
Thanks! 
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On April 26 2011 03:08 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 02:49 Geiko wrote:On April 26 2011 02:37 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I play as Protoss, and my biggest weakness in PvP is hidden dark templar tech.
What is the fastest time that dark templars can appear on the field?
Also, what time should I throw down a forge or robo (to make sure I have enough time to get a cannon up or observer out) to be certain that I stop the dark templar rush? Fastest time to get 3 DTs out is about ~ 6:10 However if you don't see ti coming, that would mean that you didn't even probe scout his base. If he is opening seemingly standard, and chases out your probe with a stalker while still on one gas, the earliest you should fear DTs is somewhere around 7:45. If he is on 2 gas with standard 12-13 gate, at about 7:10 earliest DTs (delayed by how long he takes to kill your probe). As a general rule, Dts are possible to be made at ~ 2 minutes and 30 seconds after your scouting probe dies if opponent has 2 gas. (that is assuming you are scouting the map for hidden tech). How long you have until they are in your base is up to you (scout for proxy pylons). Crossing the whole map with DTs is pretty long and you can easily win an extra 30 secs by just having map awareness. It takes 1 min 30 secs to get forge + cannon, and 1 min 45 to get robo + observer (1 min 35 if you chrono obs) Thanks!
IMO that's not the correct mindset to have if you're afraid of DTs in PvP. With good scouting, you should easily be able to smell out any super fast DT (~ <9 min) if you see an early 2nd gas and/or a high zealot count with low stalker/sentry count. For DTs that come later than that, you should really only be worried if you're going for blink stalker (because if you go robo you will have obs, and if you go stargate you should have robo as well). Just scout well by poking up their ramp 1 stalker, or sacing a probe or zealot. There should be alarm bells going off in your head if you see mass zealots.
As soon as you think there's a possibility of DT, drop a robo and/or forge. Forge is cheaper, but robo gives you more opportunities with your blink stalker play.
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Trying to beat computer on inane with a terran 2 rax FE. The unit counts showed me 2 collosi, but when i looked on screen there were 10. Once i got steamrolled they disappeared and only the 2 on screen were left. Although i saw damage from all the collosi being done.
Is this known? What's going on with that?
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On April 26 2011 03:37 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 03:08 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 26 2011 02:49 Geiko wrote:On April 26 2011 02:37 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I play as Protoss, and my biggest weakness in PvP is hidden dark templar tech.
What is the fastest time that dark templars can appear on the field?
Also, what time should I throw down a forge or robo (to make sure I have enough time to get a cannon up or observer out) to be certain that I stop the dark templar rush? Fastest time to get 3 DTs out is about ~ 6:10 However if you don't see ti coming, that would mean that you didn't even probe scout his base. If he is opening seemingly standard, and chases out your probe with a stalker while still on one gas, the earliest you should fear DTs is somewhere around 7:45. If he is on 2 gas with standard 12-13 gate, at about 7:10 earliest DTs (delayed by how long he takes to kill your probe). As a general rule, Dts are possible to be made at ~ 2 minutes and 30 seconds after your scouting probe dies if opponent has 2 gas. (that is assuming you are scouting the map for hidden tech). How long you have until they are in your base is up to you (scout for proxy pylons). Crossing the whole map with DTs is pretty long and you can easily win an extra 30 secs by just having map awareness. It takes 1 min 30 secs to get forge + cannon, and 1 min 45 to get robo + observer (1 min 35 if you chrono obs) Thanks! IMO that's not the correct mindset to have if you're afraid of DTs in PvP. With good scouting, you should easily be able to smell out any super fast DT (~ <9 min) if you see an early 2nd gas and/or a high zealot count with low stalker/sentry count. For DTs that come later than that, you should really only be worried if you're going for blink stalker (because if you go robo you will have obs, and if you go stargate you should have robo as well). Just scout well by poking up their ramp 1 stalker, or sacing a probe or zealot. There should be alarm bells going off in your head if you see mass zealots. As soon as you think there's a possibility of DT, drop a robo and/or forge. Forge is cheaper, but robo gives you more opportunities with your blink stalker play.
Those are good points too, and I'll definitely keep them in mind. There's just that tiny period of no scouting information between when my scouting probe dies and when I'll be able to actually be aggressive (I don't want to push in too early or else I could get half my units cut by a FF) where I'm uncertain as to what his tech route is. I'll grind more games though
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On April 26 2011 03:49 Terranoob wrote:
Trying to beat computer on inane with a terran 2 rax FE. The unit counts showed me 2 collosi, but when i looked on screen there were 10. Once i got steamrolled they disappeared and only the 2 on screen were left. Although i saw damage from all the collosi being done.
Is this known? What's going on with that?
Sounds like you just got Huk'd. My bet would be on hallucinations
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On April 26 2011 03:37 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 03:08 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 26 2011 02:49 Geiko wrote:On April 26 2011 02:37 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I play as Protoss, and my biggest weakness in PvP is hidden dark templar tech.
What is the fastest time that dark templars can appear on the field?
Also, what time should I throw down a forge or robo (to make sure I have enough time to get a cannon up or observer out) to be certain that I stop the dark templar rush? Fastest time to get 3 DTs out is about ~ 6:10 However if you don't see ti coming, that would mean that you didn't even probe scout his base. If he is opening seemingly standard, and chases out your probe with a stalker while still on one gas, the earliest you should fear DTs is somewhere around 7:45. If he is on 2 gas with standard 12-13 gate, at about 7:10 earliest DTs (delayed by how long he takes to kill your probe). As a general rule, Dts are possible to be made at ~ 2 minutes and 30 seconds after your scouting probe dies if opponent has 2 gas. (that is assuming you are scouting the map for hidden tech). How long you have until they are in your base is up to you (scout for proxy pylons). Crossing the whole map with DTs is pretty long and you can easily win an extra 30 secs by just having map awareness. It takes 1 min 30 secs to get forge + cannon, and 1 min 45 to get robo + observer (1 min 35 if you chrono obs) Thanks! IMO that's not the correct mindset to have if you're afraid of DTs in PvP. With good scouting, you should easily be able to smell out any super fast DT (~ <9 min) if you see an early 2nd gas and/or a high zealot count with low stalker/sentry count. For DTs that come later than that, you should really only be worried if you're going for blink stalker (because if you go robo you will have obs, and if you go stargate you should have robo as well). Just scout well by poking up their ramp 1 stalker, or sacing a probe or zealot. There should be alarm bells going off in your head if you see mass zealots. As soon as you think there's a possibility of DT, drop a robo and/or forge. Forge is cheaper, but robo gives you more opportunities with your blink stalker play.
^ This
You'll smell out Dts with experience and you'll be able to judge what your opponent is doing based on the units you'll see. Timings are good to know and you should keep them in the back of your head, but always favor game sense.
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can someone do a guide on mech play vs zerg
how to setup for it
how to secure 3rd expo
what army composition
when to push out
are attack or armor upgradesbetter??'
how to harras??
-----------------------------------
i will say my strat
it is reactor hellion expand
do factory,reactor on racks then CC in base then gas
when i have 4 hellions i go out and harras (dont suicide)
when i push out i land CC make 1 fact 1 starport and armory
and ASAP 2xrefinery on expo
from then i do 2 thors
and 2xfactory
-----------------------
i do it on 2 base allin style
when i push out i have 8 tanks 4 thors and 12 hellions 2+attack upgrades raven(2xPDD) medivac viking and 30 scv at 15;00
my problems are that i need to be more aggresive cause sometimes i lose when i allow zerg to have sick eco and tech to hive extra fast,have 4,5 bases,kill me with like 70,80 banelings can someone suggest another opening or what am i doing wrong??
i cnat unfortunantely add replays cause im on holidays now but i described my build order
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On April 26 2011 04:30 Rexar123 wrote:
can someone do a guide on mech play vs zerg
how to setup for it
how to secure 3rd expo
what army composition
when to push out
are attack or armor upgradesbetter??'
how to harras??
-----------------------------------
i will say my strat
it is reactor hellion expand
do factory,reactor on racks then CC in base then gas
when i have 4 hellions i go out and harras (dont suicide)
when i push out i land CC make 1 fact 1 starport and armory
and ASAP 2xrefinery on expo
from then i do 2 thors
and 2xfactory
-----------------------
i do it on 2 base allin style
when i push out i have 8 tanks 4 thors and 12 hellions 2+attack upgrades raven(2xPDD) medivac viking and 30 scv at 15;00
my problems are that i need to be more aggresive cause sometimes i lose when i allow zerg to have sick eco and tech to hive extra fast,have 4,5 bases,kill me with like 70,80 banelings can someone suggest another opening or what am i doing wrong??
i cnat unfortunantely add replays cause im on holidays now but i described my build order
Doesn't really sound like a "simple question/simple answer"
You can request a guide here if you want http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=210472
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I'm curious about 4 Warpgate timing.
When does Warpgate finish during the standard 1gas, 19 probe 4gate rush? When I did my tests, WG research finishes at like 6 Minutes, and at 6:11-ish I have 5 Stalkers and 1 Zealot. In some places I see things stating WG Research finishes much sooner than this. What is the standard timing and unit count?
+ Show Spoiler +I play Terran but am actively trying to understand Protoss timing better.
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My 13-gate gets a first round warp-in at 5:30-5:35 with 6 stalkers and 1 zealot. 12-gate might be a couple of seconds faster.
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~5:30 warp gate research finishes
5:45 1 zealot and 6 stalkers ( not 5 )
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Trying to beat computer on inane with a terran 2 rax FE. The unit counts showed me 2 collosi, but when i looked on screen there were 10. Once i got steamrolled they disappeared and only the 2 on screen were left. Although i saw damage from all the collosi being done.
Is this known? What's going on with that?
those were halluc
LOL
U werent loss
for a serious answer, check the replay, you can see if they do damage etc if you slow it down
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On April 26 2011 05:02 archangel2 wrote:
My 13-gate gets a first round warp-in at 5:30-5:35 with 6 stalkers and 1 zealot. 12-gate might be a couple of seconds faster.
On April 26 2011 05:04 Geiko wrote:
~5:30 warp gate research finishes
5:45 1 zealot and 6 stalkers ( not 5 )
Would you two fine gentlemen offer some replays? I'd love to analyze this timing.
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How do you hide hotkeys in game. I see Idra and Tyler doing this.
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Is it viable to do a 3 gate blink stalker harass expand? The build im using(an old build liquidtyler did vs sen i think) now has enough cash for a nexus when warpgate finishes. I figure i should be able to have uneven production while using blink to harass and making more probes/getting expo up etc. Is it worth it or should i just chrono warpgate more and get an extra gate?
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On April 26 2011 05:06 PD wrote:Show nested quote +Trying to beat computer on inane with a terran 2 rax FE. The unit counts showed me 2 collosi, but when i looked on screen there were 10. Once i got steamrolled they disappeared and only the 2 on screen were left. Although i saw damage from all the collosi being done.
Is this known? What's going on with that? those were halluc LOL U werent loss for a serious answer, check the replay, you can see if they do damage etc if you slow it down
The 8 other colossi were probably hallucinations. If "damage from all the colossi" was being done, you would see your army evaporate because 10 colossi is such a ridiculous number.
I think you got confused because in reality there were probably only 2 real colossi doing damage.
You would see a "puff" when the units die.
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Hi, I have 3 simple questions.
Moving Shot Micro (ie mutalisks) : What command? I assume stop? I've been doing it fine for a while but it seems attack seems to be a bit quicker.
Move and Shoot Micro (ie marines): What command? It seems a-moving backwards when retreating may lead to one or two of the units to just keep running away and not attacking so it seems stop is the best?
Spamming Spells (FF, NP, Infested Terran): Do you hold the hotkey and click click click, or do you shift click? Shift click seems to be a bit faster. I heard you have to lower some kind of keyboard timer but I didn't see that in the options menu.
Thanks
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EPT
