EPTA normal game just for JAT <3 - Page 79
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:10 Rels wrote: Votes recap colored Day 1 final votecount + Show Spoiler + GlowingBear: (6) Justanothertownie, Obiwanshinobi, Palmar, rsoultin, Superbia, tumblewood Superbia: (3) Tumblewood: (3) gumshoe, Rsoultin: (1) Onegu Day 2 final votecount + Show Spoiler + Superbia: (9) Gumshoe, Onegu, Obiwanshinobi, justanothertownie, sicklucker, rsoultin, justanotherscummer, rels, tumblewood Not voting: (1) Superbia Good thing you colored dat day2 vc. Will certainly be very helpful :p | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:12 Rels wrote: JAT for some reason I thought you voted Superbia D1 ? Tumble not jumping on Superbia but jumping on GB is a indeed a good point considering Superbia was RB. well i mean, if that matched his reads it wouldn't be nearly as significant (though still odd) superbia was one of his scumreads gb was a nullread this is what i think never comes from town being lynched here. a town player would have no reason not to vote the counterwagon, especially when he was scumreading him | ||
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:18 Half the Sky wrote: Milady, you don't belong here. | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:18 justanothertownie wrote: Good thing you colored dat day2 vc. Will certainly be very helpful :p ^^ You also could not click the damn spoiler instead of complaining! | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:16 justanothertownie wrote: Unsurprisingly I don't have as much or as strong townreads as you do. SL irritates me because not long ago he said I was a really easy townread and this game he is doing everything he can to be able to scumread me. Like calling me "one of the best scummer" or something like that which is extremely uncharacteristic for him. There are other reasons for why he isn't someone I would go for in the near future though. Gumshoe is fine for now. Rels is basically null because there are some townie things and some scummy about him. Not my prefered lynch though. OWS is more or less the same. I would be more confident about him being town had he actually pushed the cc thing. He just complained and did nothing about it. Which sadly is something I could see town Obi do though. Onegu can die in a fire. I never lived in the U.S.?! bad tina memory! lol sorry (no we don't need to keep talking about this in thread -slinks off-) okay so we're kinda along the same page then. well idk like i do think it would be worthwhile to go back and make sure ows doesn't have outs and things in-thread and not just go voting rb over possible bad town/possible scum means he's town (not making that mistake again ><) but it does drop him in priority for me idk though the complaining and doing nothing (i assume you mean in the form of actually voting) is a bit suicidal for you to do as scum when thread sentiment is clearly grinding toward a super lynch? like i know that's not the best reason to townread anyone. i know for a fact it's something i'd be fine doing myself depending on the circumstances. just not really sure ows is that...hm what's the word? brash? arrogant? flashy? as a scum player. from what little experience i've had with his scum game he's more of a simpering blender (<3s ows >> that's not meant to be offensive btw i do the simpering stuff too depending on the situation) | ||
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:26 rsoultin wrote: bad tina memory! lol sorry (no we don't need to keep talking about this in thread -slinks off-) okay so we're kinda along the same page then. well idk like i do think it would be worthwhile to go back and make sure ows doesn't have outs and things in-thread and not just go voting rb over possible bad town/possible scum means he's town (not making that mistake again ><) but it does drop him in priority for me idk though the complaining and doing nothing (i assume you mean in the form of actually voting) is a bit suicidal for you to do as scum when thread sentiment is clearly grinding toward a super lynch? like i know that's not the best reason to townread anyone. i know for a fact it's something i'd be fine doing myself depending on the circumstances. just not really sure ows is that...hm what's the word? brash? arrogant? flashy? as a scum player. from what little experience i've had with his scum game he's more of a simpering blender (<3s ows >> that's not meant to be offensive btw i do the simpering stuff too depending on the situation) Erm, yes? That is exactly my point. If he would have been more vocal/stubborn about it I would have a stronger townread on him. That would be flashy/brash etc as mafia. Just complaining about it without doing stuff is more like scum OWS. But yeah he was the first to vote superbia day1 it seems. Good for him. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
^ definition of a town filter from a player who knows how to play for me tbf i know his scum game is good lol >< but i don't think it's quite that good. the fluidity and breadth in particular is pretty hard to accomplish as scum, at least for me | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:31 justanothertownie wrote: Erm, yes? That is exactly my point. If he would have been more vocal/stubborn about it I would have a stronger townread on him. That would be flashy/brash etc as mafia. Just complaining about it without doing stuff is more like scum OWS. But yeah he was the first to vote superbia day1 it seems. Good for him. yeah i see your point ^^ you've also played with him more and i'm honestly skittish about him fooling me again lolol >< i prob should look and see if he gave himself outs like he did before when i missed the obvious. that would be smart. yup | ||
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:31 rsoultin wrote: rels is more his filter just looks like a town filter lol the fluidity of reads changing with new info is there, the willingness to say he's wrong about things instead of dig in his heels, and the probing into a lot of different things in a way that to me at least looks more like trying to figure out thought process and intentions (i.e. alignments) rather than just going on the attack. yet he's still aggressive so it doesn't look too blendy ^ definition of a town filter from a player who knows how to play for me tbf i know his scum game is good lol >< but i don't think it's quite that good. the fluidity and breadth in particular is pretty hard to accomplish as scum, at least for me Ok, if you ever flip scum rels is like 95 % town ^^ | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
if I am actively involved in a game and I make it past the first few nights I am going to start putting stuff together. I think in large webs based around core evidence. The problem is you are all very clever people and you find the one or two holes in what I say and assume that those exceptions are in fact the case and subsequently dismiss them in favour of your own reads. Reads that if I felt like doing so, I could pick apart like cotton. This is simply because most arguments in mafia come with a free set of holes / : the only reason they continue to stand is because people cant be bothered disproving all of them / : I said my interactions make it very unlikely for me to be mafia. That does not equal "I called him mafia so I can't be mafia Heres a post from jat in regards to rels pushing him, at this point jats getting pretty angry. He seems to think that saying my “interactions make it unlikely that were mafia together” is way different from “I cant be mafia with him cause I called him mafia” but rels knows jat and is aware that hes not a hyperbolic player ala ritoky (who would be screaming confirmed for days in jats position after the super flip) which means rels may very well consider an understated claim from him to be equivalent. Is rels right or wrong to do this? Thats besides the point, to qoute jat himself I don't care. I don't think you can townread GB yet. But I think it is entirely possible that gumshoe believes he can. Is it really that hard to see rels believing this as town? Jat seems to think that rels could not possibly do this as green and I think thats his biggest fuck up yet If you are town you are being a fucking idiot because things like this are mafia basics and yet you obviously fail to grasp anything this game. The more you do this the more I think you are just trying to rile me up and to undermine my standing in this town. Jat feels rels is bieng an idiot, he knows rels is intelligent, therefore rels is scum. There are so very many problems with this logic, but lets start simple, jat is a very smart and eloquent person, to him, alot of what we say probably comes off as idiotic because of just that. He has rarely agreed with anyone this game about anything as he is rather confident / : as he should be, he is quite good. Yet that gives him a poor perspective on whats too dumb a move for someone to make. Also there's the fact that this is a terrible move regardless, which means no matter what alignment he is rels is being stupid, therefore stupidity has no bearing on rels alignment as jat seems to think. There is no reason to attack jat here as all rels has to do if hes scum is look townie. Antagonising townie numero uno may do that indirectly, but it also aggros him thereby making the whole move derp. Only real reason to do it is if rels actually think jats scum based off feel and is using shit reasoning to justify that feel read / : thereby pissing off jat and robbing him of his objectivity. Which sorta makes rels town. The point I am trying to make here is that I think Jat is a fantastic player, but here he is being a fucking idiot. I can find shit like this on everyone here and i’m sure they could come up with a million reasons why I’m wrong about them being wrong and we can go back and forth like that forever. Look, I don't want us to stop finding flaws in one another's arguments, thats mafia, what I want is for us to stop rewarding ourselves for finding those flaws with the instant dismissal of the cases to which those flaws belong. All so that we can get back to proving why were right and everyone else is wrong. So when I post what may be my last big wall of text ,which is going to be as logical and streamlined and clear as I can possibly make it ,and you find all the potential outs for each and every point, dont just walk away satisfied, ask yourself how effective those outs actually are, how likely is it that they are the rule and not the exception? Das all I ask yo / : | ||
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:36 gumshoe wrote: So I have alot of stuff saved up for eon, but if it’s just going to just get ignored theres no real point to the effort is there / : so I’m writing this preamble to hopefully soften the crowd : D if I am actively involved in a game and I make it past the first few nights I am going to start putting stuff together. I think in large webs based around core evidence. The problem is you are all very clever people and you find the one or two holes in what I say and assume that those exceptions are in fact the case and subsequently dismiss them in favour of your own reads. Reads that if I felt like doing so, I could pick apart like cotton. This is simply because most arguments in mafia come with a free set of holes / : the only reason they continue to stand is because people cant be bothered disproving all of them / : Heres a post from jat in regards to rels pushing him, at this point jats getting pretty angry. He seems to think that saying my “interactions make it unlikely that were mafia together” is way different from “I cant be mafia with him cause I called him mafia” but rels knows jat and is aware that hes not a hyperbolic player ala ritoky (who would be screaming confirmed for days in jats position after the super flip) which means rels may very well consider an understated claim from him to be equivalent. Is rels right or wrong to do this? Thats besides the point, to qoute jat himself Is it really that hard to see rels believing this as town? Jat seems to think that rels could not possibly do this as green and I think thats his biggest fuck up yet Jat feels rels is bieng an idiot, he knows rels is intelligent, therefore rels is scum. There are so very many problems with this logic, but lets start simple, jat is a very smart and eloquent person, to him, alot of what we say probably comes off as idiotic because of just that. He has rarely agreed with anyone this game about anything as he is rather confident / : as he should be, he is quite good. Yet that gives him a poor perspective on whats too dumb a move for someone to make. Also there's the fact that this is a terrible move regardless, which means no matter what alignment he is rels is being stupid, therefore stupidity has no bearing on rels alignment as jat seems to think. There is no reason to attack jat here as all rels has to do if hes scum is look townie. Antagonising townie numero uno may do that indirectly, but it also aggros him thereby making the whole move derp. Only real reason to do it is if rels actually think jats scum based off feel and is using shit reasoning to justify that feel read / : thereby pissing off jat and robbing him of his objectivity. Which sorta makes rels town. The point I am trying to make here is that I think Jat is a fantastic player, but here he is being a fucking idiot. I can find shit like this on everyone here and i’m sure they could come up with a million reasons why I’m wrong about them being wrong and we can go back and forth like that forever. Look, I don't want us to stop finding flaws in one another's arguments, thats mafia, what I want is for us to stop rewarding ourselves for finding those flaws with the instant dismissal of the cases to which those flaws belong. All so that we can get back to proving why were right and everyone else is wrong. So when I post what may be my last big wall of text ,which is going to be as logical and streamlined and clear as I can possibly make it ,and you find all the potential outs for each and every point, dont just walk away satisfied, ask yourself how effective those outs actually are, how likely is it that they are the rule and not the exception? Das all I ask yo / : Can you tell me what's the point of this post? Because I don't see it. You want me to townread rels or what? | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:34 justanothertownie wrote: Ok, if you ever flip scum rels is like 95 % town ^^ lol if you honestly think it's possible for me to flip scum this game, i've really hit the next tier of scum!goddess or you just don't pay enough attention to my play from game to game (which would actually be fair cause yeah pretty sure the brain cancer thing is a widespread opinion) bueno, where was i going with this? oh! yeah d1 vote is dropping back to nai. he was clearly open to shennanies before they happened so it doesn't mean much. i think i'll follow you and null read ows lol >< though it's not substantially any different since i'd probably lynch him before shape anyway | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:43 Rels wrote: lol rsoul I forgot you were writting everything in spanish early on. Apparently it was too hard to keep up ^^ >> lol god it takes me like 4x as long to do it that way >> i prob should have given how much i spammed this game but...okay you want the honest truth? part of why i dropped it (apart from frustration at palmar lol ><) was it was so damn slow that me capping my spamming wasn't really helpful lol >< part was laziness \o/ | ||
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justanothertownie
16321 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:46 rsoultin wrote: >> lol god it takes me like 4x as long to do it that way >> i prob should have given how much i spammed this game but...okay you want the honest truth? part of why i dropped it (apart from frustration at palmar lol ><) was it was so damn slow that me capping my spamming wasn't really helpful lol >< part was laziness \o/ Lucky you. I might have policy lynched you for it. | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
You're lucky Palmar is dead then p: | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:41 justanothertownie wrote: Can you tell me what's the point of this post? Because I don't see it. You want me to townread rels or what? I feel like your very good at finding flaws in theories but bad at evaluating their likely hood. What I am going to be saying at e.o.n has alternative explanations, but those explanations are highly unlikely, what I am worried about is this- I post a huge wall of change and people ethier ignore it or find a possible alternative explanations to it's key points that are huge stretches but serve as more than enough for them to just move on / : The point of this post is to ask people to read my eon posts objectively. Fully prepared to discard many of thier reads if they cant honestly consider the alternatives, to the facts I will base my case around, to be likely. To this end I am using you as a sacrificial goat to demonstrate that even the best players can be wrong : P which is exactly how I am viewing this town atm. but no I am not asking you to town read rels, I am simply showing that your reasoning for scum reading him earlier was bad and fueled by emotion/outrage. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On April 21 2016 00:47 justanothertownie wrote: Lucky you. I might have policy lynched you for it. -shrugs- doubt it lol no one would have followed that policy lynch unless they had reasons of their own ^^ @gum you know, you could have just tldr'd it to say: i'm frustrated that y'all are dismissing my reads please don't confuse not agreeing with your reasons as dismissing your reads. i will admit that when i see a case built mostly around narrative (and yes, yours fall in that category) i'm predisposed to kinda just skim them. but that doesn't mean that i don't go gum thinks obi and sl are scum. i don't agree with his reasons, but i'm pretty sure gum is town so maybe he's seeing something i'm not? and then go back and look at obi and sl again and come to my own conclusion i'm sorry if that's not as satisfying as going WOW great case SHEEPLE NOW! but i mean, if i don't find your arguments compelling i simply don't :/ people often don't find mine compelling so at least we're in good company lol | ||
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