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On February 26 2015 00:36 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 00:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 25 2015 23:34 Tronak wrote:On February 25 2015 23:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I don't understand why you aren't pushing it though since as you've mentioned both Yamato and Snarfs have echoed your suspicions, so I ask my question again. Where do I rank between your other two suspects and can you elaborate on why? I cant push something no one believes (Yamato and Scarfs pointed at you but never supported my arguments) based on apparently "weak" arguments. I think this would only disturb town thinking. You cant be between my other 2 suspects, you are on a side, completly parked for now and by now I mean D1 unless a good case (much better than mine) appears on you. Cant see why you need more elaboration. Please enlighten me if you really need it. While writing this, I am starting to think you are just testing me now, which brings me to think you are town or a very clever mafia player. Since I believe you are clever and skilled enough to overskill me easyly, by the moment I don't want to dedicate much more time on you, since I would rather focus on my strongest suspects and whatever new starts to boil in the thread. I think this post is very townie because the paranoia is very well articulated and omnipresent in everything, as well as having a very clear idea about what to him is acting in the best interest of town and being congruent in it. This in contrast to Tormented for which, I once again repeat, no one has found a viable explanation regarding his sudden shift in thoughts. i'm reading through your filter and despite a lot of posting all I can see is Tormented is mafia. which is kind of stupid considering he is a new player and probably pretty hard to read. you've basically called a lot of people town. It will be interesting to see what you do when you are forced to lynch one of them.
I agree new players tend to be hard to read, but I find his change of mindset and inconsistencies incompatible with a town mindset. I believe I've found mafia, I see no one able to counter my argument other than a weak "he's a new player" which doesn't actually invalidate the point, so I'm going to keep driving it home until he gets lynched.
I'm willing to lynch Yamato as well though. I believe I've made that clear.
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On February 26 2015 00:44 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 00:38 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 00:36 KelsierSC wrote:On February 26 2015 00:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 25 2015 23:34 Tronak wrote:On February 25 2015 23:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I don't understand why you aren't pushing it though since as you've mentioned both Yamato and Snarfs have echoed your suspicions, so I ask my question again. Where do I rank between your other two suspects and can you elaborate on why? I cant push something no one believes (Yamato and Scarfs pointed at you but never supported my arguments) based on apparently "weak" arguments. I think this would only disturb town thinking. You cant be between my other 2 suspects, you are on a side, completly parked for now and by now I mean D1 unless a good case (much better than mine) appears on you. Cant see why you need more elaboration. Please enlighten me if you really need it. While writing this, I am starting to think you are just testing me now, which brings me to think you are town or a very clever mafia player. Since I believe you are clever and skilled enough to overskill me easyly, by the moment I don't want to dedicate much more time on you, since I would rather focus on my strongest suspects and whatever new starts to boil in the thread. I think this post is very townie because the paranoia is very well articulated and omnipresent in everything, as well as having a very clear idea about what to him is acting in the best interest of town and being congruent in it. This in contrast to Tormented for which, I once again repeat, no one has found a viable explanation regarding his sudden shift in thoughts. i'm reading through your filter and despite a lot of posting all I can see is Tormented is mafia. which is kind of stupid considering he is a new player and probably pretty hard to read. you've basically called a lot of people town. It will be interesting to see what you do when you are forced to lynch one of them. I agree new players tend to be hard to read, but I find his change of mindset and inconsistencies incompatible with a town mindset. I believe I've found mafia, I see no one able to counter my argument other than a weak "he's a new player" which doesn't actually invalidate the point, so I'm going to keep driving it home until he gets lynched. I'm willing to lynch Yamato as well though. I believe I've made that clear. True I misread one of your posts. Can you explain this point to me. Show nested quote +On February 25 2015 07:54 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 25 2015 04:49 Damdred wrote:On February 25 2015 04:47 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 25 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
Was driving oj these roads of mine.
Your case isn't bad art. I am hesitant just because I could see a newb new to tl doing it just ad much as scum, does it make him town no it makes him more likely scum.
Wave you are like talking to a brick wall. 6 hours into the game Hts barely has half a page of posts probably with very little actually to go on. Not enough to convince others yet, better to get more information.
I displayed how his thought process is inconsistent. It doesn't make sense from a town perspective, newbie or not doesn't come into it. On February 25 2015 04:40 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 25 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
Was driving oj these roads of mine.
Your case isn't bad art. I am hesitant just because I could see a newb new to tl doing it just ad much as scum, does it make him town no it makes him more likely scum.
Wave you are like talking to a brick wall. 6 hours into the game Hts barely has half a page of posts probably with very little actually to go on. Not enough to convince others yet, better to get more information.
THE WHY WERE YOU SO OCNFIDENT OF HIS SCUMMINESS TO BEGIN WITH Am I the only one seeing this? Somebody please let me know. Comment on my case and I may let you know. I'm not saying your wrong I'm just saying that where he comes from its not that uncommon a thing to do and besides that pace is different and he's never been asked to hive reads on day one. So I'm a little hesitant That's all fine and dandy, but that doesn't explain his sudden change from paranoia to giving concrete reads on everyone except the people he claimed to be paranoid of despite being paranoid of everyone just a few moments ago. On February 25 2015 05:29 Snarfs wrote:
Artanis, I think you're suspicious. That's why I'm asking other people their opinion on you. I think you said a lot of nothing yesterday before leaving and that your case on Tormented is not adding more than a single line could, but it conveniently fills lots of space nicely. What nothing did I say beyond the initial game trolling and how would you explain my point on Tormented in a single line? I felt it needed a narrative to drive the point home. Your meta towncase on Node also feels arbitrary. You picked out an aspect that Node used in a town game and didn't use in his mafia game and presumed that it's alignment indicative because they're different, but correlation does not imply causation. Without having been in the game or reading them entirely, it's pretty much impossible to tell what drove him to post differently in that regard. Meta is useful for general trends but I don't believe the way you used it is indicative of anything. I could prove just about anything I wanted using a mafia and towngame of any one player. On February 25 2015 06:07 WaveofShadow wrote:
Yeah chances are damdred isn't scum.
If I were to continue playing as I normally would I'd probably tunnel him uselessly till days end but I'm sure there's a good reason people haven't picked up on what I found to be marginally significant.
I'll be looking elsewhere when I get the chance. I still want you to wow me with something though, damdred. I want to know why I lost one of those 2014 awards to you. I don't like this defeatist attitude. I had a pretty good townread on you so far but this is weaksauce. I remember Wave in Shadow consistently going against the grain with his own thoughts and no matter what the other veterans said, he continued on his own thought pattern. I find this very atypical of townWave.On February 25 2015 06:31 Eden1892 wrote:
I think HTS replaced out because she's mafia, now to go read the thread for people who probably aren't mafia due to that Can we please not do this? On February 25 2015 06:57 Tronak wrote:On February 25 2015 03:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I also want more comments on my case. I cant take seriously your case on Tormented, lyching someone for being paranoid on you during first posts while you were trolling around is not a solid argument from my point of view. First I thought you could be putting some pressure on Tormented, now I am thinking, again, you are trying to bring attention to a dead point, again. That's not my argument at all. My argument is that he was paranoid of everyone at first, then when asked to give reads on people the only people he's paranoid of is the people he's mentioned before in his filter, and then there's that he separates between "town or mafia" and "no clue" for no apparent reason whatsoever. Eden Node is probably town, stop pestering him. Pester this guy instead On February 25 2015 07:33 yamato77 wrote:
I think ksc might be mafia.
I remember him being obstinate as town but not altogether unwilling to participate. He was much more forthcoming in the game I played with him.
I still kinda think tormented is town mafia but it's more up in the air with Artanis being on the lynch as well and the question mark I have for him. Are you seriously making unflipped associations right now? Like, really? so atyptical town wave followed by Show nested quote +On February 25 2015 22:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 25 2015 22:36 Eden1892 wrote:Ah, one other thing about Wave. Earlier he said this: On February 24 2015 15:25 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 24 2015 15:20 yamato77 wrote:On February 24 2015 15:17 WaveofShadow wrote:Am I included it those who 'liked the fact that he asked some questions?' Because I don't think I said anything of the sort. I believe my words were: On February 24 2015 12:04 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 24 2015 10:40 _Tormented_ wrote:
@yamato what makes you support Artanis for mayor? Especially without hearing anyone else even lobby for it yet. This one is curious. It's typical new player fare. He's pretty agreeable and gives the public exactly what they want---this works from both mafia and town perspectives for obvs reasons. I'm historically awful at reading new players and this is no exception tbh. Now I think there's maybe something to it, but a) all you're doing is basically taking the 'he must be mafia' side of the inconspicuous newbie argument b) I'm not sure why you think it has more merit than Prob's point that I've latched onto. I don't really see a towny mindset behind Damdred's retraction. I thought you were describing him as a curious person, not saying that he perplexes you in some way. Anyway, I didn't say he had to be mafia, I'm just saying that it is textbook earlygame mafia play. He's not a complete noob, either. And such is often the problem I have with newer players (doesn't have to be a complete noob for this to apply). Textbook mafia play often also looks like textbook 'I'm not sure what else to do here' noob play. Now he's voting Tronak for... what? Something that I'd pretty much to the letter call "'I'm not sure what else to do here' noob play." I'd almost rather lynch Wave over yamato. How about that? I like my arguments better for lynching him on further reflection. ##UNVOTE
##VOTE: WaveofShadow I.. I was townreading him. Do I have to re-eval him too? ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/bjFxgFg.gif) So you had wave as atypical town then you town read him but then had to reevaluate him again. I'm interested why wave was suddenly in your town.
You missed one post in between those two which was this:
On February 25 2015 09:43 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Ugh, Cell isn't really comparable since the lynch pool is so limited so thread sentiment becomes much more likely to happen regardless and I tried getting through Guilty but then I realized determining what thread sentiment is pretty hard in hindsight so I guess I'm just gonna have to drop it.
I decided the heuristic I judged Wave to be different from his town games to be inconclusive to his alignment, and that was my main reason for finding him weird.
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Wave where's your head at now?
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On February 26 2015 01:00 KelsierSC wrote:
i don't understand how that post explains it
I thought he was town before, then that post made me wonder, then I decided it wasn't something indicative and I stopped wondering.
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On February 26 2015 01:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 01:00 KelsierSC wrote:
i don't understand how that post explains it I thought he was town before, then that post made me wonder, then I decided it wasn't something indicative and I stopped wondering.
EBWOP: The post wave made, not the post I made.
The post I quoted just shows where I stopped considering it a tell.
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On February 26 2015 01:02 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 01:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:00 KelsierSC wrote:
i don't understand how that post explains it I thought he was town before, then that post made me wonder, then I decided it wasn't something indicative and I stopped wondering. so he's still clear town for you then?
Yes.
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On February 26 2015 01:03 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 01:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:02 KelsierSC wrote:On February 26 2015 01:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:00 KelsierSC wrote:
i don't understand how that post explains it I thought he was town before, then that post made me wonder, then I decided it wasn't something indicative and I stopped wondering. so he's still clear town for you then? Yes. but you said you had to reevaluate him again after Eden's post.
And I did. Did you miss that post too?
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Damdred why do I not have a clue why you scumread any of those? On Snarfs you've only mentioned the read progression and I don't remember you commenting on SL or Wave at all.
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So why have you eliminated Tormented as a potential lynch when your only defense for him was that it could be because he's a newbie? That argument would only make sense to make him null, which should put him in a poe group.
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On February 26 2015 01:27 Damdred wrote:
Because his frustration looks really real, and hes being scum read on really weak stuff. Its his first game here and where he comes from day ones are a joke, you pressured him into giving read when he wasn't quite ready to give a read on everyone in the game obviously.
Instead of going with the flow with the snarls case he also struck back fairly interestingly going against the grain, his intial post was meh, but his follow up explanation was pretty good to me, it make a lot of sense and you could see what he was saying.
I don't want to lynch him
On February 25 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
Was driving oj these roads of mine.
Your case isn't bad art. I am hesitant just because I could see a newb new to tl doing it just ad much as scum, does it make him town no it makes him more likely scum.
Wave you are like talking to a brick wall. 6 hours into the game Hts barely has half a page of posts probably with very little actually to go on. Not enough to convince others yet, better to get more information.
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/B6ScFo8.jpg)
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On February 26 2015 01:28 KelsierSC wrote:
You can look at my case on sl again if you like.
Artanis your mentioned as town he wants to be as unreadable as possible. If that is the case then why does mention, twice, that he has made the best /towniest post in the thread.
I dunno, he's SL, he says contradictory stuff in game all the time. I'm just hoping he does something dumb that confirms him as town again if he's town like fakeclaiming cop. I could lynch him but it'd basically be a pure policy lynch.
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On February 26 2015 01:37 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 01:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:27 Damdred wrote:
Because his frustration looks really real, and hes being scum read on really weak stuff. Its his first game here and where he comes from day ones are a joke, you pressured him into giving read when he wasn't quite ready to give a read on everyone in the game obviously.
Instead of going with the flow with the snarls case he also struck back fairly interestingly going against the grain, his intial post was meh, but his follow up explanation was pretty good to me, it make a lot of sense and you could see what he was saying.
I don't want to lynch him On February 25 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
Was driving oj these roads of mine.
Your case isn't bad art. I am hesitant just because I could see a newb new to tl doing it just ad much as scum, does it make him town no it makes him more likely scum.
Wave you are like talking to a brick wall. 6 hours into the game Hts barely has half a page of posts probably with very little actually to go on. Not enough to convince others yet, better to get more information.
Yeah the case itself isn't bad, its made up of some weak points at this point in the thread though. Cases can grow or get weaker, and I think tis got weaker with torms continued play.
Okay, that's fair even though I disagree with your assessment on the original case (I think it's damning) I don't think it's fruitful to keep arguing about that.
I'm not willing to lynch Wave though. Why are you willing to lynch Wave and why aren't you willing to lynch Yamato? What has Yamato actually posted that you liked?
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On February 26 2015 01:41 KelsierSC wrote:
Artanis what the.fuck you just caught this fool.
Lynch his.azz
No, Damdred is probably town. His explanation makes sense, he just worded one post poorly.
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On February 26 2015 01:45 KelsierSC wrote:
Ugh fair enough.
I thought you beez in the trap
## unvote
##vote Yamato77
I dont think sl is policy. My case on him isn't policy at all.
Plus you yourself gave an example of his town mentality and I just displayed something that was opposed to that.
Dont pull "oh its policy" bullshit when my case is the realest
I don't think Damdred's capable of posting as much as he is now as mafia.
I also don't think you did. Town SL can easily make a post that he thinks is accidentally very townie, then decide (as he has so far) not to give much more of a shit for the rest of the day to compensate. It'd actually fit in his thought process there. He's null to me and I'm not sure there's much that can sway me on him in either direction.
Since no one wants to vote Tormented I'll park my vote on Yamato as well. He's made one case on Tormented which he backed off from when a question mark pushed the same suspect, he's asked a bunch of questions that didn't lead to anything, and he's been flinging unsubstantiated suspicions at me all game long whilst complaining about how the thread's evolving.
##Vote Yamato77
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On February 26 2015 01:47 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 01:40 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:37 Damdred wrote:On February 26 2015 01:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 26 2015 01:27 Damdred wrote:
Because his frustration looks really real, and hes being scum read on really weak stuff. Its his first game here and where he comes from day ones are a joke, you pressured him into giving read when he wasn't quite ready to give a read on everyone in the game obviously.
Instead of going with the flow with the snarls case he also struck back fairly interestingly going against the grain, his intial post was meh, but his follow up explanation was pretty good to me, it make a lot of sense and you could see what he was saying.
I don't want to lynch him On February 25 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
Was driving oj these roads of mine.
Your case isn't bad art. I am hesitant just because I could see a newb new to tl doing it just ad much as scum, does it make him town no it makes him more likely scum.
Wave you are like talking to a brick wall. 6 hours into the game Hts barely has half a page of posts probably with very little actually to go on. Not enough to convince others yet, better to get more information.
Yeah the case itself isn't bad, its made up of some weak points at this point in the thread though. Cases can grow or get weaker, and I think tis got weaker with torms continued play. Okay, that's fair even though I disagree with your assessment on the original case (I think it's damning) I don't think it's fruitful to keep arguing about that. I'm not willing to lynch Wave though. Why are you willing to lynch Wave and why aren't you willing to lynch Yamato? What has Yamato actually posted that you liked? When I think of wave and his town play I generally think of someone doing a ton of things with a decent thread precense finds things pushes them. I see part of this in wave, the finding something and pushing it for the first half of the day but past that hes been kind of....void he dropped what he found to be scummy and has just been here. I played with a mafia yamato before and he just doesn't seem to care and as town he cares and has some thoughts. I see more the later here, the initial case he posted wasn't as good as you but he did try to jump start the thread in a direction he thought was good which is towny I think. His paranoia while super high for whatever reason (which towards you art is kinda believable) is ok. I just don't want to lynch him I think right now I think.
Wave's been quite present though. His questions and pressure feel very strong, and I get the feeling from his questions that he's actively hunting for scum. His questions have that accusatory hint to them that I've found common in his town games.
I think I played with a mafia Yamato before, but it was a long, looong time ago and I have no idea how he'd play now. Disregarding meta, I think he's played a very scummy game so far. Reasons in the post I made earlier.
I need to leave now, I'll be back about an hour before deadline I estimate.
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On February 26 2015 01:53 KelsierSC wrote:
Aeleranis. but if he doesn't want to get read as townie the why does he draw attention.to his "townie" post twice?
Kitschner, trying to be unreadable doesn't mean you don't call your own posts townie as either alignment. It just means you don't go out of your way to become confirmed town.
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And it's retarded because you should always play either alignment to your fullest but eh.
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On February 26 2015 01:58 Snarfs wrote:
Artanis, what's your read on me?
I'm not sure, I haven't looked at you attentively yet.
Now I'm actually leaving.
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Hi, I'm back. What'd I miss?
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EPT
