On March 28 2020 02:31 Rels wrote: Trfel I read everything you wrote and I've responded to you:
On March 27 2020 12:43 Rels wrote: Trfel the more I read your Palmar case the more I think you're mafia. It's just too on the nose. You're very smart, but your reasonning is so focused on a surface level it doesn't match. Like this:
On March 27 2020 09:54 Trfel wrote: Palmar doesn't care about who gets lynched. From town perspective this makes no sense. To me it feels like he's just interested in surviving and is disinterested otherwise, or that KelsierSC is town and Palmar is trying to set up extra mislynches.
I don't see you believing this. It's too obvious - of course Palmar's play is disinterested, if you want to push him it's because you want to warn him of doing something or die or something like that. I have a hard time believing that you really think he slipped up and was too carefree in his posts ...
Rels, I don't really understand what you're saying here. You're saying I'm mafia because my case on Palmar is too simple? Like the reasoning is too obvious?
Why can't a simple reason make someone mafia? I've found it's so easy to overthink things while simple reads are often overlooked and tend to be right.
it's not that it's only simple, it's that it's simple and wrong. Palmar being carefree early in the game doesn't mean anything. But you made a big deal out of it. It doesn't match what I expect of you
I wouldn't use the word carefree, I'd just say he's not invested at all. Since when do we give players a free pass for doing absolutely nothing and not even wanting to see their scumreads lynched?
Note that Palmar even changed his play after I called him out on it! He went ahead and voted for ShoCkeyy, his top scum read, after all. And is now sitting off of the main wagons. If this isn't scummy I don't know what is.
Furthermore, there ABSOLUTELY IS truth to the Palmar Day 1 thing. And the fact that he has refused to acknowledge it practically makes him mafia. Maybe the meta isn't completely accurate, especially if no one here has heard of it, but at least the perception of this meta has definitely existed.
On May 12 2015 22:21 batsnacks wrote: ##vote Sandroba
I found probable mafia. Unfortunately I can't explain it without claiming. It's weird though because sandroba did nothing last game as mafia and now he's talking a lot.
so are you like 3p lyncher and you win if sandro dies or what
On May 12 2015 22:32 Palmar wrote: There is not nearly enough emotions in the thread about GB pardoning BM. Why aren't yall people who think BM is mafia absolutely frothing right now?
On May 12 2015 23:09 Palmar wrote: you're right that was a bit dick-ish, sorry LS
But the point stands. Sandroba not posting as mafia in one game does not mean he cannot post in another, and because of the filter limitations it's not exactly hard to post 3 pages of stuff in one game.
Same with RoL. He's lazy and shit as either alignment. But he did jump a dumb remark from me (apparently a lot of people here are literally sheldon).
Like maybe I'm just wrong and bad about sandroba, projecting my own personality on him too much but he's now done two things this game where I just think "If I was towndroba in this situation I'd have reacted completely differently". Aside from my initial point about how him saying he'd keep an eye on marv was basically a pointless sentence that doesn't fit in (If he doesn't say that, can we then assume he's not keeping an eye on marv? Isn't the default position in all mafia games to always keep an eye on everyone?), there is more too.
1). Sandroba's reaction to me calling him scum.
On May 11 2015 23:30 sandroba wrote:
On May 11 2015 23:24 Palmar wrote: Every time I say something really dumb the thread dies.
fixed it for you.
I wouldn't mind killing jat either.
Dismissal. He doesn't defend against my point and he doesn't try to use it to pry into my own alignment. He just outright dismisses my stuff, only to come back later and say:
On May 12 2015 19:55 sandroba wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:49 Palmar wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:49 sandroba wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:47 Palmar wrote: I don't really think BM is mafia but I haven't read too much up on the game.
Any time frame we should expect the reading to start? I enjoy playing games with you, but not when I can't actually discuss important points with you and get your input.
You're mafia so why do you care?
If you believe so, I want you to tell me why that is. I can't tell if you are trolling/tunneling aimlessly or you actually believe what you are saying.
Which implies he doesn't know why I think he's mafia, when I had already explained it then.
Also
2). His reaction to the BM pardon.
Sandroba literally just made this case on BM:
On May 12 2015 19:34 sandroba wrote: I think we do need to lynch BM today. The bullshit level in his posts is a lot higher than anything I've seen from him. It is still possible that he is town and using a large quantity of drugs but that I cannot account for, and unless someone can confirm him town so he can be safely ignored we will need to deal with him at some point and I would prefer if it was today. One example of the BS he is pushing that I think points to him clearly lying on purpose and not being on drugs is this post:
On May 12 2015 16:22 Bill Murray wrote:
On May 11 2015 10:06 Trfel wrote: Hello.
I'll get to this game in a few hours at the latest. I am sorry for my absence today, I'll be better during the week than on weekends.
The purpose of this post is to ensure that I comply with the "one post every 24 hours" rule. Meanwhile, enjoy some music.
So Trfel makes excuses "ill be absent" "this post it so ensure that i comply with the one post every 24 hours rule" then he posts a video... cool. really beneficial before this all he had done was harass people
Then I nuke him for behaving like this, which didnt fit how he played last game as town
WITHIN AN HOUR of him "fulfilling his daily post on mothers day", he posts:
On May 11 2015 14:05 Trfel wrote: You're kidding me.
You nuked me for low activity on a weekend, and Mothers' Day?
I really hope you are not town here, because you being town would really kill my motivation to play this game. I mean, if you're going to give the majority of your posts for the first 24 hours away, you really shouldn't be killing me for not playing in a 24 hour period.
And not only that, but he wants to misrepresent what happened He instead attacks me NOT for me nuking him, but wants to lie and come up with some bullshit excuse to basically omgus me
1) he tries to nuke me in return that doesnt work 2) he votes me 3) he then proceeded to ask me if i have any more nukes after unvoting 4) he finds out i have no more nukes 5) he votes me again
this guy isnt enjoyable to play with, and his behavior is self serving and scummy as fuck
He is clearly nit picking and ignoring parts of trfel post. trfel states that he is going to be back in a few hours to this game but BM does not bold that part and bolds parts that change the meaning of the post. Also he flat out lies about the time elapsed between the 2 posts, which was 4 hours, not one, in accordance to the part BM chose to overlook in his first post. Conclusion is I think he is doing it on purpose and is mafia for it. ##vote: BM
And his primary scumread gets pardoned.
This is fucking sandroba people. Not some random scrub who doesn't know jack shit about the game. Again, I may be projecting my own personality but I'd be so mad at this.
Think how I would've reacted if anyone would've pardoned GB in mini mafia mini thing or someone had pardoned WoS in noir 3. I was mad enough with people just not listening to me. But someone actively shutting me down? Fuck that.
I don't think sandroba cares, I think he didn't defend my case and instead chose to dismiss it and I think my initial point was very good.
On May 13 2015 02:12 Palmar wrote: I'm off guys for a while and I think I'm also out of posts.
I'm okay with my vote where it is. I don't think sandroba would dismiss my stuff as trolling if he was town. I'm waffling a bit because people keep telling me he's not mafia and marv seems to actually be willing to sort of go out on a limb to defend him which I'm not sure marv would do as a scumbuddy. But the points against him stand.
oh yeah in addition to sandro i'm still fine with JAT lynch but I'm too laz to write a case and I think Palmar's star power plus sandro acting weird should be on its own enough to get sandro lynched. i'll check back in a few hours, say my name in your post and i'll read it if your got questions for me
On May 13 2015 05:47 Blazinghand wrote: Eh, I get it, Vivax is being uncaring or whatever, and he actually is a really amazing player as town. I can't really give a good argument in his defense, but I still think the right move here is to follow Palmar, who has god tier D1 reads
On March 28 2020 02:50 Rels wrote: Trfel I'm very sorry if you're town. Because I'm going to say another thing that I find scummy about you, and I don't want you to feel bad if you're town. I know I could be bias confirming ...
The way you're talking about your scumreads is so sure, when I thought you were a very doubtful person. So that's something that makes me think you're scum too.
Yeah, I used to be more like that, over the past few years things have changed. That's actually why rsoultin voted to kill me the past few games and I flipped town in both of them.
Furthermore, desperate times call for desperate measures. I've been scumread SO MUCH for uncertainty and waffling that I'm trying to adjust my play to include more certainty and stronger pushes.
But as to my post above, if it needs explanation:
In Assassination Mafia, Blazinghand (town) dropped his reads and sheeped Palmar on Day 1 due to his belief in Palmar's amazing Day 1 reads.
So there you go, there's the Palmar Day 1 meta I was talking about.
On March 28 2020 02:53 LightningStrike wrote: btw Trfel Palmar was scum in that game you just got that quote from just FYI.
Doesn't matter Palmar's alignment in that game, what matters is Blazinghand's alignment (town). It's the Blazinghand posts we're looking at. Proves the Palmar Day 1 meta thing.
On March 28 2020 02:27 Trfel wrote: I'm so sick of getting killed Day 1 for nonsense, garbage reasons, it happened the last two games.
Yet again, no one has responded to the actual thoughts I've been sharing, people are picking on meaningless semantics.
And there's a ridiculously scummy person (KelsierSC) who definitely deserves to be killed but no one cares. He "redeemed himself" with a single post that contained actual thinking:
On March 27 2020 20:14 KelsierSC wrote: Trfel
Not a huge amount to write about him that hasn't been said. I think agreeing with HF isn't scummy it's a lot of writing with quotes and everything. The part I don't like is how he throws on some additional fire that actually says nothing about my alignment. feels like this is added on so it doesn't look like a blatant sheep
These don't line up. I get that agreeing with someone's reads and reading them as town are different things, but in this case KelsierSC didn't like LightningStrike's logic or read results and never mentioned a positive thing. Just read the posts yourself, I still don't understand AT ALL how KelsierSC decided to townread LightningStrike there. There was nothing about the conversation that "felt ok."
I think his palmar case is ok but I don't recall Palmar being good on D1 but his point about it not being a weekend has merit and palmar's lack of direction is a fair comment. I do like his comment about palmar being an unlikely D1 lynch so vote me instead, that's a pretty town mindset.
Finally he made some non commital stuff about sentinel , scum lean but holding back.
I think trefl is good enough for a D1 pass.
I was never non-comittal about [UoN]Sentinel, I never said he was a scum lean. I never said I was holding back. I said I wanted to wait for more information and see how his play evolved, which made sense given the circumstance.
In this post KelsierSC even says that my two main pushes/scumreads, comprising the majority of my play this game, are both ok. Yet he still thinks I'm mafia. He's picking on semantics, making up reasons, and has absolutely NOT redeemed his earlier play.
On March 28 2020 02:31 Rels wrote: Trfel I read everything you wrote and I've responded to you:
On March 27 2020 12:43 Rels wrote: Trfel the more I read your Palmar case the more I think you're mafia. It's just too on the nose. You're very smart, but your reasonning is so focused on a surface level it doesn't match. Like this:
On March 27 2020 09:54 Trfel wrote: Palmar doesn't care about who gets lynched. From town perspective this makes no sense. To me it feels like he's just interested in surviving and is disinterested otherwise, or that KelsierSC is town and Palmar is trying to set up extra mislynches.
I don't see you believing this. It's too obvious - of course Palmar's play is disinterested, if you want to push him it's because you want to warn him of doing something or die or something like that. I have a hard time believing that you really think he slipped up and was too carefree in his posts ...
Rels, I don't really understand what you're saying here. You're saying I'm mafia because my case on Palmar is too simple? Like the reasoning is too obvious?
Why can't a simple reason make someone mafia? I've found it's so easy to overthink things while simple reads are often overlooked and tend to be right.
it's not that it's only simple, it's that it's simple and wrong. Palmar being carefree early in the game doesn't mean anything. But you made a big deal out of it. It doesn't match what I expect of you
I wouldn't use the word carefree, I'd just say he's not invested at all. Since when do we give players a free pass for doing absolutely nothing and not even wanting to see their scumreads lynched?
Note that Palmar even changed his play after I called him out on it! He went ahead and voted for ShoCkeyy, his top scum read, after all. And is now sitting off of the main wagons. If this isn't scummy I don't know what is.
so that's it? You solved the game D1 already?
There's always a chance I could be wrong, but you know it's not scummy for people to be sure of scumreads that end up being wrong. Everyone does it. We also both know if I say "Palmar could be scum but also I could be wrong, same with the alternative wagon, KelsierSC" I'm just going to die because my pushes and reads have no force.
I will ALWAYS play to save myself because I KNOW I am town. Like I said, desperate times call for desperate measures.
On March 28 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote: Oh boy if KSC is town this game is going to get really interesting. I'll also feel bad cause I tried to save him.
If he's mafia, then well, I think it'll just prove HF is town, while Palmar definitely becomes scummier...
Why is Palmar's alignment related to KelsierSC's in this way? If KelsierSC was mafia, Palmar voted for him very early, and then switched to an off wagon...
I just don't understand this.
On March 28 2020 03:03 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: :pop:
And this, I hate whenever people show up right AFTER the deadline instead of helping before.
And @Holyflare, what vindicating qualities does Palmar have now?
Gonna take some time to rethink, I'll probably be around sporadically for the rest of the day.
On March 28 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote: Oh boy if KSC is town this game is going to get really interesting. I'll also feel bad cause I tried to save him.
If he's mafia, then well, I think it'll just prove HF is town, while Palmar definitely becomes scummier...
Why is Palmar's alignment related to KelsierSC's in this way? If KelsierSC was mafia, Palmar voted for him very early, and then switched to an off wagon...
I just don't understand this.
On March 28 2020 03:03 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: :pop:
And this, I hate whenever people show up right AFTER the deadline instead of helping before.
And @Holyflare, what vindicating qualities does Palmar have now?
Gonna take some time to rethink, I'll probably be around sporadically for the rest of the day.
Because it's the easiest play a scum player can make.... Vote for the first case to seem active, then vote for who you can try and frame as the scummiest player. It's literal mafia logic.
If I'm understanding you correctly, wouldn't this then also apply if KelsierSC was town (like he is)? Why does KelsierSC have to be mafia for this suspicion of Palmar to be true?
On March 28 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote: Oh boy if KSC is town this game is going to get really interesting. I'll also feel bad cause I tried to save him.
If he's mafia, then well, I think it'll just prove HF is town, while Palmar definitely becomes scummier...
Why is Palmar's alignment related to KelsierSC's in this way? If KelsierSC was mafia, Palmar voted for him very early, and then switched to an off wagon...
I just don't understand this.
On March 28 2020 03:03 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: :pop:
And this, I hate whenever people show up right AFTER the deadline instead of helping before.
And @Holyflare, what vindicating qualities does Palmar have now?
Gonna take some time to rethink, I'll probably be around sporadically for the rest of the day.
Because it's the easiest play a scum player can make.... Vote for the first case to seem active, then vote for who you can try and frame as the scummiest player. It's literal mafia logic.
If I'm understanding you correctly, wouldn't this then also apply if KelsierSC was town (like he is)? Why does KelsierSC have to be mafia for this suspicion of Palmar to be true?
I never claimed KSC was mafia? I never thought he was.
Okay, sorry, let me try and explain this again.
On March 28 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote: Oh boy if KSC is town this game is going to get really interesting. I'll also feel bad cause I tried to save him.
If he's mafia, then well, I think it'll just prove HF is town, while Palmar definitely becomes scummier...
This post has the following logic:
IF KelsierSC is TOWN -> no conclusion IF KelsierSC is MAFIA -> Holyflare is town, Palmar is scummier
On March 28 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote: Oh boy if KSC is town this game is going to get really interesting. I'll also feel bad cause I tried to save him.
If he's mafia, then well, I think it'll just prove HF is town, while Palmar definitely becomes scummier...
Why is Palmar's alignment related to KelsierSC's in this way? If KelsierSC was mafia, Palmar voted for him very early, and then switched to an off wagon...
I just don't understand this.
On March 28 2020 03:03 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: :pop:
And this, I hate whenever people show up right AFTER the deadline instead of helping before.
And @Holyflare, what vindicating qualities does Palmar have now?
Gonna take some time to rethink, I'll probably be around sporadically for the rest of the day.
Because it's the easiest play a scum player can make.... Vote for the first case to seem active, then vote for who you can try and frame as the scummiest player. It's literal mafia logic.
Which I can buy. However the logic here doesn't depend on anyone else's alignment at all.
Does anyone else see this? Unless I'm missing something or there is some explanation, ShoCkeyy shows a complete failure in logic here. Also note that he only has Palmar being scummier on the (If KelsierSC is Mafia) option, which isn't even what he thought! I don't understand how town could actually think this way.
Going for a walk now but I'll definitely take a closer look at ShoCkeyy.
On March 28 2020 02:50 Rels wrote: Trfel I'm very sorry if you're town. Because I'm going to say another thing that I find scummy about you, and I don't want you to feel bad if you're town. I know I could be bias confirming ...
The way you're talking about your scumreads is so sure, when I thought you were a very doubtful person. So that's something that makes me think you're scum too.
Yeah, I used to be more like that, over the past few years things have changed. That's actually why rsoultin voted to kill me the past few games and I flipped town in both of them.
Furthermore, desperate times call for desperate measures. I've been scumread SO MUCH for uncertainty and waffling that I'm trying to adjust my play to include more certainty and stronger pushes.
Like to those plays? I don't see it in your last game. Even in your big case that game, you're still using a language that match what I would expect from you:
Yeah yeah, I know, I'm one to talk, with my Eversince read and all. If that's really an issue for you let me know and I can explain it, I like to think we're all past that now though.
On Grackaroni:
On July 02 2019 09:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: Grack might be town.
Raynpelikoneet's initial town lean on Grackaroni. And here is his explanation:
On July 03 2019 23:02 raynpelikoneet wrote: I had a townread on grack early on because i decided (after his last scumgame) to read him like i read yamato. Grackaroni is quite a low quantity poster. His post early on where he asks kind of a throwaway question on Trfel made me think there is some sort of thought process in his head. I gave him a slight townread for that.
And here is the post in question:
On July 02 2019 05:03 Grackaroni wrote: Eversince looks different but it's also 4 years old.
I don't really trust her yet, but it seemed like Rayn had a really confident read on her in the last game, so I'd be interested to hear his take.
To me this doesn't show thought process at all, raynpelikoneet's explanation really doesn't make sense here. Grackaroni stated two extremely obvious points, and it took minimal effort, and could easily be done by mafia. He didn't even draw any conclusions from this.
Later, raynpelikoneet posts a further townread of Grackaroni:
On July 03 2019 01:36 raynpelikoneet wrote: well i think grack officially goes to town pool now.
Raynpelikoneet's reasons for this:
On July 03 2019 23:02 raynpelikoneet wrote: When he came back and followed up his stuff he actually DID follow it up and it even made sense.
Grackaroni's posts in question:
On July 03 2019 00:04 Grackaroni wrote: I think that post is very strange when compared to how he viewed me last game. I don't see how he can be so bothered by someone being willing to lynch me.
On June 24 2019 04:55 Trfel wrote: @Shapelog, what are you cooking?
Currently I think Grackaroni is the best shot at being mafia. He didn't interact at all with anyone and just vanished from the thread, and it doesn't really make sense for him to be scared of an innocent child... unless he's mafia. I know it's not very strong but it's the best I see, anyone have any similar or different ideas?
On July 03 2019 00:04 Grackaroni wrote: I think that post is very strange when compared to how he viewed me last game. I don't see how he can be so bothered by someone being willing to lynch me.
On June 24 2019 04:55 Trfel wrote: @Shapelog, what are you cooking?
Currently I think Grackaroni is the best shot at being mafia. He didn't interact at all with anyone and just vanished from the thread, and it doesn't really make sense for him to be scared of an innocent child... unless he's mafia. I know it's not very strong but it's the best I see, anyone have any similar or different ideas?
can you expand on this?
He found me suspicious in the last game for not interacting with thread and disappearing.
In this game he is calling other people opportunistic for considering voting me.
However, raynpelikoneet himself even posted reasons to doubt this reasoning:
On July 03 2019 00:04 Grackaroni wrote: I think that post is very strange when compared to how he viewed me last game. I don't see how he can be so bothered by someone being willing to lynch me.
On June 24 2019 04:55 Trfel wrote: @Shapelog, what are you cooking?
Currently I think Grackaroni is the best shot at being mafia. He didn't interact at all with anyone and just vanished from the thread, and it doesn't really make sense for him to be scared of an innocent child... unless he's mafia. I know it's not very strong but it's the best I see, anyone have any similar or different ideas?
can you expand on this?
He found me suspicious in the last game for not interacting with thread and disappearing.
In this game he is calling other people opportunistic for considering voting me.
but last game you did that as town in his mind right?
In addition to the fact that it's easily explained. Grackaroni didn't even draw any conclusios from this, he just called it "very strange." To be honest, I don't see a ton of thought process or follow-up from Grackaroni in these posts, which is how raynpelikoneet characterized them. And I don't think most other players did either. So where did raynpelikoneet's townread come from? It feels like too much information, in this case, truly knowing that Grackaroni is town and letting that affect his read.On Conversion: Raynpelikoneet's first post implying a townread of Conversion:
On July 02 2019 09:55 raynpelikoneet wrote: Hi conversion, seems like we share a lot of things and feelings. Are you me?
Weren't you one of the people who got mad at me and scumread me for doing the same thing a few games ago?
Never mind I'm confusing you with someone else. Carry on
I think Eversince is town, discuss?
Why do you think I'm town?
Your posts feel so carefree and relaxed and comfortable, which is the complete opposite of your last game as mafia, which felt very rigid and forced. Plus, instead of relying on losing the wifi hotspot and the pre-game excuse, you seem to have redoubled your efforts to engage in the game and be involved. To me that makes a decent townread
Weren't you one of the people who got mad at me and scumread me for doing the same thing a few games ago?
Never mind I'm confusing you with someone else. Carry on
I think Eversince is town, discuss?
Why do you think I'm town?
Your posts feel so carefree and relaxed and comfortable, which is the complete opposite of your last game as mafia, which felt very rigid and forced. Plus, instead of relying on losing the wifi hotspot and the pre-game excuse, you seem to have redoubled your efforts to engage in the game and be involved. To me that makes a decent townread
I don’t like this post. ick
Care to say why?
too feel good-y for my condensed ball of rage and hatred
also 4 year old meta seems like a reach to have a swing towards a read in any direction that early instead of something to pocket and observe for late
This is at least somewhat understandable, though really Conversion only shared one thought. Later, raynpelikoneet posts this:
On July 02 2019 23:35 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yeah conversion easily town this game.
You can look here for the specific posts, it's a little long; but for a brief summary, Conversion's posts in question are pushing onto Eversince. Seems to be a townread simply for also scumreading Eversince. You can look at this exchange yourself, it starts on page 11, I just really feel (again) like this is a weak townread that doesn't have justification to back it up.
Raynpelikoneet didn't care about the Day 1 lynch, between his townread and his scumread + Show Spoiler [Analysis] +
Honestly I think this is probably the strongest point I have. From raynpelikoneet's perspective, the lynch in the last eight minutes was his townread (Conversion) against his strong scumread (Eversince). Posts in the thread in the last eight minutes of Day 1, making it clear that shenanigans were incoming:
On July 04 2019 04:24 Pandain wrote: I'm strongly for a Conv lynch (if Grack won't get lynched) just because I have town reads on everyone except Grack and him.
Jock is way too active. Rayn is way too active. HF could be scum but seems townie. Trfel is playing like his town games. Eywa was really townie with his exhcnage with me.
Who else wants to lynch Conv (or grack)
On July 04 2019 04:26 Jockmcplop wrote: Pandain switch to conversion with me
On July 04 2019 04:26 Jockmcplop wrote: Pandain switch to conversion with me
I switched.
Who else wants to join?
On July 04 2019 04:27 Pandain wrote: If ES and Trfel switch ES is saved Grack vote conv
So raynpelikoneet was present, and if he was at all reading, knew that shenanigans were coming and that Conversion being lynched was at least a possiblity. During these last eight minutes, here are raynpelikoneet's posts:
On July 04 2019 04:23 raynpelikoneet wrote: I get that i am probably overreacting, i just hate when someone is for example called out for lying and they say "but i just did it because the sky is red" and people go woaaah must be town, nothing wrong with that, look they gave an EXPLANATION, when i n fact the whole explanation doesn't make any fucking sense at all.
On July 03 2019 01:09 Eversince wrote: And I've played with HF a few times over the years. He's stupid good mafia player. If he's town he'll figure things out! Go look at his massive list of games to look. Like he can be wrong but mafia almost always shoot into the vets on this site (HF/Rayn/Marv etc..etc.)
@Raynpelikoneet, is the bolded the thing you are using to scumread Eversince?
Because to me, Eversince is saying here that Holyflare is good at mafia as a game, not as an alignment.
She also clarified that she meant I'm good at mafia rather than the mafia alignment.
I know she did but do you believe that's the truth? I don't.
That was everyone's interpetation of the comment except you. You're the only one reading it otherwise. Also, it's clear that he meant the game and not the alignment because she specifically says "if he's town he'll figure it out" right after. It wouldn't be very sensical if she was referring to the mafia alignment and then said hes a good town player.
that's not my point. my point is noone says "good at the game" unless the player in consideration is also good as mafia, because people who are only good as town are not good mafia players.
Even I think this point is a stretch my dude. I've seen plenty of people say that.
I could possibly believe her if she didnt try to prove her oiint with something that doesnt exist. Thats why i think she is making shit up on the fly.
He's continuing to argue and explain himself. He's only minimally pushing Eversince here, he's not saying anything about Conversion, he's not getting upset, he seems very calm and relaxed. In fact, it doesn't feel like raynpelikoneet is invested or cares about the lynch at all.
I know I made a similar point against Holyflare in my case on him, but that was a bad case. There the point was bad, because in that game Holyflare made several posts to Eversince, calling her mafia, in the same time window. The argument against Holyflare was that the posts were addressed to Eversince instead of the thread, which is weak. And even still Holyflare made a post to the threaad in response to the shenanigans:
On July 04 2019 22:42 Holyflare wrote: Rayn what exactly are your reads actually?
ES + Grackaroni mafia pretty much.
On July 05 2019 04:04 raynpelikoneet wrote: Aside from ES you should kill Grack. He made the post on me being mafia, i can understand you not agreeing with me here or even thinking it's a good post. Just read it again. It doesn't make sense i am sorry i can't explain it further. Then there is the post on Conversion i challenged at eod, the reasons he says conv is mafia for happened when he read conv town, middle point of the post is fluff that doesnt make anyone anything and the the rest is "rayn and conversion are mfia because other people i have better feelings on". Me + Conversion were his top town reads!!!!!! Who did what? He never goes into anything like who actually did something and what makes them town. He just throws out a narrative and sticks shit with it, conversion up to lynch and me to throw distrust on.
Sorry if not clear, but that's what i think.
On July 05 2019 04:08 raynpelikoneet wrote: Kill ES, kill Grack, profit.
On July 05 2019 04:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: Lynch ES, lynch Grack. If either of them are town then idk, maybe Pandain? I have a hard time seeing anyone else as mafia. Maybe maybe maybe Eywa but that reasoning i have at the back of my head is fucked up and you will have to figure out yourself. Eywa is not mafia though.
And here is raynpelikoneet's reaction to End of Night 1, seeing Holyflare and Grackaroni flip town:
On July 05 2019 04:33 raynpelikoneet wrote: fuck you
On July 05 2019 04:33 raynpelikoneet wrote: vigi what`?
On July 05 2019 04:37 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why no shot on ES? Why in the hell?
It doesn't make sense for raynpelikoneet to be mad here. He was highly suspecting Grackaroni, he was going to lynch Grackaroni after Eversince anyway. One of his scumreads still died, objectively it wasn't a bad shot. Raynpelikoneet has no reason to be mad about this, as he can still go and lynch Eversince (his other scumread) and then find out who the last mafia (assuming Eversince is mafia) is, the vigilante shot didn't really change much of anything.
Except raynpelikoneet is mad about it anyway. This doesn't make sense from what his perspective should be.
Conclusion: I think there is a decent chance raynpelikoneet is mafia. I still want to filter everyone else before I decide, but I think these are some solid reasons to be suspicious of raynpelikoneet.
I'm not sure what you are meaning by quoting the previous game here. Can you show more clearly what you are trying to point out?
As for meta... Which games of mine are you reading? I don't believe the Mafia Database has been updated for quite some time. I recommend reading games more recent than three years ago or so... From End of the World Party Mafia, where I was the Town Doctor and got lynched Day 1, rsoultin's posts (ok it was gonna be posts but I deleted one of them and I'm too lazy to find it again, it's nested in there anyway):
On March 05 2019 04:48 Trfel wrote: Voting Palmar for mayor because of all of the mayors' targets I want to see [UoN]Sentinel lynched most. Him having a townread on himself while claiming to have not read his role PM is super suspicious, moreso the more I think about it. Other than his huge list post he hasn't shown much thought at all, he's been just following the thread sentiment. His overall play makes his effort seem fabricated. A few reasons being quoting my reasoning in one area while highly scumreading me in another, and more importantly not seeming at all invested in his reads. If he put all that effort into reading and making his scumreads, he wouldn't not actually push those reads and follow the thread sentiment like a headless chicken. It feels forced, and like he's trying to use the effort to prove he's town.
##Mayor Palmar
:/ you feel off this game to me. there was a glimmer of truffledom and now it's gone again. you're not doing the truffle waffle
It's not my choice of targets? I can choose between [UoN]Sentinel and Palmar, I'm confident I much prefer [UoN]Sentinel, no need to waffle. If I was the mayor myself I'd probably go with Fecalfeast or maybe sicklucker. You're townreading Fecalfeast off of tone, right?
yeah it's mostly just him doing whatever the fuck and pointing out some things i agreed with at the time + damdy is usually pretty good at reading him and thinks he's town (though i think his read on him gets better later?)
ftr the truffle waffle is not usually dependent on other wagons unless my memory has really gone to shit
Where rsoultin scumread me for not waffling as I used to.
In fact, while I'm there, here's a link to my filter from that game if you haven't already read it.
On March 30 2020 01:27 Rels wrote: Palmar come and be obvious town so that I can focus on those two please please please
I'm already very obvious town.
Again, not my fault you can't read people.
Ok Palmar, I'll humor you, why are you obvious town? Because I really don't see it. You've spend most of the game afk and doing nothing and you don't feel invested or present in the slightest.
Still at work, I'll re-evaluate all my reads in a few hours and try to get reads on all the other players by end of niht.
@[UoN]Sentinel, any updates on when you'll provide those reads as promised?
I don't care much for [UoN]Sentinel but there's really nothing in his filter. It's just a giant blob of nothing... I could mayyyyybe understand his lack of thread presence as laziness while his target was being lynched* but there is absolutely no excuse for what he has done Day 2 (or lack thereof).
But I'm hesitant. Maybe it's stupid of me, but I'm hesitant because I can't really say why he is mafia (his activity is awful but that just makes him a lurker policy lynch). But literally everyone is scumreading him. That always makes me really nervous. I feel like mafia wouldn't let a member go down without a fight. And without solid reasons against him, I don't really like lynching him right now. I think what he does towards the End of Day 2 will be very informative for his alignment.
* Key difference here on why Palmar is so suspicious. Palmar's target wasn't being lynched, and he didn't care and did very little. In [UoN]Sentinel's case, his target was being lynched, so there was nothing to do.
On March 30 2020 05:02 ShoCkeyy wrote: If anything it’s most likely Palmar and Trfel. Dude has had a hardon for me since the beginning of the game, before I even really posted. Also LS the game started during the week. He had to have some time to play instead of his little one liners and insta calling me mafia.
ShoCkeyy, you really think I would be mafia with Palmar? As one of the only people actually suspecting Palmar this entire game?
On March 30 2020 06:16 GlowingBear wrote: Trfel who's mafia and why?
I don't know, I'm catching up on a lot and doing some filter dives. Care to help me?
No
Tell me what you think once you finish diving, please
Well if you don't want to help me find mafia, that does seem to sound like you are mafia yourself...
I need to take an exam, I'll look more after. Voting Palmar for now, I still need to look at GlowingBear's filter though. Then that would be the people I'm most interested in today.
On March 30 2020 06:16 GlowingBear wrote: Trfel who's mafia and why?
I don't know, I'm catching up on a lot and doing some filter dives. Care to help me?
No
Tell me what you think once you finish diving, please
Well if you don't want to help me find mafia, that does seem to sound like you are mafia yourself...
I need to take an exam, I'll look more after. Voting Palmar for now, I still need to look at GlowingBear's filter though. Then that would be the people I'm most interested in today.
This makes me want to vote you very, very hard.
I want to know your original opinions, who's probably Mafia and why. Why should I and how could I help you with that?
I want to find mafia, I really don't care who helps me as the goal is accomplished. If you're town, you should want to help because you should also want to find mafia.
On March 26 2020 03:09 LightningStrike wrote: Anyone want to help me find mafia?
Hi LS
Yes. Are you Mafia?
So why won't you help me "find mafia"? You know that doesn't mean I'm necessarily town in your eyes, or you wouldn't have said that to LightningStrike at the start of the game. I just don't get the inconsistency, are you trying to aggravate me?
Never mind, I don't care anymore. I just like having someone to bounce ideas off of and not feel like my thoughts are going out into nothingness.
I see your one-liner on Palmar now, my apologies, I missed it. Can you please explain again why Palmar's list post makes him town? I get that you like that he takes hard stances, but his stances are unexplained and make no sense. You said he's being objective, I'm challenging you to prove it.
Rels, care to respond to my post earlier this page to you?
GlowingBear, that's not why I am suspicious of Palmar. In short, Palmar doesn't care what happens, who gets lynched, or who is mafia, and I believe that makes him likely mafia. I'll see if I can explain it better later tonight when I am on a computer.
On March 30 2020 11:33 Trfel wrote: Rels, care to respond to my post earlier this page to you?
GlowingBear, that's not why I am suspicious of Palmar. In short, Palmar doesn't care what happens, who gets lynched, or who is mafia, and I believe that makes him likely mafia. I'll see if I can explain it better later tonight when I am on a computer.
I'm not sure he doesn't care, he is voting his scum read accordingly. If we lynch everyone who apparently isn't caring in this game, we would have to lynch half of the player list
I think I get what you're saying, but the key difference is his scum read isn't getting lynched.
And looking at Palmar's filter again I noticed something more.
On March 27 2020 22:07 Palmar wrote: I think we should lynch shockeyy over sentinel KSC?
How do you feel about this?
I liked what I read from shockeyy , so not for it.
Why would you want to?
He got mad when I called him mafia and felt it was random, yet until that point in the game he had done nothing except vote for Blazinhand? Feels oversensitive.
His first two posts in the game were both excuses even when bunch of people weren't even in the thread. He was telling us how he was totally not just afk, just doing something else.
He made some weird association between me and holyflare.
He has done very, very minimal amount of work for town.
On March 28 2020 02:16 Palmar wrote: It's a bad idea to lynch HF at the moment.
He is never going to be a lurky shit scum. He's going to be loud and controversial through the game. If by day 2-3 he hasn't done anything useful or been right on anything we just kill him.
We need to take out the background trash on day 1, that is how you play day 1.
Shockeyy has done literally nothing except making some excuses and throwing some random shit around. Hell even the fact that he's a late voter is a tiny mafia tell.
Murder him.
On March 29 2020 20:54 Palmar wrote: I’ll kill shockeyy as well
On March 29 2020 20:51 Palmar wrote: Seems like a good day to kill sentinel
(note: excluding list posts and scum pools where both were listed equally)
I recommend looking at Palmar's filter yourself to see it in chronological order.
But basically, there's a big jump in focus from ShoCkeyy to [UoN]Sentinel with no reason. What changed to make him less suspicious of ShoCkeyy? Seemingly nothing. What changed to make him more suspicious of [UoN]Sentinel? All Palmar says is that his filter is terrible, and since he hasn't posted that hasn't really changed at all between Day 1 and Day 2.
Palmar seems like a better and better lynch the more I look at it.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/yxX2qKG.gif)
