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On November 12 2016 06:58 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2016 06:34 sicklucker wrote:On November 10 2016 02:51 Blazinghand wrote:That's correct, that Trump didn't actually get more votes than Clinton. We're still counting the last votes, but by all accounts, it appears that: Trump got 59,350,000 votes Clinton got 59,580,000 votes This means Clinton has about 230,000 more votes than Trump so far. So Clinton actually beat Trump by between a third and a half of a percent. depending on how the final votes come out. However, the US President is not chosen by popular vote, but instead via a process using the Electoral College. So, despite getting fewer votes than Clinton, Trump will be the next president. In any case, this election isn't what I was hoping for, but I will be cautiously optimistic that Trump will leave most of the actual governing to Pence and spend his time doing press events, etc. This would be the best outcome and wouldn't actually be that bad; Trump has head of state is much better than Trump as chief executive.I really hope this is what happens, at least. Cause Trump taking an active hand in governing could be pretty bad, given his self-control issues. the popular vote was so close that it acualy makes more sense for the silly us electorate system to decide the president for once. i laugh when people complain that trump lost by like 0.001% Eh, the gap (now that most of the votes are counted) is 400,000 votes out of 120,000,000 votes, which is actually 0.3%, not 0.001% or anything close to that. It was a close race, yeah, and I'm not disputing the result of the EC or who should legally be our next president, but Clinton clearly got more votes. Show nested quote +On November 12 2016 06:35 sicklucker wrote:
well to be fair Canada has a similar system ;p. its pretty standard I would think im sure england has something like that since most democracy's including canada are based off that. England's head of state is hereditary and England's chief exec isn't elected but is appointed by the party that got the majority (currently the Conservatives, who have 51% of the seats in parliament and got 36% of the votes in the election due to districting). The country that really gets this right IMO is France, which does a run-off system which allows for 3rd parties to get a chance (and they often do!) but then a runoff between the top two most popular candidates, all done via popular vote. This is also how the state of California does elections for all state-level offices and state-wide offices, like State Senate, State Assembly, Governor, Federal Senator, Federal Representative, etc. It's quite good. In a system like this, we'd have a general election where you could vote for whoever you wanted without worrying about spoiling things. Let's say you prefer Johnson by far, but are worried because although you hate Trump you hate Clinton even more. Well, under a run-off popular vote system, you vote for Johnson in the first round, and if it ends up being Trump v Clinton in the runoff, you can then vote for the lesser evil. First Past the Post is pretty bad for third parties, and EC + FTPT together is pretty sad. It works reasonably well but not nearly as well as the systems designed by countries that had a chance to learn from our mistakes. Still, it's the system we have so we work with it.
yes i know I live in a commonwealth nation -_-
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On November 12 2016 09:50 Blazinghand wrote:
I hope the people in the EC do their job and make Trump the president. If they pick some other conservative instead it would be an even worse hijacking of the democratic process than the EC currently is. I don't like Trump but according to the rules of our election, he won. Is the EC dumb? Yeah. Should it be replaced and our system reformed? Absolutely. But we shouldn't abuse the letter of the law to try to do an end-run around democracy. I might prefer McCain or Romney or JEB as the president, but if we start ignoring the system and just having the EC pick candidates instead of doing what their states say, where does it stop?
Fix the system, don't make its problems worse imo
To change the electoral college at all we would need a constitutional amendment which would be very hard to pass in the first place and I doudt the people who benefit from the electoral college(politicians) would change it.
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It wouldnt' be heard of the EC doing something crazy and going against who they are supposed to. Is it highly frowned upon? Yes it really is. Right now at least one electoral voter is refusing to vote for hillary and just happens to come from one of the 21 (i think its 21) states that have penalty for not voting for the winner. Most of the time it is just a substantial fine.
But we also have in the 20s states that have no rule in place for faithless electoral votes.
The electoral college isn't perfect by any stretch of the imagination and I think it is highly highly unlikely that they will vote anyone else besides trump as president at this point in time.
We also have to think popular vote in the United States if it was the only way to decide who the president of the united states was it would be 100% unfair. Population densities are just all over the place, you would have places like California, Florida, New York 100% deciding who was president.
Look at the votes that were gotten in this election now, yes Clinton technically won the popular vote. Except most of her vote (essentially the majority that put her ahead) came from California, if you look at the breakdown of the vote the majority of states wanted trump while the large cities wanted clinton.
There are a myriad of reasons for this, could pull from education, different races being at different concentrations.
I voted for Clinton myself, and my county went Hillary some way. But we were one of the only counties outside Atlanta that went blue, which isn't unusual.
do I think the institution needs some kind of change? Probably, but I do not trust the typical american to make informed decisions in fact you can tell just by the DNC nominee (Clinton) that everyone is out of touch.
I am rambling now because I have a lot of thoughts about the whole issue and because my candidate didn't even get past the primaries. AND I couldn't even write in his name because of loser laws which is the dumbest shit I have ever heard if anything needs to change it is that.
AFter so many screw ups by both parties a real write in candidate could of destroyed both but meh.
All in all its impossible or highly unlikey the republicans would anger the people who voted them in by not putting trump in office. This would lose them the senate more than likely in two years and the house later on. So just look forward to Trump being in "charge" and hopefully the democrats and some republicans fight him on things that matter like ecological things/climate change and renewable energy. College funding etc, these are important issues that sadly might be pushed to the back as they are rolled over and we are pushed back 10-15 years in those regards.
I'll stop talking now lol
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also why is there no mafia games for me to signup
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So in one month from today I will have a major surgery. It was going to be this month but got pushed back one month. I will have half of my pancreas, a large cyst, my spleen, and some of my intestines taken out. It will be a 4-6 hour surgery with 7-10 days in the hospital afterword. 1-2 of those in ICU. I am nervous as fuck, but hopefully it will help with the pain I have lived with the last 16 years alot.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
Hope everything goes well Onegu!
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Holding thumbs for ya Onegu.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Jesus.
Best of luck buddy. We're pulling for you.
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Blazinghand
United States25552 Posts
Thoughts and prayers are with you, Onegu. I hope everything comes out well.
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Best of luck from me, too!
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Hopefully everything goes OK. My thoughts are with you coach!
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I'm currently working on convincing people in Iceland to join America as the 51st state, or the 50th, if california goes full emo.
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Blazinghand
United States25552 Posts
California won't leave the Union. That's just a few nuts on the internet.
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On November 14 2016 18:21 Palmar wrote:
I'm currently working on convincing people in Iceland to join America as the 51st state, or the 50th, if california goes full emo.
you absolute madman
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Hope everything goes better than perfect Onegu.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On November 14 2016 22:53 Kurumi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2016 18:21 Palmar wrote:
I'm currently working on convincing people in Iceland to join America as the 51st state, or the 50th, if california goes full emo. you absolute madman
I say we let Iceland and Puerto Rico go to war and we admit the winner. Gotta prove that you're worthy of all our greatness.
We might even be able to make a decent reality television show out of it.
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On November 14 2016 12:00 Onegu wrote:
So in one month from today I will have a major surgery. It was going to be this month but got pushed back one month. I will have half of my pancreas, a large cyst, my spleen, and some of my intestines taken out. It will be a 4-6 hour surgery with 7-10 days in the hospital afterword. 1-2 of those in ICU. I am nervous as fuck, but hopefully it will help with the pain I have lived with the last 16 years alot.
Heart and wishes with you, and your speedy recovery when it comes.
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EPT
