EPT14gas
14pool
15 ovie
queen, meta on pool finish, bane at 20 or 21. I push in with my first lings and if i see a roach waren i cancel the bane and build a roach warren myself.
[G] ZvZ - 3 different builds - Page 4
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SnowSC2
United States678 Posts
14gas 14pool 15 ovie queen, meta on pool finish, bane at 20 or 21. I push in with my first lings and if i see a roach waren i cancel the bane and build a roach warren myself. | ||
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Weken
United Kingdom580 Posts
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SnowSC2
United States678 Posts
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Ashera
Canada202 Posts
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Steel
Japan2283 Posts
it makes me want to get some coaching with machine  | ||
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Qtlisk
United States3 Posts
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MrBitter
United States2940 Posts
On December 02 2010 11:26 Qtlisk wrote: I've been having trouble with 2 base muta when I'm going the 2 base roach build, seems like he gets too many mutas out before I am able to get enough hydras out, even with an infestor or two for support. Anyone else having this kind of problem? Where, in any of this, did you read about a 2 base roach build? Are you talking about a regular FE? If yes, you're probably skipping the lings, applying no pressure at all, and allowing him to tech freely while you do nothing. This is the wrong way to FE.  Regardless, if he goes muta, he's cutting units. There's a timing you can exploit to kill him. You need to watch some of your replays (or post them here if you need someone to do it for you) and determine when you need to be attacking, and then make sure you hit that timing next time you run into a player going muta. | ||
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carrion
United Kingdom87 Posts
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Qtlisk
United States3 Posts
On December 02 2010 16:19 MrBitter wrote: Where, in any of this, did you read about a 2 base roach build? Are you talking about a regular FE? If yes, you're probably skipping the lings, applying no pressure at all, and allowing him to tech freely while you do nothing. This is the wrong way to FE. Regardless, if he goes muta, he's cutting units. There's a timing you can exploit to kill him. You need to watch some of your replays (or post them here if you need someone to do it for you) and determine when you need to be attacking, and then make sure you hit that timing next time you run into a player going muta. Yes, I was talking about the FE build, sorry if that was confusing. Thanks for the input, I'll try to remember to save some of my replays when this happens to me. Love the stream btw :D | ||
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nicke10
Sweden114 Posts
It feels like a roach play, with +1 and no lair with a fast expansion really beats this build. He simpy outproduces me in roachnumbers and if I spend my larva on lings to do a runby in to his mineral lines I fall back even further in economy. | ||
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MrBitter
United States2940 Posts
On December 03 2010 07:21 nicke10 wrote: I'm having problem with the first build. It feels like a roach play, with +1 and no lair with a fast expansion really beats this build. He simpy outproduces me in roachnumbers and if I spend my larva on lings to do a runby in to his mineral lines I fall back even further in economy. Well, for starters, roach plays in general aren't very good at punishing fast expands. If you scout a FE, or expect a FE (meaning hatch first) then don't go roach. If he goes pool first, and then expands, and you're still struggling to punish it, the problem is in your execution. | ||
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nicke10
Sweden114 Posts
On December 03 2010 07:48 MrBitter wrote: Well, for starters, roach plays in general aren't very good at punishing fast expands. If you scout a FE, or expect a FE (meaning hatch first) then don't go roach. If he goes pool first, and then expands, and you're still struggling to punish it, the problem is in your execution. The push comes around the time my lair finishes, then he has his expansion and more roaches. He lays down the expansion and has equally my roach numbers so I can't push and punish. Replay below. ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-170843.jpg) | ||
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Andre112
Canada52 Posts
it seems like ppl always race for muta and if i get gas late, my lair is late, and I just die | ||
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MrBitter
United States2940 Posts
On December 07 2010 11:38 Andre112 wrote: when you do FE and your opponent goes roach and expand, when should i get gas? it seems like ppl always race for muta and if i get gas late, my lair is late, and I just die Same time as your pool... Just like if you were playing 1 base. | ||
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Andre112
Canada52 Posts
that's what machine said when he taught you the FE build. | ||
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Sanasante
United States321 Posts
They cannot move into muta play with this opener either or they will die. Forces low eco roach or bane or roach/bane builds. If they try to expand behind you, you can overwhelm. | ||
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Jahzaa
Germany30 Posts
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winedz
United States92 Posts
On December 08 2010 03:55 Sanasante wrote: Adjust your speedling build and you can transition. Try not putting a bane nest and adding an expansion at 21 supply. (Pull workers after 100 gas). This will allow you to go into the game with a faster expansion that is 100% defend able. They cannot move into muta play with this opener either or they will die. Forces low eco roach or bane or roach/bane builds. If they try to expand behind you, you can overwhelm. I feel that this is very risky, as it is punishable with a decent roach timing push. Thoughts? | ||
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zylog
Canada943 Posts
On December 08 2010 03:55 Sanasante wrote: Adjust your speedling build and you can transition. Try not putting a bane nest and adding an expansion at 21 supply. (Pull workers after 100 gas). This will allow you to go into the game with a faster expansion that is 100% defend able. They cannot move into muta play with this opener either or they will die. Forces low eco roach or bane or roach/bane builds. If they try to expand behind you, you can overwhelm. If they stay on 1 base ling/baneling and keep pressuring, won't you probably lose from having 300/350 minerals less spent on lings? | ||
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mikertrx
Netherlands3 Posts
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