On February 26 2015 09:23 marvellosity wrote:
given Idra is a douche and his word is worth as much as my poop, probably not the best authority to appeal to

That's kind of the point XD

zlefin

United States7689 Posts

February 26 2015 00:24 GMT

#1742

yeah, it's very important to get enough sleep; sleep is more important than reading. Especially for problems of this type, where letting the issues percolate in your brain during sleep makes a big difference.

Fecalfeast

Canada11355 Posts

February 26 2015 00:25 GMT

#1743

Trfel you have to realize that being wrong is VERY common in mafia. If all the vets were right about their reads 100% of the time the game would be no fun since town would win every time.

Fecalfeast

Canada11355 Posts

February 26 2015 00:26 GMT

#1744

On February 26 2015 09:23 marvellosity wrote:
given Idra is a douche and his word is worth as much as my poop, probably not the best authority to appeal to

Woah. Don't insult mai waifu

rsoultin

Netherlands15308 Posts

February 26 2015 00:26 GMT

#1745

-bounces-

my best game for reads...apart from obv scum!trfel game which I can't count cause I was mislynched ;o;

was the one I started like 36 hrs late lol ><

sometimes I think the problem is just spending too much time thinking about it

rsoultin

Netherlands15308 Posts

February 26 2015 00:27 GMT

#1746

On February 26 2015 09:25 Fecalfeast wrote:
Trfel you have to realize that being wrong is VERY common in mafia. If all the vets were right about their reads 100% of the time the game would be no fun since town would win every time.

+1000

Trfel

7015 Posts

February 26 2015 00:38 GMT

#1747

I wonder, is it better to work on learning how to make better normal reads, or should I figure out how to vote analysis/night kill analysis? Obviously both, but.....

I don't really know how to do either. And I don't really know where to go to learn.

zlefin

United States7689 Posts

February 26 2015 00:42 GMT

#1748

To learn how to do those, I recommend asking people in TL mafia, I hear they have some very experienced people.

rsoultin

Netherlands15308 Posts

February 26 2015 00:42 GMT

#1749

honestly?

tone reads and vote analysis have gotten me the closest to mafia...tone reads more for town reads minus a few exceptions, and vote analysis for mafia

everyone's different, but for me, if someone makes a strange vote, then their read progression to arrive at the vote is ridic lacking, it almost feels like a free giveaway ^^ course I did this with lonemeow and was wrong but eh...it's also what got me the townread on bresh in the same game and that was right on point, even if it contributed to my mislynch later lol

Trfel

7015 Posts

February 26 2015 00:49 GMT

#1750

I kept looking at The Shining's case on jarjarbinks, I read it at least three times. But I just didn't see most of the points.

Trfel

7015 Posts

February 26 2015 00:55 GMT

#1751

Oh well, I'll keep working on it. Sorry to all. I'm pretty sure I was the only person in the world who didn't know who was scum at LYLO XD

rsoultin

Netherlands15308 Posts

February 26 2015 00:56 GMT

#1752

just personal preference

but I hate giant-ass mostly narrative cases. I know the point is to persuade, but there's so much bias in there, and if I can't cut right to the meat of what someone is trying to say quickly, I pretty much dismiss it as either confirmation bias or flat-out scum-motivated (prob cause of HF lolol)

but then, this is coming from someone who can't build great cases, and damdred has some excellent ones that are still a ton of narrative and make me -_-, so take that with a grain of salt lol

if someone's clearly not objective, though...please take the time to put your main points in bullet format or something with the evidence supporting it clear to find. when i'm town I always have to double-check these things, and fishing the actual meat out of all the blah is annoying ^^

shining had a couple good points and mostly null ones...the biggest thing was the NK...in lylo it's unlikely that scum is going to go with keeping the town player most likely to lynch them just for WIFOM purposes

rsoultin

Netherlands15308 Posts

February 26 2015 00:58 GMT

#1753

oh, and truffle, some of your cases were perfect, cause even with all the narrative the main points and evidence were clear

the later stuff with all the embedded links @.@ not gonna open 30 links in a post. it reads more fluidly but it's a bitch to verify

ObiWanShinobi

United States8089 Posts

February 26 2015 01:41 GMT

#1754

Congratulations to my team for taking it.

I stand by pretty much everything I said in the QTs. Good work guys.

Half the Sky

Germany9029 Posts

February 26 2015 01:42 GMT

#1755

One general takeaway of note here, Mafia isn't going to become easy for players overnight regardless of alignment. Different players, different mechanics, different styles and even RL can greatly affect how you play at times. Sometimes the outcome depends on how well you adapt and adjust, you can only control so much depending on the arguments that people make and what people buy.

The only way you'll improve is to play more. Set incremental goals. Make mistakes and learn from them.

There's a few spots left in my mini game (which is post restricted, the pace will likely be similar to what you played here) and Fecalfeast is starting a game of his own from what I understand.

So definitely come out and play more, we hope to see you lot in upcoming games!

Trfel

7015 Posts

February 26 2015 01:47 GMT

#1756

Well, I'm definitely good at the "making mistakes" part XD

zlefin

United States7689 Posts

February 26 2015 01:51 GMT

#1757

This game was already a lot of posts and work. Your mini-game looks too hard!

Half the Sky

Germany9029 Posts

February 26 2015 01:54 GMT

#1758

You also have the option of observing or shadowing a player as well that's another way of learning.

Half the Sky

Germany9029 Posts

February 26 2015 02:43 GMT

#1759

On February 26 2015 10:51 zlefin wrote:
This game was already a lot of posts and work. Your mini-game looks too hard!

In general, most veteran 13 player setups have very similar rules. Key differences are:

1 setups are semi-open, some hosts do RNG between a set range of setups, but most do not (and I personally will not)
2 3-man scumteam instead of 2 (thus 2 town PRs v 1 scum PR generally)
3 in most cases (except student newbies, which are hybrids), no coaching

I'm post-restricting my mini partially to experiment - it allows those who may not have the time to dedicate to play be able to play through a more readable condensed thread, but also challenge others (the spammer-style players) through deprivation. That's probably the main difference with the one I'm doing now, but I won't be restricting all my games like this.