EPTshitty omgus? check
hopelessly tunneled? check
neither side decisively winning? check
definitely a TvT argument
[M][Cap] Tortoise Mafia - Page 46
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Tumblewood
United States3709 Posts
shitty omgus? check hopelessly tunneled? check neither side decisively winning? check definitely a TvT argument | ||
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Tumblewood
United States3709 Posts
this is a shitty reason and very easy to refute, but he's responding from a ground of "nah you guys are so silly I'm confirmed town" then again, I'd expect him to prioritize his survival a lot more if he were last scum hmmm not seeing anyone more convincing though | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
Day 3: Fidei86 (3) - Koshi, TicTock, Half the Sky GlowingBear (1) - gumshoe, Half the Sky (0) - Not Voted (4) - Shapelog, Fidei86, Tumblewood, GlowingBear At the current vote, Fidei86 is slated to be lynched. until deadline. | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
On April 28 2016 02:18 Tumblewood wrote: I don't like fidei's response to being pushed this is a shitty reason and very easy to refute, but he's responding from a ground of "nah you guys are so silly I'm confirmed town" then again, I'd expect him to prioritize his survival a lot more if he were last scum hmmm not seeing anyone more convincing though I'm now home and sat at my computer and ready to start filter diving. Please wait what I come up with before voting. I gave up practising softball with my team for this, so I hope you all at least read what I have to say before mindlessly voting me. | ||
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
On April 28 2016 02:49 Fidei86 wrote: I'm now home and sat at my computer and ready to start filter diving. Please wait what I come up with before voting. I gave up practising softball with my team for this, so I hope you all at least read what I have to say before mindlessly voting me. lol. please go practice if you still can. You are 100% the lynch. | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
You know, for all the people voting me, I don't see anyone really considering anyone else (apart from gumshoe and GB against each other). When I flip town you're all going to have to rethink things. As far as I can see you're all just meandering towards my lynch. You're wasting time and this is exactly what mafia wants. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
Too sumirise one last time these are the major points vs gb. 1) agreed with tic when they were saying different things in a manner that points to the enforcement of a mislynch. 2) Dyh's risky defense of him 3) his convenient appearance right at the end of day 1. 4) His claim that me pushing him makes me mafia, which town gb would know is certainly not the case(hes well aware of me being derp tunneled as town). 5) His push on koshi in reference to me, his other scum read (claiming koshi was wierd for not voting me) and doubling back on this by saying he never associative read us. 6) his faint sl push. 7) hes a brah 8) his very weak night 2, consistent with scum on the verge of giving up after losing both mates 9) his omega town read of dyh. 10) sls faint attack vs him I've cut all the frivolous stuff about lying, and meta(mostly) these are the key points of why I am voting gb and am unlikely to change my vote. I have read the case on fedie, and though his wafflin is notable this post. WELL THIS FILLS ME WITH FUCKING CONFIDENCE just before the flip, feels genuine. Makes me think he didnt actually know what dyh was / : as opposed to trying to get people to jump off at the last second, i would use time stamps to prove this but I think ive lost my badge on that account / : tic tock is also pretty townie to me but most seem to agree on that account so yeah, no need to dig there. Hts as well. Clearly whatever more I say will fall on deaf ears as this town simply does not trust me to find scum or even simply not be scum. That distrust is perhaps not unwarranted , but seeing as I'm already pretty spent I'll save what remains of my posts for the night. Gl town. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 28 2016 02:18 Tumblewood wrote: I don't like fidei's response to being pushed this is a shitty reason and very easy to refute, but he's responding from a ground of "nah you guys are so silly I'm confirmed town" then again, I'd expect him to prioritize his survival a lot more if he were last scum hmmm not seeing anyone more convincing though (last post for reals for reals) Actually the confirmed town thing is a generally a town thing. Townies are always very excited about things that prove theyre town, because now they can just call the other players idiots if they get lynched (see ritoky every game) even if something isnt 100 percent confirming, because its convincing and it lines up with the truth (for an actual townie) townies celebrate and flaunt thier statues, thereby pissing off everyone else ( because in mafia nobody actually considers likely hood of alternative explanations, they just use them to continue pushing whoever they feel like) Honestly, theres nothing that players hate more than hearing "this makes me confirmed town" while the rest of thier play looks scummy. They will 100 percent disregard that factor as almost any defense (besides hard role claims) can be poked apart and if you piss off enough people its only a matter of time before that happens. | ||
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Tictock
United States6052 Posts
On April 28 2016 02:18 Tumblewood wrote: I don't like fidei's response to being pushed this is a shitty reason and very easy to refute, but he's responding from a ground of "nah you guys are so silly I'm confirmed town" then again, I'd expect him to prioritize his survival a lot more if he were last scum hmmm not seeing anyone more convincing though Aren't those the same thing? Trying to argue that he is confirmed town IS playing for survival... In regards to your post before this one, what exactly is my comfort zone? And yea Shape is kinda just floating this game, not sure that is AI if he's been having RL issues. Will revist him if Fidei flips green I suppose kus while it's unlikely he's mafia having been pushed/voted by both SL and DYH I suppose it's possible. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
I'm back. On April 28 2016 02:57 Fidei86 wrote: -_- You know, for all the people voting me, I don't see anyone really considering anyone else (apart from gumshoe and GB against each other). When I flip town you're all going to have to rethink things. As far as I can see you're all just meandering towards my lynch. You're wasting time and this is exactly what mafia wants. This is wrong. Koshi has had one eye on me, and I cross-examined the gb/gumshoe exchange. I won't speak for others, but wasting time is the very last thing I've done. On April 28 2016 00:51 Tictock wrote: Another thing to note about Fidei is that he has done jack all today but defend himself. He's just stuck with his PoE list, and I still don't get why he wants to lynch HtS over me who has far more points about in his filter. I mean I get things come up and whatnot he has been around this phase but it's getting closer and closer to deadline with no real effort to push his scumreads or refine his PoE list. Just saying. Gumshoe, re post 909, that wasn't an exact quote by Tumbleweed, but Tumbleweed was I think paraphrasing the argument that Fidei considers himself that way because of the votes, and the voting argument has been beaten to death. He's called himself town Jesus in a list post I know at one point but what comes into question is why he's calling himself that. | ||
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Tictock
United States6052 Posts
On April 28 2016 02:57 Fidei86 wrote: -_- You know, for all the people voting me, I don't see anyone really considering anyone else (apart from gumshoe and GB against each other). When I flip town you're all going to have to rethink things. As far as I can see you're all just meandering towards my lynch. You're wasting time and this is exactly what mafia wants. This is not true. HtS was on GB till recently. Koshi, while seemingly taken with my read/case on you was definitly looking into HtS at one point. I even held off my vote because I was considering GB even though my gut read on him has been town. Well ok having my internet out was part of this as well. | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
My working to get to this point is as follows: DAY 1 HTS's top scum read is LS all day. She consistently pushes him and consistently reads him as scum. She does not drop this read through EOD. At 22:44 BST she makes the following post: On April 22 2016 06:44 Half the Sky wrote: 19/40 I'm back, skimmed the thread, and reading filters. I'm seeing the contrarian (non-meta) reasons for townreads on LS to be coming down to a suicidal push on me, the meta reasons for reading him town are out the window unless you've forgotten Cell Mafia so quickly so any emotion he is displaying he's already proven he can fake that as mafia. So I am completely disregarding that. LS would still be my top active lynch. Definitely wouldn't lynch Koshi or Damdred and I need to re-read Tictock, the push on Tumbleweed seemed weird. For the inactives, just skimming filters, sicklucker is by far the top lynch for me in that category. Double checking gumshoe from the beginning atm, but if people aren't lynching LS, then I'd lynch sicklucker for consolidation. Note that she pings SL and says she is reconsidering gumshoe. At 23:02 BST she switches voting to SL. At that stage, she takes sicklucker to FOUR votes, with the next nearest wagon being FF on TWO. However, with town super spread out, it might well have appeared to HTS that SL was done for, and she wanted the town credit. Call it a bus of opportunity. At 23:19 BST she makes the following post, which is as far as I can see basically the only 'read' she makes of FF: On April 22 2016 07:19 Half the Sky wrote: 22/40 Now THIS is a remnant of the Dark Tournament (mafia) Fecalfeast. >_< Finally at 23:23 BST she makes the following post, switching to FF: On April 22 2016 07:23 Half the Sky wrote: 24/40 I switched to FF. My head is spinning right now. From a read flow perspective, it makes no sense for her to jump off her second top scum read (SL). HOWEVER, at this stage Damdred had voted SL at 23:09 BST, taking FF to THREE votes (and SL to three as well), and then gumshoe voted FF (with a detour at SL) at 23:16 BST taking SL to four and FF to three. HTS thus moved OFF a scum wagon that was behind and ON TO a town wagon that was already ahead. It is possible that she was looking to fortify SL's safety, I grant you. I also have a number of suspicions about Dani's play, mostly revolving around her having very few sustained pushes, asking lots of questions and not really doing anything with the information, voting FF basically out of the blue on EOD1 and GB again with not much explaining on EOD2. But I think I probably have a lot of fear / confirmation bias in my read of her. And I'd rather spend my time going through other filters than trying to reason out in my head why scum Dani votes EOD as she did. | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
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Tictock
United States6052 Posts
On April 28 2016 03:35 Fidei86 wrote: Alright. I'm going to switch off reading Dani's filter. I think her actions at EOD1 are sufficient to keep her safe for today, and I have a bunch more filters to get through before EOD. My working to get to this point is as follows: DAY 1 HTS's top scum read is LS all day. She consistently pushes him and consistently reads him as scum. She does not drop this read through EOD. At 22:44 BST she makes the following post: Note that she pings SL and says she is reconsidering gumshoe. At 23:02 BST she switches voting to SL. At that stage, she takes sicklucker to FOUR votes, with the next nearest wagon being FF on TWO. However, with town super spread out, it might well have appeared to HTS that SL was done for, and she wanted the town credit. Call it a bus of opportunity. At 23:19 BST she makes the following post, which is as far as I can see basically the only 'read' she makes of FF: Finally at 23:23 BST she makes the following post, switching to FF: From a read flow perspective, it makes no sense for her to jump off her second top scum read (SL). HOWEVER, at this stage Damdred had voted SL at 23:09 BST, taking FF to THREE votes (and SL to three as well), and then gumshoe voted FF (with a detour at SL) at 23:16 BST taking SL to four and FF to three. HTS thus moved OFF a scum wagon that was behind and ON TO a town wagon that was already ahead. It is possible that she was looking to fortify SL's safety, I grant you. I also have a number of suspicions about Dani's play, mostly revolving around her having very few sustained pushes, asking lots of questions and not really doing anything with the information, voting FF basically out of the blue on EOD1 and GB again with not much explaining on EOD2. But I think I probably have a lot of fear / confirmation bias in my read of her. And I'd rather spend my time going through other filters than trying to reason out in my head why scum Dani votes EOD as she did. I don't understand why any of this leads you to a townread or "keeps her safe". You keep saying the EoD stuff here could be a bus then go "eh I have a fear read" Sounds more like you are giving up kus you can't find a convincing argument... | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On April 28 2016 03:28 Fidei86 wrote: While I continue trying to make sense of HTS's EOD 1 (it's quite complicated, and I can see a bus strategy from her but it's also not entirely clear why she'd switch onto FF) could Tumble and Shape and GB please indicate who they are thinking of voting of. I fought with Damdred over this Night 1. It should be VERY clear if you read my filter, but if you don't want to, I lined up all the relevant quotes to refute his argument in a single post. Separately, you would also have to explain why sicklucker willing to knock me off (when he was significantly less active than I was and I had at least a couple townreads on me) and you'd also have to explain why (if you are putting sicklucker and myself on a team together) why we were double bussing this game. On April 28 2016 03:35 Fidei86 wrote: I also have a number of suspicions about Dani's play, mostly revolving around her having very few sustained pushes, asking lots of questions and not really doing anything with the information, voting FF basically out of the blue on EOD1 and GB again with not much explaining on EOD2. But I think I probably have a lot of fear / confirmation bias in my read of her. And I'd rather spend my time going through other filters than trying to reason out in my head why scum Dani votes EOD as she did. Regarding the lack of follow-through, you'd have to pull up example if you felt so inclined, I know there was one or two questions I deliberately didn't follow up because I read when I returned to the thread, and saw my questions had been answered and didn't need to pursue them. Anyhow, carry on. | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
I really don't like Dani's play this game. But I thought about it for a long time and I simply don't follow through on the scum logic of what Dani did EOD1, and not at the times she did it. Yes, scum Dani might have thought SL was done for and moved on to him. But if that was the case, why would she have not stayed on him once the lynch became FF? She would have known SL would have to die sooner or later (sooner, as it turned out), so the smart play was to stay on SL and take the credit. She didn't. Yes, of course she's capable of good play as mafia. This is not a scheme so wacky that it absolutely clears her. What I'm saying is that I need to find a scum and I don't have time for parsing each f'ing post she made. It's slightly self-inflicted on my part, since I could have played yesterday, but here we fucking are. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On April 28 2016 03:28 Fidei86 wrote: While I continue trying to make sense of HTS's EOD 1 (it's quite complicated, and I can see a bus strategy from her but it's also not entirely clear why she'd switch onto FF) could Tumble and Shape and GB please indicate who they are thinking of voting of. I hate the bolded here but I'm going to deliberately keep my mouth shut as to why. It should be obvious I think at this point (hint: I've used it as an argument against at least one other person). | ||
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Fidei86
United Kingdom2116 Posts
On April 28 2016 03:49 Half the Sky wrote: 24/40 I hate the bolded here but I'm going to deliberately keep my mouth shut as to why. It should be obvious I think at this point (hint: I've used it as an argument against at least one other person). Dani if you have something to say please fucking say it. | ||
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