EPT[D] PvP warp up ramp with 4 gate - Page 3
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iSTime
1579 Posts
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nvs.
Canada3609 Posts
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covetousrat
2109 Posts
On January 13 2011 08:40 kcdc wrote: By placing a pylon at the bottom of your opponent's ramp slightly skewed off to the side, it's possible to warp in units over a forcefield and into your opponent's main without vision. Your units on the low ground have vision on the ramp, so you warp in a unit as far up as you can, immediately gaining a small area of vision in the main which you use to warp in the rest of your units. If your opponent has invested in sentries to defend your 4 gate, your 4 warped in zealots along with your stalkers firing from the low ground is usually enough to push him back from the ramp. Your stalkers then flood in and it's gg. Wow KcDc u did it again!! I'm in masters and dont even know this trick. You just broke PvP. Better to close this treat to let less people know. Lol. Majority I'll say 95% of Protoss players do not know this and I just knew it from you. This is mainly due to the way Force Field is being created a hexagon shape, where opponent can still warp in from the edges. Good info mate!! We'll see pure 4 gating from now on. | ||
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
They'res a couple builds I do in PvP: 1. Adelscott 12/17 Gate, making 4 zealots / 2 stalkers, and pressuring your opponents base. From this you can transition into forge expand and then 2 more gates. Or, if you could not do enough dmg in the small early push you can put up forge and 2 gates and then expand. http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/126850-1v1-protoss-jungle-basin#rd:buildorder 2. I do a more econ friendly 4 gate where I never stop makin probes. What I do is not such a fast warpgate research and I make more earlier units. While cyber is finishing I make a zealot, then chrono boost the stalker and the cyber when cyber finishes. Make another stalker and a 2nd gateway at same time. As I'm doing this, I'm patrolling the map for map control and checking for proxies, killing probes and such. My warpgate tech finishes a little later and when it finishes I pressure his ramp. If he's done an aggressive 4 gate I'm ahead. If he techs I get a couple sentries out, make a concave around his ramp while I expand. These tend to work pretty well for me. I'm 2700 diamond. Maybe a little bit low, but I think the difference is just the number of mistakes people make. | ||
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rsvp
United States2266 Posts
On January 13 2011 12:36 Acridice wrote: 2. I do a more econ friendly 4 gate where I never stop makin probes. What I do is not such a fast warpgate research and I make more earlier units. While cyber is finishing I make a zealot, then chrono boost the stalker and the cyber when cyber finishes. Make another stalker and a 2nd gateway at same time. As I'm doing this, I'm patrolling the map for map control and checking for proxies, killing probes and such. My warpgate tech finishes a little later and when it finishes I pressure his ramp. If he's done an aggressive 4 gate I'm ahead. If he techs I get a couple sentries out, make a concave around his ramp while I expand. These tend to work pretty well for me. I'm 2700 diamond. Maybe a little bit low, but I think the difference is just the number of mistakes people make. Yes, it is because you are a bit low. There's nothing wrong with getting later warp gate tech but a 4 gate that cuts probes at 20 will absolutely destroy you if you don't cut probes at all. | ||
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
On January 13 2011 12:41 Anihc wrote: Yes, it is because you are a bit low. A 4 gate that cuts probes at 20 will absolutely destroy you if you don't cut probes. yes, I understand that. I believe a 10gate deserves a different reaction, like the 2 gate zealot pressure strat. However, a standard 12 gate warpgate I believe I can beat with econ friendly 4 gate. here is why. If I can control the map and prevent the proxy doesn't that buy me enough time to get my warpgate tech up? plus I have the extra units I was producing out of the gateways before the warpgate comes up. | ||
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Monk___
United States123 Posts
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rsvp
United States2266 Posts
On January 13 2011 12:47 Acridice wrote: yes, I understand that. I believe a 10gate deserves a different reaction, like the 2 gate zealot pressure strat. However, a standard 12 gate warpgate I believe I can beat with econ friendly 4 gate. here is why. If I can control the map and prevent the proxy doesn't that buy me enough time to get my warpgate tech up? plus I have the extra units I was producing out of the gateways before the warpgate comes up. Any probe after the 16th on minerals takes about 3-4 minutes to pay for itself. Stopping proxy pylons buys you half a minute of time at most, depending on the map. | ||
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datacrashe72
United States11 Posts
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iamke55
United States2806 Posts
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:18 Anihc wrote: Any probe after the 16th on minerals takes about 3-4 minutes to pay for itself. Stopping proxy pylons buys you half a minute of time at most, depending on the map. Ok, but even so, the minute of time it buys me gets my warpgate tech up, and I don't think my extra probes are going to interfere with my production. | ||
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Emperor_Earth
United States824 Posts
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
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rsvp
United States2266 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:21 Acridice wrote: Ok, but even so, the minute of time it buys me gets my warpgate tech up, and I don't think my extra probes are going to interfere with my production. It has nothing to do with warpgate tech. Basically every 2 probes you make for awhile is going to be an extra zealot for the other player. Given that the defender's advantage is small enough as is, that extra 2 or so zealots or stalkers that your opponent has more than you is more than enough to give him the edge to win the game. | ||
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:31 Anihc wrote: It has nothing to do with warpgate tech. Basically every 2 probes you make for awhile is going to be an extra zealot for the other player. Given that the defender's advantage is small enough as is, that extra 2 or so zealots or stalkers that your opponent has more than you is more than enough to give him the edge to win the game. I'm sorry, I'm still having trouble understanding this. If I can produce off all 4 gates as I build probes, how is this not even. Are you saying that if I make extra probes, I can't continue to produce on 4 gates? | ||
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sGmKana
Canada30 Posts
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Acridice
United States298 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:50 sGmKana wrote: Like sweeps said you can get your units out but the micro of those units that you get out is key to defending this type of 4gate all in. If you are not 4gating yourself the safest build is a 1.5 gate robo aka 1 gate into robo and another gate asap this is to improve your production until you manage to get those immortals out get your firstzellot and you want to focus on getting 3-4 sentries out asap and ff bottom of ramP keeping your eyes on it if he manage to sneak in you want to make sure you units are on hold especially your zelot this causes more micro mistake on his end give you units free hits on his btw you have 3 warp gates a few bedew this point just get stalkers and immortals and you can even miss ff on Purpose to get more unit kills when you feel you have the game Dude.... sentences and punctuation. You may have good ideas. But I cannot understand you | ||
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Rubix314
54 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:50 sGmKana wrote: Like sweeps said you can get your units out but the micro of those units that you get out is key to defending this type of 4gate all in. If you are not 4gating yourself the safest build is a 1.5 gate robo aka 1 gate into robo and another gate asap this is to improve your production until you manage to get those immortals out get your firstzellot and you want to focus on getting 3-4 sentries out asap and ff bottom of ramP keeping your eyes on it if he manage to sneak in you want to make sure you units are on hold especially your zelot this causes more micro mistake on his end give you units free hits on his btw you have 3 warp gates a few bedew this point just get stalkers and immortals and you can even miss ff on Purpose to get more unit kills when you feel you have the game Punctuation. Please. The point of a 4gate is that it overwhelms you with units, even if you have higher tech. Micro is key, yes, but numbers just as much. Also, you're not going to be able to get 3-4 sentries, a robo, and an immortal when a 4gate hits. Holding a 4gate off is not easy. | ||
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BlackMesa
Kenya338 Posts
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FreeZEternal
Korea (South)3396 Posts
On January 13 2011 13:57 BlackMesa wrote: Actually, it's possible to deny vision and warpgate warping with a ff at the top of the ramp with the top of the ff level with the top edge of the ramp. Yup, that's how i usually stop this. I had to practice this with a friend ~10 times to get the FF right to block vision. | ||
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