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On November 12 2015 20:25 sicklucker wrote:
well you need to choose one world artanis and not nit pick people from both worlds. either you want to nominate both me and vivax or neither of us.. this might have been a slip
The point was choosing a team which includes one player from one of the potential teams that doesn't include any of the other, but also doesn't include any scumreads of that other team to see how they would vote.
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I also literally posted it as soon as I thought of it. If there's more nitpicking you'd like to do, that'd be why.
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On November 12 2015 20:26 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2015 21:48 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Btw, if this mission fails there's at most 1 scum between me/hts/shockeyy unless you think rayn id scum.
I look forward to the read evaluations. also what happened to this line of thinking artanis? why did you drop your hts and shockey read. opps?
On November 12 2015 06:44 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
So anyway, the fact that rels is already trying to throw shit on me before the mission failed makes me pretty sure he's scum. Looking at potential partners, I actually don't think shockeyy's scum. Two reasons:
A) he really hasn't been playing to any kind of wincon and in the end I have to admit it probably means he's town.
B) I don't think mafia rels would be the first to risk townreading shockeyy whom looked really bad.
As for HtS, I actually think she might be town. The way she keeps on trucking and focuses on solving the game even in the face of being nearly universally townread makes me eerie.
Which means there must be a scum in kita/vivax too since scum xata would never nominate scum sl with him and rayn is never scum this game. Gonna have to focus on that later.
zzz
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I don't even know what you're accusing me of at this point. Can you try and be legible?
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On November 12 2015 20:33 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2015 20:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I don't even know what you're accusing me of at this point. Can you try and be legible? I misread your shit? im obv town for it go read it was an honest mistake
I did read it but I don't understand what you were saying. I also don't really like how you're trying to instantly weasel a townread out of it, though that's probably NAI.
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On November 12 2015 20:36 sicklucker wrote:
art heres the next 5 nominations fyi
5. ShoCkeyy
6. Rels
7. sicklucker
8. kitaman27
9. Vivax
obv we no one will vote for rels/kitas teams.
So unless shockey chooses shockey/art/hts/coah one of me and vivax are doing the nominations. SO if you really think were scum you better get on that ;p
Eh, if I decide that you're scum with vivax then Kita's team could work. Like I said though, I don't currently think it's that team and I'll still have time to decide on it.
I will look into both teams later. I should probably actually go work at work now.
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On November 12 2015 21:13 sicklucker wrote:
Also you saying that the vote was "obviuosly going to be a majority" rubs me the wrong way. when I checked out of the thread I acualy thought it was never passing. (and this is a huge reason why im mad at you) I also felt like it was a team you would have issues with. Did you really town read all of these guys enough to vote yes? really?
How does this match up with
On November 12 2015 19:46 sicklucker wrote:
Im pretty sure of the others and your crafty and kind of low key this game. Infact I was super suspicious of you untill you no voted thats probably the only reason im including you and you could be smart enough to vote for cred there since it was a landslide vote
?
Either it appeared to be a landslide and my no vote doesn't mean anything in which case your initial reason to townread me again wasn't actually anything you believed in, or it didn't actually appear to become a landslide and it does have meaning. You can't have it both ways.
Also, Rels attempting to bury me is fairly expected. I'm amazed at how quickly you changed your mind again believing someone you scumread pretty strongly. What happened?
On November 12 2015 22:20 sicklucker wrote:
Just dont follow hts suggestions and add art. hes not in your town read list and im pretty sure hes fucking scum based on day 1 vote logic and reads
So I'm scum for my Day 1 vote despite the fact that HtS did the exact same?
I also had an actually good reason for it in that if it passed I could just send the same mission + myself and win the game if you're all town. HtS didn't quite have that reason, yet for some reason it makes me scum yet doesn't make her scum.
Yeah, don't think I want SL on any mission right now.
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On November 12 2015 21:24 sicklucker wrote:
acualy there probably both (me and HtS) fucking scum what is happening. no scum should ever vote no here. like im so confused rels hold me
On November 12 2015 22:29 sicklucker wrote:
to kita - from my pov I know im town so if you eliminate my combinations from your final analyst that leaves you with
Combinations Remaining:
ShoCkeyy Xatalos Vivax
Half the Sky Xatalos Vivax
Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Vivax - this is the scum team if I have been wrong about you
I think shockeyy/hts are fairly easy town reads
Uhhh..
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On November 13 2015 00:16 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2015 19:29 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also also I really don't want Kita on any teams after the 'narrowing down' thing he did included both confirming himself as town with no reasoning as well as confirming rels as town for things he can easily do as scum. Wait, so you expect me to consider the scenarios where I could be mafia? How does that help me figure things out in the slightest? Are you considering the scum team to be Artanis/X/Y? Of course not. And of all the things that I have said this game, THAT is the reason you don't want me on any teams? You explain that Vivax is more likely town than me because of the relationship with Xata, yet never once bring up the topic of myself and Xata. In what way does that make sense?
I thought you were trying to narrow it down for the entire thread rather than just yourself. If you don't provide any argumentation for why you're town, that doesn't really help.
As for my read on you: I do feel you've fallen off a bit in recent times. I liked you in the start but a combination of renewed insight on HtS/Shockeyy which were two scumreads that I now townread as well as your more recent posts have led me to change my opinion on you.
As for your relationship to Xata: It's very plausible since you've pushed both Xata and SL at different points in the game, and you never had the awkward start that the Xata/Superbia slot had with one another. I just don't think there's any benefit to two scum interacting with each other in that way.
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Shockeyy, if you can sub SL out for Coag I'll vote yes.
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On November 13 2015 06:56 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 06:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I thought you were trying to narrow it down for the entire thread rather than just yourself. If you don't provide any argumentation for why you're town, that doesn't really help. It's not up to me to make an argument for why I'm town. That's for other people to decide. I can respond to points that people raise, but I'm not going to make a "why I'm town" post out of the blue.
Palmar would disapprove. Fair enough though.
Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 06:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
As for my read on you: I do feel you've fallen off a bit in recent times. I liked you in the start but a combination of renewed insight on HtS/Shockeyy which were two scumreads that I now townread as well as your more recent posts have led me to change my opinion on you. Specifics please.
On November 12 2015 06:44 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
So anyway, the fact that rels is already trying to throw shit on me before the mission failed makes me pretty sure he's scum. Looking at potential partners, I actually don't think shockeyy's scum. Two reasons:
A) he really hasn't been playing to any kind of wincon and in the end I have to admit it probably means he's town.
B) I don't think mafia rels would be the first to risk townreading shockeyy whom looked really bad.
As for HtS, I actually think she might be town. The way she keeps on trucking and focuses on solving the game even in the face of being nearly universally townread makes me eerie.
Which means there must be a scum in kita/vivax too since scum xata would never nominate scum sl with him and rayn is never scum this game. Gonna have to focus on that later.
It's mostly related to this honestly. Realizing that the mission was likely going to fail meant that at least one of HtS and Shockeyy was town. I decided to re-eval them both and honestly the way both of them approached the game made me feel like they were likely town. HtS in that she doesn't really seem to be working towards any kind of towncred; she wasn't fighting the reads on her and she knew that she likely wasn't going to be listened to much, yet she kept trucking. Shockeyy because he really wasn't playing to any kind of wincon that makes sense for scum. It doesn't really make sense for town either, but there was a certain directionessless to his posts that I came around to.
Both of them being town meant that either you or Vivax has to be scum since I don't believe there's two scum in the first three and I don't think Rayn was scum. As for you falling off: I felt the combos thing didn't really serve much purpose and it seems you've mostly been asking questions and gathering information without really.. using it? The combinations thing led you to 'confirm' scumread Vivax, but it only really works for you and doesn't prove why Vivax is scum, nor did you really go into why when you returned to the thread and him having a strong chance of being on a team should make that a priority for you.
Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 06:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
As for your relationship to Xata: It's very plausible since you've pushed both Xata and SL at different points in the game, and you never had the awkward start that the Xata/Superbia slot had with one another. I just don't think there's any benefit to two scum interacting with each other in that way. Could you explain what you mean when you say you "don't think there's any benefit to two scum interacting with each other in that way". Sure, they had their back and forth, but they ended it on good terms afterwards. Xata was suggesting super for the day one team. Super never concluded scum on xata. I can bring up the quotes that suggest this if need be. Yet on day one, I'm putting together a case about why HTS should not include Xata in her group and Xata straight up laughs several times my name is brought up, having me as his primary scum read the entire game. We're actually scum reading each other, while xata/super are fine with each other for the most part. Why is there "no benefit" between the super/xata interaction, yet it is completely reasonable for the kita/xata interaction to be spy beneficial?
I don't think scum attacks another scum for something this superficial. It just doesn't have a benefit for either of them except if someone happens to interpret it this way. It just makes people wonder why the hell someone attacked someone else for something that little, with no credit going to either of them. Your attacks on Xatalos on the other hand actually got you towncred. It doesn't matter if Superbia/Xata ended up townreading eachother; you only need one scum to go on a mission to fail it. Distancing and buddying both have their merits. It's the way he approached attacking Xata and what he did it for that made me think he's likely town if Xata is scum.
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On November 13 2015 06:57 Half the Sky wrote:
I read that entire sicklucker exchange and there was one post that made me think there is a legit reason (albeit a wrong one and I kept making the less likely argument as parcel as to why we are in the position that we are in right now) for his changing reads on you/confusion on Rels but if enough people are finding his play confusing he needs to explain it himself when he wakes up.
It's not going to do town any good if I'm the only one in the game understanding his approach to the game.
Lex do you have any additional experience with scum Kita btw that I should be on the lookout for? Going to extensively meta him tonight. Some of the things in 2765 have me a bit wary at the moment (particularly WoS' caution about his squeaky clean scumgame) but I am going to try and compare to his games in JOAT/Aperture to be sure.
Where's your head at right now Daniele? Are you still on Xata/Rels/Vivax, or?
I don't really have much knowledge of Kita's scumgame. The only time I actually recall him playing was in the Shadow game I hosted, though I think I also played a game with him when I smurfed but I don't recall entirely so I'm afraid I don't have much. I don't think I ever played with him as scum yet in any case.
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On November 13 2015 07:15 Vivax wrote:
There's one thing I wanna know though: Why is Artanis not trusting me? I thought his early townread wasn't bad if genuine (he worded it kinda sloppy tho).
I am kind of trusting you, but it requires Xata to be scum and with how scummy SL just looked I'm actually not sure on that one anymore.
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Anyway, gone for the rest of the night.
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On November 13 2015 08:31 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 06:34 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 12 2015 21:13 sicklucker wrote:
Also you saying that the vote was "obviuosly going to be a majority" rubs me the wrong way. when I checked out of the thread I acualy thought it was never passing. (and this is a huge reason why im mad at you) I also felt like it was a team you would have issues with. Did you really town read all of these guys enough to vote yes? really? How does this match up with On November 12 2015 19:46 sicklucker wrote:
Im pretty sure of the others and your crafty and kind of low key this game. Infact I was super suspicious of you untill you no voted thats probably the only reason im including you and you could be smart enough to vote for cred there since it was a landslide vote ? Either it appeared to be a landslide and my no vote doesn't mean anything in which case your initial reason to townread me again wasn't actually anything you believed in, or it didn't actually appear to become a landslide and it does have meaning. You can't have it both ways. Also, Rels attempting to bury me is fairly expected. I'm amazed at how quickly you changed your mind again believing someone you scumread pretty strongly. What happened? On November 12 2015 22:20 sicklucker wrote:
Just dont follow hts suggestions and add art. hes not in your town read list and im pretty sure hes fucking scum based on day 1 vote logic and reads So I'm scum for my Day 1 vote despite the fact that HtS did the exact same? I also had an actually good reason for it in that if it passed I could just send the same mission + myself and win the game if you're all town. HtS didn't quite have that reason, yet for some reason it makes me scum yet doesn't make her scum. Yeah, don't think I want SL on any mission right now. stfu dude those were not related your so desperate. point one you made is what i expected. Point two was what really happened and me dealing with it
Of course they're related. It's about what you expect. If consensus was that it's likely to be close, then that's what I probably expected to and then my vote is very meaningful. What actually happened is irrelevant, what matters is the perception at the time.
On November 13 2015 08:34 sicklucker wrote:
"Im pretty sure of the others and your crafty and kind of low key this game. Infact I was super suspicious of you untill you no voted thats probably the only reason im including you and you could be smart enough to vote for cred there since it was a landslide vote"
I said many time in thread art I left the thread after the noms were released voted no thinking their is no way this will pass. Then I came back saw 7 votes and you were not one of them.
Like your trying to twist my words (poorly) to make me look scummy to suit your agenda I hope everyone notices what I do
No, you're saying two different things. I presume you've actually read the entire thread when you made those posts. If you didn't, that's actually a scumtell for you too as I recall you saying you don't actually read the thread as mafia.
On November 13 2015 08:47 sicklucker wrote:
Anyway since hts thinks I somewhat have to justify myself being an obviuos town its my filter. If you ever want to tell the different between me town game and my mafia game just look at my filter. I have never had this big of a filter as mafia in like my 12 mafia games on tl...
Im sure some nerd can dig up this stat submitting my vote now hopefully next time I enter the thread its not the post game thread where I will berate you all ;p
I never had more than a.. 10 page? filter as mafia either.
Then Imperial happened. People can break their meta. And then there's what Kita said about your length.
On November 13 2015 09:08 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 08:02 NocturneMage wrote:
Shockey's Nomination Phase - End
ShoCkeyy has nominated the following team for Mission 3:
(1) Shockey
(2) Vivax
(3) Half the Sky
(4) sicklucker
Please PM your votes to Fidei86 and Tictock.
You may switch your vote as often as you like, until the deadline.
Deadline is in at 23:00 GMT (+00:00), 13 November. What was the team you wanted to make shockeyy...? At least I very much doubt there isn't scum in this team, with it including both SL/HTS.... The scumteam is probably SL/HTS/Rels at this point. SL even just for the first failed mission, HTS for just making really crappy reasons to scumread people (as noted by basically everyone who read her posts so far) and Rels for voting YES last team when he still scumread people on it.... I think shockeyy and kita just have to be town by PoE. So I think that's about it... Unfortunately Rels is next, but perhaps kita could be able to put up a decent team.
I really don't think HtS is mafia Xata. You continuing to tunnel her is really bad. There's also a lot of people you're townreading that townread her. Why aren't you re-evaluating her?
On November 13 2015 09:17 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 07:52 Vivax wrote:
you lack one thing so far even after team 2 failed and it's you pushing your favourite team like a lot of people are doing.
You are good at talking about things and around things but I don't really see you pushing anything concrete as your own preference when you should actually know that you can be more influent than what you are pulling off with all these summaries, setup talk, iterations and occasional questions about people you mildly townread (Rels). That's not true though. I posted that shockeyy should not include you in his nomination. I questioned shockeyy's logic for Artanis's inclusion because his voting record isn't any better than me or Rels and that was the reasoning he was providing. I posted a read on Rels with several examples of things that I felt looked townie. I shot down the faulty logic being used on HTS from Rels. I suggested Rels or myself as alternatives to you for nominations. There are plenty instances that show that I have a preference for the nominations. Kita/Rels/HTS/Rayn is my preferred team. I'm not going to convince shockeyy to exclude himself, which is why I went with myself/Rels in place of Vivax. It would obviously be a challenge to get this to passed, but "compromising" isn't really the priority right now. We have five days to pass a team so my focus is getting the team I think has the best chance of passing. I'm still not sure about the scum trio, but right now I'd say something like Vivax + Artanis + (SL/Xat) If I were to consider a compromise, it might be the inclusion of shockeyy, but I'm not sure enough that he is town in place of artanis. We have 4 more days so it's not like I have to accept the first team nominated yet.
Wait, I answered all your questions, you apparently didn't have any more yet now I'm basically confirmed scum to you? Explain yourself.
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There really are too many scum players this game.
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On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them.Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote. Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense. BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort.
Have you already forgotten that one of HtS and I HAS to be town unless Rayn is scum? Your memory must be really crappy.
Also, stop pushing the whole scum has to have voted yes on the first mission. You said yourself bussing makes sense for scum in this setup. It's very possible that they positioned themselves to not be able to vote yes for the first mission. My reasons for voting yes make perfect sense.
Why is a you + Vivax or Kita team so unlikely, and how the hell did you get such a strong townread on HtS after being incredibly tunneled on her not too long ago?
I've also done more than my fair share of work and I've explained everything I've done. You on the other hand make no sense.
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On November 13 2015 19:38 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:34 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them.Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote. Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense. BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort. Have you already forgotten that one of HtS and I HAS to be town unless Rayn is scum? Your memory must be really crappy. Also, stop pushing the whole scum has to have voted yes on the first mission. You said yourself bussing makes sense for scum in this setup. It's very possible that they positioned themselves to not be able to vote yes for the first mission. My reasons for voting yes make perfect sense. Why is a you + Vivax or Kita team so unlikely, and how the hell did you get such a strong townread on HtS after being incredibly tunneled on her not too long ago? I've also done more than my fair share of work and I've explained everything I've done. You on the other hand make no sense. "Have you already forgotten that one of HtS and I HAS to be town unless Rayn is scum? Your memory must be really crappy." <=> "how the hell did you get such a strong townread on HtS after being incredibly tunneled on her not too long ago?" You answer yourself. One of you is scum, and both of you, although possible, is super unlikely. HTS is townier than you => you are scum. What is your read on HTS ?
One of us doesn't have to be scum at all and you keep saying that but it makes no sense. There's AT MOST one scum between me/HtS/Shockeyy and I think there's none.
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Also going "Hey I have two scumreads, one is slightly stronger than the other."
"Oh it turns out one of them has to be town, let's presume the one that's stronger is scum and not do any work on actually doing more research on it."
Doesn't particularly strike me as a townie mindset.
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On November 12 2015 02:40 Rels wrote:
I suppose Arta / rayn / Xata makes some sense too. The relations between the three are super weird:
- Xata and Arta hard townreads each other
- Arta and rayn are super buddies that don't re evaluate on each other
- Arta and Xata have very little interaction.
So the plan would be to put two scums in the first team, so one of them exits with the universal townread, can make the second team fail; and now the plan is to put the third scum in the third team.
On November 12 2015 20:36 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2015 03:15 Fidei86 wrote:After discussion between myself and Tictock in the Host QT, and also consultation with Blazinghand, I have decided to issue a second warning to raynpelikoneet for this post. The effect of a second warning (the first warning being here) is a modkill/auto-replace, which is effective immediately.
I will begin searching for a replacement immediately. Until one is found, raynpelikoneet's slot will be eligible to go on missions, and will deemed to vote YES on all proposed missions. If his slot has the spy alignment, it will be deemed to attempt to sabotage any mission on which it is placed. His slot will be skipped for the purpose of team submission.
The OP for this game makes clear that all players are obliged to be civil and corteous to each other. The hosts recognise that Mafia/Resistance can give rise to strong emotions. However, there is a large and important difference between criticising someone's play or their decision making, and personal attacks designed only to belittle or demean. The former happens all the time, but the second will not be tolerated.
If anyone has any concerns about this action, or any further rules questions arising please contact me immediately, copying Tictock and Blazinghand. Wow rayn is probably mod-confirmed town then. I don't think scum would cross the line after being warned.
This chain of events actually makes no sense either. Rayn posted everything he posted already at this point. The fact that he got modkilled doesn't mean anything about his alignment; the risk he took was already there as he was making the posts yet Rels doesn't use it to confirm Rayn until he actually gets modkilled.
Unless you're saying that the actual modkill itself is alignment indicative it makes no sense to flip your read on Rayn to 99% sure town just for that because he couldn't know what he was doing would get him modkilled.
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EPT
