EPTEMP is fine and Storm is fine and to everyone in threat saying t > p LOL at you
PvT Ghost EMP - Page 2
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xnub
Canada610 Posts
EMP is fine and Storm is fine and to everyone in threat saying t > p LOL at you | ||
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ADAM.1
United States36 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:35 DamageInq wrote: You don't need a supply depot to build a barracks. no but you will need it to produce the unit you are talking about | ||
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Craz
United States69 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:29 DamageInq wrote: Barracks 60 Academy 40 Ghost 40 Total Build Time 140 Pylon 25 Gateway 65 Cyber 50 Robotics 65 Collosus 75 Total Build Time 280 That makes no sense, why would you count a pylon as you can build all those buildings in your first pylon that you got around 10 food, or are we talking about a terran who NEVER gets supply depots and rushes straight to ghost?. And you didn't add in tech addon / energy regen. And you forgot chrono boosting. | ||
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Conris
United States79 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:33 ADAM.1 wrote: you didnt include depot in your timing.. lol this thread is fail, much like all the replicas.. I will speak on behalf of Terran "I'm sorry ghost is the counter to immortal. If you don't realize how strong the immortal is and that it needs a counter then you are probably in copper division. ATM, Protoss have the advantage over Terran... if you don't realize that you are probably in copper division or don't have Beta. Not that there is anything wrong with the copper division... but I wouldn't agree that copper division players would have a strong handle on what needs nerf and what is a direct counter" Hi - please reread the 100 bad posts about Terran EMP too strong. Thank you enjoy TL sorry to disappoint you but i don't play in copper =( and this thread was not about emp vs immortal, it wasn't even mentioned, idk where you got the idea. but since you brought it up, immortals don't need to be EMPed, the shield gets broken faster that you'd think. like i said, terran who choose to EMP sentries instead of zealots, rip right through the FF advantage. neither has this thread said anything about EMP too strong, but the timing of EMP possibly entering the fight makes the fights afterwards very linear for toss, without more units to be able to sustain the EMP, it would almost be gg. so...if you must know, i play in platinum, before and after each reset, platinum for 2v2 as well, so if you must troll, pick one of those 100 posts you referred me to before you troll here, and thank you, enjoy TL yourself too! | ||
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Ghostcom
Denmark4782 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:33 ADAM.1 wrote: you didnt include depot in your timing.. lol this thread is fail, much like all the replicas.. I will speak on behalf of Terran "I'm sorry ghost is the counter to immortal. If you don't realize how strong the immortal is and that it needs a counter then you are probably in copper division. ATM, Protoss have the advantage over Terran... if you don't realize that you are probably in copper division or don't have Beta. Not that there is anything wrong with the copper division... but I wouldn't agree that copper division players would have a strong handle on what needs nerf and what is a direct counter" Hi - please reread the 100 bad posts about Terran EMP too strong. Thank you enjoy TL Funny how many threads happend to pop up about the immortal being OP and that (plat) terrans with 2 ghosts couldn't hit 2 of them if their life depended on it - especially seing as it is undodgeable. Tbh, I think EMP is fine, BUT I would like to see both it and fungal growth dodgeable as I'm very much against "auto-win" buttons (a bit of an exaggeration, what I mean is abilities with a "damage" component that can't be avoided in any way). Seeing as how it wouldn't make sense to make EMP a "DoT" like storm, I would rather see the projectile from BW back (in before lolgoplayBW). This would allow for more micro and more though in the use of EMP. I'm aware that what I propose hereis a direct nerf to EMP (and hopefully fungal growth as well) but I feel it would be a good change nonetheless. Oh and I'm a random player as well, so this isn't just a P player who wants an easier time. | ||
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iounas
409 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:28 HoroBoro wrote: Emp is only effective vs toss. Storm is effective against everything. Why does this pop up so much? This is retarded.. If protoss had a unit that could cause chaos and confusion in enemies so they start attacking themselves and their brains explode.. and if it worked only against zerg then it would be fine? emp does it all.. remove shields, energy, reveals dts and observers and its free on a lower tier unit than templar that also has its own attack and cloak and other stuff.. and ghost is harder to see among mm than floating templars that leave a trail. | ||
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ADAM.1
United States36 Posts
But to say Immortals don't need to be emp'd.. lol I mean come on now. Have you played as Terran? I honest'y have never said to myself "damn those sentries, i need emp" Any slightly heavy sentry army I've always made hellions for. Don't be to defensive, it wasn't a personal attack. It was more an attack towards the bunch of badly informed players (lol even non players) that post "OMG THIS IS TRUE" stuff..when it isn't at all. but none the less US SERVER; griM.reaper - add me up | ||
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
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ADAM.1
United States36 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:47 Ghostcom wrote: Tbh, I think EMP is fine, BUT I would like to see both it and fungal growth dodgeable as I'm very much against "auto-win" buttons (a bit of an exaggeration, what I mean is abilities with a "damage" component that can't be avoided in any way). . You know EMP is dodgeable right? Its an AOE spell and not a Target spell. Have you used it as Terran vs a good protoss player? Just curious. | ||
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Conris
United States79 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:47 Ghostcom wrote: Funny how many threads happend to pop up about the immortal being OP and that (plat) terrans with 2 ghosts couldn't hit 2 of them if their life depended on it - especially seing as it is undodgeable. Tbh, I think EMP is fine, BUT I would like to see both it and fungal growth dodgeable as I'm very much against "auto-win" buttons (a bit of an exaggeration, what I mean is abilities with a "damage" component that can't be avoided in any way). Seeing as how it wouldn't make sense to make EMP a "DoT" like storm, I would rather see the projectile from BW back (in before lolgoplayBW). This would allow for more micro and more though in the use of EMP. I'm aware that what I propose hereis a direct nerf to EMP (and hopefully fungal growth as well) but I feel it would be a good change nonetheless. Oh and I'm a random player as well, so this isn't just a P player who wants an easier time. no EMPs are fine with the shield, as said multiple times, but toss's army composition of majority casters in PvT, gets completely raped by 1 ghost. it's not the fact that without the shield toss is unsustainable, its the fact that of the three races toss is the only race with tier 1 heavy caster units. EMP for shield again, is fine, even if its instant, AoE, and whatnot. it's the AoE energy drain that offsets the entire fight, with a button. | ||
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Veetz
Canada109 Posts
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:51 ADAM.1 wrote: You know EMP is dodgeable right? Its an AOE spell and not a Target spell. Have you used it as Terran vs a good protoss player? Just curious. You can mitigate or prevent EMP, you cannot dodge it. It is instant cast. | ||
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Graham
Canada1259 Posts
I feel that neither are overpowered really (terran player). While protoss may feel ghost EMP is overpowered, they cost a large chunk of gas and are relatively fragile, not to mention you can easily feedback them. If a protoss is negligent enough to cluster all his casters in one bunch and eat a ninja EMP or any EMP in general, then that's completely his fault (for not spreading up casters/watching for ghosts). Plus, if the terran starts producing tons of ghosts, they're most likely cutting upgrades/units such as vikings/medivacs due to the gas cost. Even with forcefields, in an open battle it takes a lot of energy/sentries to produce enough forcefields to completely trap a terran army. The only slight issue I have with forcefield is its ability to trap an army inside ones base, allowing the protoss to raze the natural (but even then you can lift off). No issues with protoss using sentries to block their own ramp though, because they're trading map control for security. Also, immortals are also fine in-my-opinion, but, it would be great if Blizzard could find a way to make tanks in TvP slightly more viable. | ||
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iounas
409 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:51 ADAM.1 wrote: You know EMP is dodgeable right? Its an AOE spell and not a Target spell. Have you used it as Terran vs a good protoss player? Just curious. how is something that is instant dogeable? | ||
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WorkersOfTheWorld
United States619 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:54 Graham wrote: Personally it would seem that this thread has slowly degenerated into protoss players screaming about how overpowered EMP is, while terran players complain about forcefield. Told ya. | ||
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:52 Conris wrote: no EMPs are fine with the shield, as said multiple times, but toss's army composition of majority casters in PvT, gets completely raped by 1 ghost. it's not the fact that without the shield toss is unsustainable, its the fact that of the three races toss is the only race with tier 1 heavy caster units. EMP for shield again, is fine, even if its instant, AoE, and whatnot. it's the AoE energy drain that offsets the entire fight, with a button. So terran should just have to deal with the fact that their army is going to be split in half and/or be stormed? This isn't a problem, this is what is known as an interesting gameplay dynamic, try and enjoy it. | ||
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DiTH
Greece116 Posts
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Conris
United States79 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:51 ADAM.1 wrote: You know EMP is dodgeable right? Its an AOE spell and not a Target spell. Have you used it as Terran vs a good protoss player? Just curious. you mean like a fake poke, make them use up the EMP? when half your army is melee, and the other half needs to be babied and not get EMPed? sure i guess i can try that, and lose a zealot everytime he doesn't EMP because concussive shells land on a zealot (it's fine, that's just how it is) in response to the post before about not EMPing the sentries and getting hellions for them, try it, you will be amazed at how weak the zealot/sentry army becomes. and yes i've played terran, for a while before the swap anyway, at the rate that marauders shoot, and the numbers of marauders versus the number of possible immortals, each hit is 10 hp, adding on the marine dmg (i say this because immortals usually get focused down) the shield is gone in any focus fire situation before probably the 4th shot or even the 3rd shot goes off (stimmed bio, well, nothing to say there). i can understand if you have a line of tanks and 2 immortals charge in all the way, but that's not the case. so back to the point, if there were another viable effective way in PvT that steers away from sentries to avoid a lucky or well placed EMP, i'd love to try it out, for those that would like to flame, this is not QQ, imo Ghost EMP on sentry is simply a 1up because zeal sentry have been raping bio balls with small or no medivacs. so now how does toss respond or even 1up the sentry EMP situation? | ||
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Conris
United States79 Posts
On May 04 2010 02:54 Graham wrote: Personally it would seem that this thread has slowly degenerated into protoss players screaming about how overpowered EMP is, while terran players complain about forcefield. I feel that neither are overpowered really (terran player). While protoss may feel ghost EMP is overpowered, they cost a large chunk of gas and are relatively fragile, not to mention you can easily feedback them. If a protoss is negligent enough to cluster all his casters in one bunch and eat a ninja EMP or any EMP in general, then that's completely his fault (for not spreading up casters/watching for ghosts). Plus, if the terran starts producing tons of ghosts, they're most likely cutting upgrades/units such as vikings/medivacs due to the gas cost. Even with forcefields, in an open battle it takes a lot of energy/sentries to produce enough forcefields to completely trap a terran army. The only slight issue I have with forcefield is its ability to trap an army inside ones base, allowing the protoss to raze the natural (but even then you can lift off). No issues with protoss using sentries to block their own ramp though, because they're trading map control for security. Also, immortals are also fine in-my-opinion, but, it would be great if Blizzard could find a way to make tanks in TvP slightly more viable. when the first ghost pops out, HTs are still learning how to storm, if you choose to rush for a citadel. and i do believe feedback is out of range, though i'd have to really try that. unit counter skill counters are nice, but the timing just doesn't work that way. as said before, i think EMP is fine, and please don't cry here P, find a way to skip or lower sentry counts in PvT in early midgame. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States44256 Posts
"you didnt include depot in your timing.. lol this thread is fail, much like all the replicas.. " Your response is fail, considering supply depots aren't part of the tech tree to ghosts and therefore don't need to be factored in to the time-order to ghosts. Anyways, Conris... I'm also a Protoss player, and it's really frustrating when Terrans rush Marine/Marauder with Ghosts. But that's because I recognize that I often clump my units too closely together, making the EMP devastating. If we split them up more, it would lessen the effects of EMP and we could get better surrounds on the Terran units. It's not that EMP is imbalanced; it's that we need to deal with it appropriately. I honestly think that EMP is all right AS IS. That includes energy cost, radius, and everything else. Too many people rush to say "Unit X or Ability Y is imbalanced!" instead of reflecting on what they could possibly have done differently when encountering Unit X or Ability Y. | ||
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