EPTOn June 12 2015 08:45 batsnacks wrote:
5. Don't lie.
5. Don't lie.
Not sure how this is relevant?
Newbie Student Mafia XI - Page 2
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
Not sure how this is relevant? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 08:46 n00bKing wrote: You're right, putting pressure on people can be a good thing, to see how they react. That's why you're wrong, it is not too early to vote. I agree. As said, it's my first time playing mafia and I haven't been in many situations lately where i have to formulate sharp logical arguments. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
I hope to see lots of activity when I read the thread tomorrow! | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 11:41 Kickstart wrote: You could be right, and as I said I usually do give players I don't know and new players the benefit of the doubt, but as I said the fact that he has done several things that I think are scummy and none that I deem towny is why I presented this and asked for peoples thought. Also, the goal of town is not to protect themselves from a mafia nightkill. This doesn't matter in the slightest unless you are a blue role or something, and even then, the #1 goal of town should always be to show that they are town through their actions, and coming in a close second is helping to find scum. Sitting back and not being a target is literally the last thing you want to do as town because it makes it hard to read you, which is shit for town but good for scum because they already know your alignment while town doesn't. You're trying to make a case against me, but then you make this point and your argument falls apart. " Sitting back and not being a target is literally the last thing you want to do as town because it makes it hard to read you, which is shit for town but good for scum because they already know your alignment while town doesn't." I would argue that I did just the opposite of this. I exposed myself in a way that made me very vulnerable and painted a target on my back. It created a lot of discussion with me at the center of it. I don't think a mafia would draw attention to themselves like that, especially a newbie. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 11:33 MoosyDoosy wrote: ^ Also Kickstart, I wouldn't read too much into ruXx's initial post where he's rambling about slapping/daydreaming about Mafia. It might have been from an attempt to identify himself as a non-aggressor to the Mafia so that when night time comes around, they don't kill him. If the game went on for longer, people would also suspect ruXx more giving the Mafia an easy kill. This actually happens a ton in real life Mafia but it's clear it's totally different online at this point. Also, going back to his post where he "misses the interaction" which is right after his rambling, it's pretty clear that ruXx is not paying attention whatsoever. As a newbie he was probably just as excited as I was about remaining passive which is why he didn't notice the err in his post. Just the fact that it seems he has no idea whatsoever about what he's saying during his rambling just shows this too. I'll look through the rest of your points, but I'll try and provide a "newbie perspective." Either way, it looks like he wised up real fast and stopped being as frantic and energetic in his posts. On June 12 2015 11:38 MoosyDoosy wrote: Yeah, the more I read of ruXx's initial posts, the more it seems he's thinking in terms of a real life Mafia game as well as tryharding a bit. Him intercepting a question was him tryharding a basic read and him supporting lying is from a real life Mafia mindset since lying is much more common in real life. The last two posts that you point out are kind of shady but even then they err on the side of newbie to online Mafia. Overall I wouldn't vote him just yet until we get more evidence. Wow moosy. I have to give you 5 stars for this read. It's like you're inside my head or something. I had goosebumps reading this since it was so spot on. You are absolutely right that my only exposure to mafia has been through watching the TI qualifiers hub, and later watching all stars mafia on youtube. I really wanted to emulate the dynamic of a live environment, and went in trying to actively counter some of the things i picked up that a mafia would do. From watching those live mafia games I learned that the number 1 trait of a mafia is to be silent. They would bide their time and look for arguments to bandwagon onto, often avoid getting into heated arguments if possible, and when attacked they would try to deflect onto another person. I admit I am very excited to go out playing my first mafia game, and overracted by claiming my role before day 1 post(I did not know that this was frowned upon). Another thing that I learned is that it doesn't matter if you are mafia or not, as long as you contribute to try solving the case, then it's good to keep people around just in case they are town, because then in the largest portion of games they would be a boon to you as a town. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 22:39 n00bKing wrote: I understand what you're saying. And trust me, if there were more people sounding suspicious to me, I would be talking about that. But so far, batsnacks is the only player that has more than one post that rubs me the wrong way. People like Moosy and FakePlants have only made one post apiece that struck me odd. So I've been talking some about batsnacks, since that's who I'm voting against. But in the absence of other good targets, I thought it would be better to give some advice and defend some people, than to do nothing. If no one here has played the game with me before, you don't want me lurking. It's better to have me on the record with some opinions than not. I defended non-newbies too.  I was just concerned that in a Newbie game, a bandwagon on a bad lynch target could get rolling pretty easily, if no one points out flaws in the reasoning being used against that player. But okay, I will let people do more of their own work. Thanks for the "advice."  I want to say that after reading through n00bKing's posts I get a slight town read on him. He might be playing a very strong mafia, but either way I think keeping him around makes sense. It seems to me that he's somewhat experienced in mafia, despite this being his first game here on TL. I like the way he thinks and further pushes on opinions of other people that makes himself vulnerable. He was not afraid to put himself in the crossfire of what could've easily been a bandwagon situation on me. Either he's trying to get me in his pocket, but more likely I feel like he just enjoys taking logical arguments and breaking them apart, exposing their flaws. On June 12 2015 09:36 batsnacks wrote: Through repetition of danger we grow accustomed to it. Water sets the example for the right conduct under such circumstances. It flows on and on, and merely fills up all the places through which it flows; it does not shrink from any dangerous spot nor from any plunge, and nothing can make it lose its own essential nature. It remains true to itself under all conditions. Thus likewise, if one is sincere when confronted with difficulties, the heart can penetrate the meaning of the situation. And once we have gained inner mastery of a problem, it will come about naturally that the action we take will succeed. In danger all that counts is really carrying out all that has to be done. Properly used, danger can have an important meaning as a protective measure. Thus heaven has its perilous height protecting it against every attempt at invasion, and earth has its mountains and bodies of water, separating countries by their dangers. Thus also rulers make use of danger to protect themselves against attacks from without and against turmoil within. On June 12 2015 08:42 batsnacks wrote: I'm going to make a quick and easy how to play town guide:
On June 12 2015 22:32 batsnacks wrote: >.> Anyway... I don't feel like talking about this anymore. I changed my mind noobking you can find 2 scum reads. Keep your vote on me and find another another mafia. On June 12 2015 22:54 batsnacks wrote: I think I'm going to sheep geript now he was making sense about moose. ##unvote ##vote moosygoosy On June 12 2015 21:25 batsnacks wrote: I'm bored Assumin that batsnacks i actually trying to win, this seems to me like an extremely poor way of helping town. Through these posts he display : Nonsense fillers content that doesn't contribute. Showing disinterest. Throwing out information as facts when they they are just an opinion. Whether he's town trying to pretend he's mafira or actually is mafia, I don't like his attitude towards the game. Of all the posts I've read so far batsnacks is the most scummy to me. ##vote batsnacks | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 14:39 WaveofShadow wrote: Back from streaming Town tier: Oats, Kickstart, Moosy Blergh tier: Almost everybody Scum tier: Geript, noobking 2 ez Why do you read noobking as scum? You didn't comment on any of his posts and out of the blue he's scum? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 00:22 Rels wrote: Alright ruxxar I was unsure how to read you. But with this post I now believe you're a super excited townie. I too believe that we should not let mafia the ability to stay silent. So. What do you think of plants first and only post ? I can't really get a read on him from that one post. He should participate more if his goal is to help town! | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 01:01 WaveofShadow wrote: And yes for the record noob has been upgraded from scum tier to 'meh' tier because I'm not sure I believe he as scum would be so ballsy to continue posting the way he has, though my fear of being wrong on newbies prevents me from bringing him higher just yet. That's not what I asked. I asked why you read him as scum in the first place. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 01:05 batsnacks wrote: You didn't do anything. It's what your scum mates did, or rather didn't do (push you). Who do you think are scum with moosy and why? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 12 2015 10:47 geript wrote: Batsnacks weird post stuck out to me too. IDK what he's doing, pulling a chezinu? IDK. I couldn't figure out wtf he was trying to say. I'll look at it again later when I get a full read in, but his post was at least interesting even if it is probably NAI I saw this mentioned earlier. Can someone explain what a chezinu is? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 16:47 n00bKing wrote: Okay, one last post, then bed, and I'll see everyone in the morning. What's the prevailing philosophy around here on whether (or when) Carl should roleclaim? Seems to me that if he remains hidden, there is all kinds of potential for disaster, and maybe even moreso in a Newbie game. So does someone with that type of role usually roleclaim? If not, why not? And if so, is it usually done Day 1, or not until after Night 1 begins? I can see some distinct advantages of him claiming during Day 1, instead of waiting for Night. If the claim goes uncountered (and comes from anyone that doesn't have a bunch of votes stacked up on them) then we have a largely confirmed Townie. Anyone who had previously voted against that player gets a small strike against them, for barking up the wrong tree. And Carl's vote in the batsnacks/Sulfurus debate takes on extra weight, because although Carl could still be incorrect, at least we could expect that he's not incorrect on purpose. I feel like this topic should have probably been raised a while ago, but I kept waiting and waiting, to see who would bring it up, so that I could award them some Town Cred just for mentioning it. (Guess I have to give the Town Cred to myself now? w00t?) Anyway, interested in hearing other opinions on this. I disagree. There are 3 Mafia and 2 town roles. I believe that reducing kill power from 2 to 1 is the single most important factor in us winning the game. This would buy us so much time that we should have overwhelming odds of winning. The chance of targeting Carl is very low. I'm ok with taking the odds of a power role checking Carl if it means we increase our chances of killing mafia. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 18:17 ruXxar wrote: I disagree. There are 3 Mafia and 2 town roles. I believe that reducing kill power from 2 to 1 is the single most important factor in us winning the game. This would buy us so much time that we should have overwhelming odds of winning. The chance of targeting Carl is very low. I'm ok with taking the odds of a power role checking Carl if it means we increase our chances of killing mafia. After reducing kill power to 1 I would agree that Carl revealing himself is a good play. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 18:24 Oatsmaster wrote: Btw I'm pretty sure there's only one kp. can we get confirmation on whether there is 2 or 1 kp? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
I read through his filter and I found nothing to make me read him as either alignment. I went through the voting history to see who voted for him. The kickstart vote was too early to judge for me, so I ignored it. The next one to vote is geript. Reading through geripts filter I get a bad vibe. He pointed out that since noone jumped on moosy for this post, then moosy is mafia. This makes no sense to me. To me that post is filled with genuine excitement from a newbie. Seeing as I'm a newbie too i understand all to well how he must've felt in his early posts. On June 13 2015 03:31 geript wrote: Never assumed he was town to start w/ babycakes. Moreso: 1. Moosy makes a god awful post --> I think he's scum 2. No one pushes Moosy --> If he's town I'd expect someone to have jumped on him therefore scum 3. Posts a shit ton --> Probably just nubian with bad opening and mafia afk or otherwise engaged On June 13 2015 05:29 geript wrote: Did you look at this post at all? He's commenting about things that don't really matter in a way that he's seemingly had some interesting thought on it. He asks a question that's essentially a statement. He meanders through potentially interesting topics while giving no opinion on anything. Then he plays the dumbtell card. It's a big post that literally offers nothing while commenting on things in a way that confer a formed opinion. It almost can be boiled down to: "I've been thinking about this game, but I won't really comment on it at all. What do you guys think about this random stuff?" I don't see even newer town players do that often. Then he gets into an argument with waveofshadow who also picks up on his inconsistency in alignment on moosy. I can't see his reasoning for voting on sulfurous. Basically he said 2 things about sulfurous: and Then kickstart says this which aligns with my own thinking. On June 13 2015 06:03 Kickstart wrote: Went through geript's filter. His move off moosy and onto sulfurus was weird to me. He just said "id rather lynch you" in this thread, then voted in the other thread, and hasn't mentioned it at all. strange. This give me a townlean on kickstart. I still think bats is our best lynch for day 1, but geript has raised a red flag for me. I want to know why he's voting for sulfurus. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 13 2015 23:08 batsnacks wrote: Why am I the best lynch ruxxar? Think about this game from an the perspective of an outside observer who knows everyone's alignment. Right now you think the best lynch for d1 is the person who cares the most about the game and has put in more effort than anyone else. If I'm town than an outside observer is probably looking at you (and oats) and thinking "what the literal fuck are these people doing?" Even if I'm mafia the same outside observer is thinking... "yeah bats is mafia but still... what the literal fuck are these people doing?" How do you expect to win by lynching the person who put forth the most effort d1? Here's why I still don't like you(besides the case i made against you the first time): On June 12 2015 22:54 batsnacks wrote: I think I'm going to sheep geript now he was making sense about moose. ##unvote ##vote moosygoosy I didn't agree with geripts logic, so I don't agree with you sheeping him either. To me, moosy is my #1 town read. On June 13 2015 05:39 batsnacks wrote: When is EOD? I need to know if I need to start picking it up to not get lynched or if I can afford to dick around some more. Dicking around? That's not in line with trying to win the game. Either you're mafia or you're just not interested in winning as town. Either way a lynch is a good thing. On June 13 2015 06:01 batsnacks wrote: The worst thing I can find that sulfurus has done was misrepresenting how I played last game which isn't even the worst thing ever because I mislynched sulfurus last game, so he could just have some personal bias. I don't want to lynch geript d1 but if you do then the stuff wave said is probably the best means to accomplish that. I can't add anything new that he hasn't said already and that geript hasn't already responded to. People in this game are being unreadable and it's making me be crazy. Like yes objectively I am playing poorly but I am suffering from this warped perspective that by playing poorly for a time I can learn more about a game that I would just frustrate me if I were playing well. Sounds like a bad excuse to me. On June 13 2015 06:29 batsnacks wrote: Oh yeah I forgot about that. All the people who were saying that you leaving the thread was scummy are wrong. I think wave was one of them; the other stuff he said was okay though. Defending geript? I already don't like the associations between you two. On June 13 2015 07:05 batsnacks wrote: They're not in any specific order and I made that list in like 30 seconds and yes I would lynch me I am one of the scummier players in the game, though historically I have only ever lynched myself as town so this is a point in my favor. Why would a town say that he would want to lynch himself? Makes absolutely no sense. What's this crap? On June 13 2015 08:02 batsnacks wrote: K well I have the longest filter now and anyone who thinks mafia batsnacks has the biggest filter d1 is a silly goose and I don't mind getting lynched by silly geese because they can't be reasoned with anyway. So I'm going to go play dwarf fortress. You made a long filter of low quality posts imo, and then you proclaim you are town because you have the longest filter? On June 13 2015 08:23 batsnacks wrote: You don't have to believe this is my normal town meta because it's not, but you can't believe my scum meta is to post this much. I am a 1 page per day scum poster not a post more than anyone else scum poster. Again using filter length as argument. I would agree if you could make a point if you said you were active. But the fact that you specifically want to refer to having the longest filter is shady. On June 13 2015 09:27 batsnacks wrote: I have gotten more done than almost the entire game combined, certainly more than you. You have... pushed easy lynch plants and responded to Trfel's case and... that's about all. If I wasn't posting so much the game would be <25% of the current length. Also why damdred? I wish damdred were posting he would tell you to stop voting me because it is literally impossible for me to play this way as mafia. I don't agree with the bolded parts. And again refering to length as if that's some measurement of quality posts. On June 13 2015 11:35 batsnacks wrote: before I go to sleep though... 21% of this game is my posts! And I'm leading in votes! For SHAME! On June 13 2015 21:51 batsnacks wrote: That isn't a scum read. That is me being concerned that ruxxar and n00b are making mistakes that could cost town the game. They should have a dialog with me before the lynch because I'm town and I can convince them I'm town, or at the very least not the best lynch today. Yes you are guilty of the same I should have included you too. I completely disagree that most of what I've posted is useless I think I have easily contributed more to this game than anyone else, certainly more than you since your biggest contribution is tunneling a town for 70%ish percent of the day all because you didn't like my opening. Again disagree. To sum it up: You basically made a lot of low quality posts, proclaim that you've contributed more than anyone else in the game, and bear your filter length as a town shield in front of you. My vote still stands. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 14 2015 03:34 MoosyDoosy wrote: Why are you guys still going after batsnacks. Sure he was a shitty player at the start, but he's clearly a town player at this point. Unless you hold a grudge against him for his terrible start, I don't see why you would go after him. Who should we lynch instead? | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 14 2015 03:50 n00bKing wrote: Does knowing that there is only 1 mafia attack each Night change your position? Also, where are you getting that there are "2 town roles?" I see absolutely nothing that would indicate there are 8 VTs and 2 non-Vanilla Town roles, if that is what you are saying. Knowing that there is only 1 kp, then i believe there is a case both for and against the PGO to reveal himself. Here are my scenarios for and against : For: The PGO is a weak town player that might get cop checked. The PGO is one of the strongest town players and likely to be targeted by the medic. Against: A semi strong town player is the PGO, but he's not the strongest. Medic will most likely protect the perceived strongest town player. The mafia knowing this will go for some of the second strongest targets they know probably won't be saved by the medic. In this case it's beneficial for the PGO to not reveal himself. The 2 town roles was a slip up from me. I was thinking in terms of cop and medic, which was the usual setup at the TI hub before they later added a vigilante. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 14 2015 04:03 n00bKing wrote: Please try not to get mod-killed. The rules very clearly state that you are not allowed to make a post like that: Moosy already answered this but yes, it's in the rules on the first page. On February 20 2013 21:59 Acrofales wrote: Newbie-specific stuff 1.It's already in the rules, but remember, no editing. If you feel you must correct your post, please make a second post to clarify your statements. You may put EBWOP ("Edit by way of post," a handy acronym invented by semioldguy) at the beginning of your post to indicate that you are clearing up a point you made. If your EBWOP post is several posts after your original, please quote your original post in your EBWOP post for the sake of clarity. 2. Only sign up if you know you will have the time available to properly play the game. It is essential that players remain active in a newbie game, so only /in if you are able to play to your fullest. 3. If there is any sort of issue, you are unsure about some mechanic, or you are just wondering if your devilish scheme is even allowed, feel free to PM me, or ask in-thread with green text. Don't feel shy; these games are meant to be a place to learn and be open. 4. Behave as gentlemen (or ladies). Things get heated here, but personal attacks will not be acceptable, and will be dealt with accordingly. Remember, this is a game; have fun and happy scumhunting! 5. Please do not talk about any ongoing games either in-game or pre-game. This can affect other games and is unacceptable. Please do not refer to outside-of- thread activity of players in this thread. 6. If you receive coaching, don't tell town about it. 7. glhf! | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5668 Posts
On June 14 2015 04:11 scott31337 wrote: Why does this just scream "save sulfurus" for some reason to me? I never knew I was in it. ? Nice... Is it because I'm voting for Sulfurus? I am curious of this as well... So I'm really not saying anything here, very nice political answer. The reason why I'm curious about the sulfurus train is because he hasn't said anything that would make me think he's scum. I really wish he would come defend himself so I can get a better read on him. I don't want to get sulfurus lynched when I have 2 targets that I feel are more scummy(batsnacks and geript). | ||
| ||
