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On April 09 2018 04:52 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 04:29 Calix wrote:On April 09 2018 04:19 GlowingBear wrote:On April 09 2018 04:02 Calix wrote:On April 09 2018 03:53 GlowingBear wrote:On April 09 2018 03:11 Calix wrote:
Also I'm going to ask why you're still scum-reading me. I've posted quite a lot since you first voted for me. A lot of that posting had actual content in it. And you have not said whether any of that either gave you pause or made you feel more strongly about me. You've just asked some bland questions (what are your reads? Who would you lynch?) which don't specifically relate to anything I have said before you turned up. So I am curious. I skimmed people's posts a bit. I'll read it properly later. I'm asking you these things because... well... that's how I usually play the game. I don't like your read on Skynx, it was way too fast to call him town. I don't understand why you may be calling rayn scum. Vivax being scum for reevaluating stuff that fast doesn't sound scum to me, I actually believe scum would refrain from exposing himself like that. I mean, he gives a scum read, then Damdred says "I don't think you are right because of these reasons", he agrees with those reasons and townreads me. I think it's a reasonable stream of thoughts. That being said, considering your contributions, I'd expect a better scumread. It's easy for mafia to call town people town. Comitting to reasonable calling someone scum, in the other hand, is not safe for mafia. When you posted your scumreads, you said you need to reevaluate. When you posted your townreads, you didn't say anything. It's just... easy to say you're going to lynch someone you find scum by EoD. That's obvious. That's why, although you've contributed, I can't take my weak scumread from you. I admit it's weak, but it is a scumread. Wait, so it's 'way too fast' to call Skynx town but 'you expect a better scum-read' at this point after I just pursued two scum-reads? Really? Is it also not 'way too fast' to call you town as well? I don't know why you think my Skynx town-read is 'too hard and fast' when I've been town-reading you for longer. I posted my scum-reads, then engaged with my scum-reads, then was presented with new information which = reevaluation process. Saying I need to reevaluate after I've had a discussion with my top scum-read is just common sense. Ask better questions then. Also how the fuck am I still a 'weak scumread' for you? That's lame. And hypocritical, if I may say so myself  For the fact that you're lecturing me about shit scum-reads, your scum-read on me is shoddy. Uhm, let me express myself better. I'm not arguing about your townread on me. I think it's okay. Skynx, in the other hand, is a townread for a couple of posts that in my POV doesn't make him a strong townread. What he did can be faked (calling someone out then reevaluating right after it, then peacing out). I'd never give a townread on him because of that. I'm okay with your reevaluation process, but until you reevaluate, shouldn't you be lynching who you think it's mafia for now? I'm not lecturing you on anything. I'm as a good player as you are. You have to reevaluate rayn and vivax. I have to reevaluate you. But if you asked me: "who would you be lynching right now?", I would say "Calix", regardless of the need of reevaluation. You have the same weak scumreads as me, but you're not comitting in being lynching anyone. That's... evasive. Non-committal. That is what sounds scummy to me. I hate to break the news to you, but I'm not you. Therefore saying that I'm scummy for reading people for different reasons to you is an invalid argument. I am happy with my town-read on Skynx. Deal with it. Yes, I haven't unvoted and have no plans to. Because unvoting without having someone else to vote for is dumb. But right now, I'm not going to push for a lynch on someone that I am less sure of. So because I didn't respond to a generic question in the way you would, I'm scummy? Again, I'm not you, and accusing me on the basis that I didn't say "Vivax/ rayn" for "best lynches" is pedantic. And non-committal? I've taken more stances than most of the game has. I'm not going to feign confidence in my scum-reads if I am not actually as confident as I used to be. Dude lol calm down. It is a scum-trait to easily call people town and not really comitting to a lynch in the early game. It's not just my opinion. Anyone who has played a lot as mafia knows that calling town people town is a safe play while looking contributive. It's weak, but it is what it is. It's impossible to have a strong scumread when we have less than 20 pages in 24 hours.
I'm calm. I'm not sure why people keep thinking I'm not. Must have the verbal equivalent of Resting Bitch Face 
And yes, this game is ridiculously slow. Can't wait for the inevitable CFDs.
Aforementioned slowness is why I am considering lynching some AFK dude even if they're not my strongest scum-read. Lynching a top-poster on D1 is usually a bad idea. And rayn's filter is bigger than mine is.
Since you are so concerned about lynch suspects, who among the 'low posters' would you want to lynch aside from Skynx?
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On April 09 2018 04:56 GlowingBear wrote:
Like, Calix, did you see the reason why Skynx is scumreading me? He said it didn't make sense that I was euphoric to play but peaced out to go to the theatre (as we all know, starts at specific times), then he said I couldn't possibly be back 5:40 hours later. LOL.
Yes, I did. I think I asked him about how that showed scum motivation and then he said there wasn't town motivation for lying and then I said I had some ideas but I'd need to see what you said first.
It's not a thought process I agree with but I can see town!Skynx thinking "liars = scum".
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On April 09 2018 05:15 Vivax wrote:
I propose to get a wagon on n00bking going to motivate him
I'd be fine with an AFK lynch but saying it's gonna 'motivate him' is dumb. Dude has no problem posting as both alignments.
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Secondly, you straight-up accused me of making shit up but you don't even vote me for it?
From his wall-post:
2) Yeah i can see how you could believe that as town. Bad wording on my part. It was just the first thought that came to my mind. Do you also go with Holyflare 100% mafia because if he "is not bsing" as you accuse me of he should also always be mafia to you?
I'm assuming this is the answer that corresponds with this question since it's point #2.
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On April 09 2018 17:00 Tubesock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 16:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:Tubesock: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/524561-generic-mini-mafia-iii?user=SkynxOn July 13 2017 21:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 13 2017 21:40 Skynx wrote:
Meh i'm gona take a break then continue from where i left reading. so you basically did a case on me based on what i said the first couple of hours and without reading the actual explanations at all. man i was so right here: On July 13 2017 20:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
this guy can go to ignore pile.
he's probably gonna throw if it comes close. Funny thing is it's always "because rayn did the same thing last game as mafia". Without any thinking at all. I did laugh when his first post is a case on you. I didn’t read past page three on his filter. I’ll accept the point that he will always think you’re scummy in any game (if that’s your point). But the only similarities were the first post is a case about you. The games are a bit different. And if he’s self aware at all, something he likely would try to replicate as mafia. I’m up for lynching someone else I guess. Not HF though.
Why not HF? I know you said 'his lack of nitpicking' makes him more likely town but you still have him as 'solid null' so I don't really get why you don't want him lynched.
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After catching up properly with the overnight posting, I'm concluding that Eversince is a good lynch.
On April 09 2018 13:27 Eversince wrote:
I'll say now that Calix/Rayn business seems town on town to me. Doesn't make any sense why either Calix would go so rashly against other Rayn (Who is peculiarly tame this game). Both got a huge amount of attention and the time frame that it happened in doesn't make sense for mafia. Sure, late day hard push for an objective would have made sense. But so early in the day? I don't think mafia would have exposed them self in such a noticeable way that early. Also Calix re-eval is something that I do need to think about. Because that was a little weird. But, people can change there minds. I personally think it was genuine. It just happened in such a fast time frame. But ack, I can't give someone a hard time for realizing their mistake and changing their perspective.
GB's alright in my book. He had something that gave me questions when I was skimming. I'll post those when I re-read. Not bad enough for me to move off my town impression of him.
HF is so scarcely relevant right now that it's kinda scary. My experience with him has been:
1) Very strong points against people as either alignment.
2) Crazy active, this friend's filter at 2 pages after a day and a half r.r.....
3) Very inquisitive. He notices things that other people miss. Like a lot. He usually attacks these things and hammers scum for it. The fact that he's not currently doing it actually makes me think he's town. Even mafia HF exploits people trash comments. HF isn't doing that. He doesn't have any presence at all. So I will give him a light townread for right now (I hope you are ok HF!)
Oats is questionable to me r.r Like he pokes holes in lots of things that are easy to poke holes in. Then doesn't elaborate on them at all. But he's 'lukewarm' in the sense that he hasn't really pushed these ideas towards anything. His largest attempt was on Calix and he still didn't even bother trying to start a wagon. Seems unusual from a mafia perspective to complain points idle in thread for no gain. He can be on my fence.
Skynx is alright for now.
CH has literally no post in the thread that I remember atm. Would lynch.
Vivax is different than I remember from the times we last played. I'll give him time though.
Tubesock seems alright.
Exo_ He did make couple of post that I thought might be constructive. So I'll give him points for that. I'll filter him later and see what those were though. I don't remember r.r
I didn't even realize nOObking was in the game before I filtered him. Would lynch.
Damdie seems ok to me.
I think that covers everything. I'm sorry if I missed something! I will go shower, and be back in about 15 minutes!
Very fluffy post. Look at her reads. A lot of them are not even proper reads ("XYZ is ok" is literal fluff to make the post look more impressive). She concludes 'on the fence' for Oats after pointing out legitimately mafia behaviour (doubt-casting without committing to anything) but thinks there's no benefit for mafia to do this?!
She only 'wants to lynch' the super low posting AFK types and gives excuses for everyone else. I especially dislike her read on me. The way it's constructed is weird. It seems too tentative. When she says 'the reevaluation was a little weird' but then adds several sentences about why it doesn't mean I am mafia.
I also do not like her subsequent heavy defense posts about Skynx and I in lieu of finding a suspect to lynch. Since Skynx and I are currently under moderate amounts of suspicion, I feel she is white-knighting me. I did note that she at least stated 'I don't have any strong scum-reads' but I didn't see any real attempt to change that.
Oats vs Eversince was also odd. Looked like Oats thought Eversince was doing something scummy in #376 (in reference to Skynx not getting any traction), Eversince then posts something about Tubesock, and then Oats asks for a response to his post in #386. Which Eversince did not respond to. That's the second time now that she's dodged questions while still obviously being in the thread.
+ Show Spoiler [Evidence] +On April 09 2018 15:04 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 13:50 Eversince wrote:
But he did nothing with it? If it came from mafia Skynx I assume his team would be behind him? It was just a wall post that everyone seems to dismiss. You see what I'm saying? Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 14:15 Eversince wrote:
I don't see Calix as mafia. Skynx's post on GB/Rayn got no traction at all. I'll assume with 13 players there is at least 3 mafia. For it to gain no traction when most active are skeptical of Rayn just seems wrong to me. Explain why the hell skynx' case getting traction or not shows his alignment without talking about the quality of his case. On April 09 2018 15:21 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 15:19 Eversince wrote:
Yes, and that's fine TS. I mention that before. I think you're wrong but at least you reason out your thoughts. I hope you are around long enough I can talk to you tonight. hey wheres my reply
In short:
- Wishy-washy
- More focused on defending 'suspicious' players over finding mafia
- Only wants to lynch low-posters who won't bite back
- Evasive
- Terrible read on Oatsmaster. Seriously, just look at it
##vote Eversince
As a side note: rayn's #405 sounded legit when I saw it and I think Tubesock is town statistically more likely to have a town role PM than the average player
Oats gets some town points too but this is mostly because of his Eversince posts lol.
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Why lynch ExO_ over HF or myself or Eversince? I say lynch because ExO_ already said he will basically be absent for some time. And you still think HF and myself are scummy as far as I am aware.
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On April 09 2018 18:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 18:34 Calix wrote:
Why lynch ExO_ over HF or myself or Eversince? I say lynch because ExO_ already said he will basically be absent for some time. And you still think HF and myself are scummy as far as I am aware. Because i don't really think you're mafia anymore and i am a pussy who will not vote for HF most likely on D1 anyways.
What changed your mind?
"Pussy" and "raynpelikoneet" are not two words I would usually put in the same sentence
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Didn't rayn, currentlyhomeless, etc, saying "you're not voting lol, put your money where your mouth is" not tip you off earlier, HF?
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After EXTENSIVE research - which involved opening some kush filters and ctrl+f-ing "HF" - I have concluded that I only found one game (Holyf***e Mafia) where kush correctly read HF as mafia. But I only looked at some of his recent games in the database.
Also I have no experience with this guy so I do not know how to interpret his current behaviour.
I would probably not lynch ExO_ or currentlyhomeless unless Eversince does something townie instead of just "okay". And even then, I think Vivax is a better lynch since he has yet to say anything intelligent and has nothing but "okay" posts. Which actually makes him more likely to be mafia now that I reflect on his posting because mafia are always trying to make "okay" posts and not much else.
The point about Eversince having a dodgy read on HF is good but I maintain that the Oats read is whack. I just do not comprehend how someone writes that about a player and doesn't think there's mafia motive there.
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On April 09 2018 20:01 Tubesock wrote:
My lynch order would be something like:
Skynx
Currentlyplayless
Vivax, Exo, Damdred
They’re all pretty much the same really.
Doubt i would vote n00bking. Won’t vote for the rest of the game, including Eversince.
I think the only legitimate criticisms for her is her weird reads. I don’t understand her conclusions on Skynx, Damdred, Oats (not so much what she said in her list but our conversation), or Exo. When I talked to her I think she was being honest and open about her opinions. So I’m not faulting her for that. Anyway, I think she’s town.
What makes you town-read n00bking strongly enough to say that you 'won't vote [him] for the rest of the game'? Or was that comment just referring to Eversince?
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On April 09 2018 20:45 Eversince wrote:
ack, i guess i'm misunderstood lol. Calix thinks I'm scum.
Rayn think's I'm scum.
The people I knighted for have gone against me.
Ask your questions, I don't want to be lynched because we misunderstand each other.
Could you elaborate on your HF and Oats reads? Because as I noted before, I don't get how you are not mafia-reading Oats.
And rayn/ HF do not understand why you're town-reading HF (I think).
Also I am rereading your posts. Because n00bking said your theories about mafia coordination were not unusual. When I first read those posts, I thought they were unconvincing (because one cannot tell how active or coordinated a mafia team is) but I wasn't sure whether it meant anything for your alignment. Since it apparently doesn't, it follows that there may be further misunderstandings.
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On April 09 2018 20:55 Eversince wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 20:51 Calix wrote:On April 09 2018 20:45 Eversince wrote:
ack, i guess i'm misunderstood lol. Calix thinks I'm scum.
Rayn think's I'm scum.
The people I knighted for have gone against me.
Ask your questions, I don't want to be lynched because we misunderstand each other. Could you elaborate on your HF and Oats reads? Because as I noted before, I don't get how you are not mafia-reading Oats.And rayn/ HF do not understand why you're town-reading HF (I think). Also I am rereading your posts. Because n00bking said your theories about mafia coordination were not unusual. When I first read those posts, I thought they were unconvincing (because one cannot tell how active or coordinated a mafia team is) but I wasn't sure whether it meant anything for your alignment. Since it apparently doesn't, it follows that there may be further misunderstandings. I am scum reading Oats though?
You said he was on the fence which I interpreted as a nullish read.
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On April 09 2018 20:57 Eversince wrote:
Because he hasn't been at all productive with his points. That's a problem. I misword maby?
Any of them in particular which you felt were 'not at all productive'?
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Anyway I got to actually opening filters and n00bking is not someone I fancy lynching today. He agrees with me a lot (buddying FTW), is asking good questions and I don't see much of an agenda with his posts. Basically he's doing stuff.
Would like some explicit reads so I know where his head's at though. Right now he's consistently made posts which imply I am town, consistently suggests Vivax is mafia, and some posts about a few other players like Eversince.
Envisioning that Eversince is scum, then is she also white-knighting Skynx? Or do you think the way she's defending him feels different, and that he's more likely to be a scummate than just another townie she's trying to cozy up to?
Generally I do not make pre-flip associations.
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On April 09 2018 21:04 Eversince wrote:
Look at his filter. All of it is 'This is wrong' Ignores caring about. Doesn't push. Doesn't fish around (Like right now! I am here but nothing?)
Hm, you might have a point. He does have a lot of negative posts in his filter.
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Took the liberty of making a vote count and town is well organised innit.
Eversince, who are you gonna vote for?
Would also like ExO_'s other mafia reads, or whoever he would vote for outside of his "placeholder" vote.
Day 1 Vote count
remaining
Eversince (3): Calix, raynpelikoneet, ExO_ Calix (2): GlowingBear, Oatsmaster Holyflare (1): currentlyhomeless GlowingBear (1): Skynx n00bking (1): Vivax Vivax (1): n00bking Skynx (1): Tubesock ExO_ (0): raynpelikoneetRaynpelikoneet (0): CalixNot Voting:Holyflare, Eversince, Damdred
Currently Eversince is set to be lynched.
Voting is mandatory! Place votes in THIS THREAD (link)
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On April 09 2018 21:22 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 17:19 n00bKing wrote:On April 09 2018 01:05 Calix wrote:
Half of rayn's posts seem divorced from anything going on in the thread. I can hardly tell what he is referring to half the time since he seems to mix up who he's talking to when he responds to people. Independent of anything else, this for sure is true. I had already noticed that his posts are more difficult to follow than anyone else's, before reading this from you. And that's with me reading the thread chronologically; I'm sure it'll be even worse if anyone tries to look into his filter later in the game. If he's Town, then the fact that his posts will later be almost impossible for other Town players to look at, read, and understand, would not be great for his win condition. But if he's Scum, the fact that his posts will later be indecipherable for Town players would not hurt his win condition at all. I find rayns posts very coherent to read. They are just long, but he doesn't beat around the bush. He is also town so I will defend him to my last breath. You also started posting after I voted for you. Coincidence or caught pants down? Either way the fact you are discrediting the way rayn posts really puts you in a bad light for me. I think Calix is town too but busy annoying the raynzo for false reasons and you just chime in taking sides lazily with the above post.
What game are you reading? rayn's early posts were not 'very coherent'. Multiple players have agreed with this sentiment.
If I was annoying rayn for ""false"" reasons then how am I town? O_______o
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On April 09 2018 21:26 Eversince wrote:
None of the most questionable people from my list have wagons. I don't have the time or energy to dedicate into trying.
Dunno if you've noticed, luv, but nobody has a wagon so that excuse won't fly. You have three votes. Oats hasn't been discussed aside from Tubesock thinking he's 'solid town' but people have been talking about lynching CH who you would vote for if I recall nicely.
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On April 09 2018 21:32 ExO_ wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2018 21:23 Calix wrote:Took the liberty of making a vote count and town is well organised innit. Eversince, who are you gonna vote for? Would also like ExO_'s other mafia reads, or whoever he would vote for outside of his "placeholder" vote. Day 1 Vote count
remaining
Eversince (3): Calix, raynpelikoneet, ExO_ Calix (2): GlowingBear, Oatsmaster Holyflare (1): currentlyhomeless GlowingBear (1): Skynx n00bking (1): Vivax Vivax (1): n00bking Skynx (1): Tubesock ExO_ (0): raynpelikoneetRaynpelikoneet (0): CalixNot Voting:Holyflare, Eversince, Damdred
Currently Eversince is set to be lynched.
Voting is mandatory! Place votes in THIS THREAD (link) Right now I don’t think I have any scum reads I’m super confident in but I’m not a fan of Damdreds 4 posts
Don't care about 'confident' reads. It's D1. Who else do you think has "above average odds for being mafia"?
Why don't you like Damdred's posts?
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EPT
