EPTThe Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 234
| Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy |
Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
|
Epsilon_Live
3 Posts
| ||
|
KrakInDub
Jamaica20 Posts
Because i prefer an aggressive style like this. | ||
|
Olsson
Sweden931 Posts
On April 15 2012 02:01 KrakInDub wrote: Im curious if 14 Gas 14 Pool (like mouzMorrow used this in like every matchup) is still viable, even in masters+? Because i prefer an aggressive style like this. ZvT: No I do not believe so. Mules are so efficient compared to a normal worker so you need two hatches and a ton of larvae fast to counter this. If you delay your natural you'll end up behind in economy. ZvP: Yes it's still viable. Though it'll probably decrease your drone count if you're playing against a FFE for example. Though koreans still did this for quite a while and protosses might suspect an all-in and make extra cannons. Some people might think the early speed is worth it for some less drones since he won't be able to scout you past 5 minutes. ZvZ: Ofcourse, most versatile build you can do anything. | ||
|
Dalguno
United States2446 Posts
On April 15 2012 02:01 KrakInDub wrote: Im curious if 14 Gas 14 Pool (like mouzMorrow used this in like every matchup) is still viable, even in masters+? Because i prefer an aggressive style like this. ZvT is an absolute no. Against standard hellion openers, your second queen/creep spread won't be up in good enough time to deal with the hellions. Economically you'll get behind. No reason not to hatch first. | ||
|
Chinesewonder
Canada354 Posts
ZvT: I'm ok at this I guess. My only concern is how to break tank set ups outside your base. Take for example shattered temple. They set up an arcing tank line and slowly creep forward putting your side pocket expands in danger as well as your gold. I try teching to broods, but they just cut off my expos and I don't have the econ to get broods and infestors. Also when I finally just go in with my lings and muta I get destroyed. Usually I try to catch the tanks and marines unsieged when they initially push, but sometimes this isn't possible. ZvP: Absolutely lost in this match up. I really dislike muta play and I'm trying to learn the stephano 12 min max out. Even so I don't know where you transition from the 12 minute max out. Brood infestor? I still have trouble dealing with the death ball containing 6-7 colossi. My army just gets melted and it's not even funny. Some games I'm out playing the protoss, harassing, killing expos. Then when it comes to engage, I lose my entire army and they lose probably 30 supply. I just have no idea how to deal with the army ZvZ: The only match up I'm good at. I'll post replays later. ZvZ: | ||
|
TheMooseHeed
United Kingdom535 Posts
Same for 7 8 9 and 10 pool? Sometimes I manage it but I cant tell if it was because it works or they just played it bad | ||
|
kingsleigh
United States32 Posts
On April 15 2012 00:17 mango_destroyer wrote: I apologize in advanced if this question has been answered already: In ZvT if I am planning to hatch first at 15 and a scouting SCV comes and lays an engineering bay at my natural, what would be the optimal response? I assume just lay down the pool? Yes. On smaller maps, it could help going 13h or 14h if you keep getting blocked. | ||
|
kingsleigh
United States32 Posts
On April 14 2012 21:38 WarpTV wrote: You scouted his robo bay at 9:45 but did not make a spier until 18mins in to the game. your 2 queens in your main, had a good bit of energy close to the end of the game. But the biggest issue I seen was not forcing a army trade when you moved up to kill his 3rd, you where up 50 supply, The loss of the nexus is nothing for protoss there, He could just remake it. You have to knock his army supply down and snip a colossi or 2 to delay his push as you remax. When you tried this 4 mins later mid map He was much close in supply and had more colossi. You did not have time to remax at that point and your army comp could not deal with that. One way to have done that would to have split your army up at the time you push his 3rd @ 13mins. Attack up his ramp close to the natural and come in form the 3rd at the same time, That way you can get close in on his colossi, force 2x the FF, and have more spread out forces to limit splash, Thanks, I'll do that. | ||
|
sgtjimmy
Canada107 Posts
| ||
Liquid`Sheth
United States2095 Posts
On April 15 2012 05:44 sgtjimmy wrote: What do you do against a terran that goes marine maurader heavy with mass drops and mass expanding? I went muta/ling/bane and he just put up alot of turrets against my mutas so I couldn't harrass. Just defend with ur muta / ling / bane, maybe burrow some banes and spread ur creep. If he has turrets and you can't find a way in then be happy just defending and macro'ing up to 4 bases or so. Then the moment he moves out, you MUST attack from a different side then he is moving out to. For instance on Daybreak, if he takes one path to you, you should be taking the other to him and going for a counter. Your goal is to get him to go home with his units, but not before you've killed a lot of economy and been able to make another round of higher tech units (BL , Ultra) at home for whenever he comes back at you. You can also put up a few spines while just purely defending. If he tries to take 4 bases purely defensively, you'll have to find an angle to attack, try and spread his army out by poking with mutas in the main and attempting and pulling back ling run byes, then just go with ur entire army at one area and try and be cost effective. The point being you should have enough money saved at home that you can remax on a much higher tech and keep trying to deny that 4th. Make sure that you keep enough lings made too though to prevent drops. Leaving a few lings + an infestor at a vulnerable base is definitely a good idea at times! Hope that answers ur question somewhat...  | ||
|
lunafraga
United States35 Posts
| ||
|
[AthruN]
Australia25 Posts
i wasn't playing the game when they were doing it so i have no idea what to do i usually open 15 pool with a 13 scout depending on their scout timing and map but i have so much trouble telling if there going to 1 gate fe or 4 gate becasue they sometimes save chrono but there's no way to scout them on certain maps and im not really sure on what to build or do so i really need help on that thx and if someone could link me some reps of progamer vs gateway first would be really cool thx | ||
|
jumai
Canada115 Posts
| ||
|
kingsleigh
United States32 Posts
On April 15 2012 07:22 [AthruN] wrote: Hi i have no idea how to play vs gateway first from toss i wasn't playing the game when they were doing it so i have no idea what to do i usually open 15 pool with a 13 scout depending on their scout timing and map but i have so much trouble telling if there going to 1 gate fe or 4 gate becasue they sometimes save chrono but there's no way to scout them on certain maps and im not really sure on what to build or do so i really need help on that thx and if someone could link me some reps of progamer vs gateway first would be really cool thx Just throw down gas after your Pool if you scouted 1 base opener from the Toss and go Speedling expand and go from there. Concerning the 1 Gate FE or a 4 Gate, keep poking around his ramp to see if there's a nexus going down or if you can get a peek inside his main for some additional gateways, the longer you don't see the expansion, the more you have to prepare. Also helps if you can get an overlord at the sides of his base. If you scout a 4 Gate in time, 5-7 spines and lings should deal with it if you don't have a RW, if you do have one, make 3 or so Spines if you don't think you can pump out enough Roaches in time. | ||
|
[AthruN]
Australia25 Posts
On April 15 2012 08:57 kingsleigh wrote: Just throw down gas after your Pool if you scouted 1 base opener from the Toss and go Speedling expand and go from there. Concerning the 1 Gate FE or a 4 Gate, keep poking around his ramp to see if there's a nexus going down or if you can get a peek inside his main for some additional gateways, the longer you don't see the expansion, the more you have to prepare. Also helps if you can get an overlord at the sides of his base. If you scout a 4 Gate in time, 5-7 spines and lings should deal with it if you don't have a RW, if you do have one, make 3 or so Spines if you don't think you can pump out enough Roaches in time. All my slow lings just get killed by stalkers so i can't tell and on certain maps you can't get overlords in proper positions and what would i do after say i scout a 1 gate fe? do i take a third and defend any agression with roach ling when do i tech to lair? is tranisitioning to muta good or infestor or bane drops do i still want to do a 200 roach push if he tries to take a 3rd? | ||
|
Zheryn
Sweden3653 Posts
| ||
|
cameler
Canada99 Posts
On April 15 2012 08:57 kingsleigh wrote: Just throw down gas after your Pool if you scouted 1 base opener from the Toss and go Speedling expand and go from there. Concerning the 1 Gate FE or a 4 Gate, keep poking around his ramp to see if there's a nexus going down or if you can get a peek inside his main for some additional gateways, the longer you don't see the expansion, the more you have to prepare. Also helps if you can get an overlord at the sides of his base. If you scout a 4 Gate in time, 5-7 spines and lings should deal with it if you don't have a RW, if you do have one, make 3 or so Spines if you don't think you can pump out enough Roaches in time. If a Protoss sees you just made 5 SPINES to react to his 4 gate, he has achieved his goal and is going home... | ||
|
Mvrio
689 Posts
| ||
|
kaliax
United States48 Posts
On April 15 2012 04:24 Chinesewonder wrote: I've been posting here a lot. But it seems I'm getting worse, my APM is way down too. I used to be mid master, but slumped hard even though I was playing more than ever. Now this new season I'm diamond, worst feeling ever. I don't know what is happening. Thinking of laddering and uploading some games. But here's a summary of what I think is wrong in all my match ups. ZvT: I'm ok at this I guess. My only concern is how to break tank set ups outside your base. Take for example shattered temple. They set up an arcing tank line and slowly creep forward putting your side pocket expands in danger as well as your gold. I try teching to broods, but they just cut off my expos and I don't have the econ to get broods and infestors. Also when I finally just go in with my lings and muta I get destroyed. Usually I try to catch the tanks and marines unsieged when they initially push, but sometimes this isn't possible. ZvP: Absolutely lost in this match up. I really dislike muta play and I'm trying to learn the stephano 12 min max out. Even so I don't know where you transition from the 12 minute max out. Brood infestor? I still have trouble dealing with the death ball containing 6-7 colossi. My army just gets melted and it's not even funny. Some games I'm out playing the protoss, harassing, killing expos. Then when it comes to engage, I lose my entire army and they lose probably 30 supply. I just have no idea how to deal with the army ZvZ: The only match up I'm good at. I'll post replays later. ZvZ: With regards to ZvP: with the 12 minute roach maxout, what I think you should be doing is keep trading units with the toss (making his deathball delayed), and delay/deny his 3rd as long as possible. If he went pure gateway, you can just win right there. Otherwise, after you max out, I would immediately throw down your infestation pit, start hive and a spire asap, take your 4th (if the toss did secure his 3rd), and just start throwing down spines everywhere on the map (covering his attack paths): you'll need like 100+ drones to do this. If he pushes too far into the spines, fungal and spam infested terrans, while your corruptors focus down any colossi. Generally, sometime right during his push, your greater spire should finish, and if your spines/roach/infestor hold it just long enough, the mass brood lords will roflstomp his ground army. Basically, your roaches are really supply-inefficient so you want to keep trying to trade with the protoss to delay the deathball, while your tech to bl/infestor. And since you're on 4 base and supply-maxed, spines become an excellent mineral resource dump. | ||
|
LolitsPing
United States285 Posts
I've straight out died against drops in the back of my main, hellion marauders and that's sending me on the track from diamond back to platinum. When should i scout and how should i react when I don't see a natural at 6 minutes? | ||
| ||
