EPTTL Mafia Ban List 2.0 - Page 69
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
Message GMarshal if you request a ban please ^_^ Also when the game you're sitting out is over! ~GMarshal | ||
|
Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
| ||
|
Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
On June 28 2014 16:18 raynpelikoneet wrote: /sitout A Fire Upon the Deep Mini Mafia You only needed to sit out 2 games. You did already sit out Golden Sun Djinn and TL Order. | ||
|
justanothertownie
16322 Posts
On June 30 2014 19:31 Holyflare wrote: W/e i request a 1 game ban for sandroba and gumshoe for being inactivity modkilled. Warning for geript imo for failing to vote/modkill. I second. | ||
|
Amiko
United States1725 Posts
Geript was pretty active he just failed to vote once so warning seems appropriate. | ||
|
Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
| ||
|
Amiko
United States1725 Posts
Game Link: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451310-tl-order-lxvi-mafia - 1 Game Ban requested for Gumshoe - Modkilled at end of D3 for failing to vote twice (D2, D3). - 1 Game Ban requested for Sandroba - Modkilled at end of D3 for failing to vote twice (D2, D3). - 1 Game Ban requested for Erandorr - Replaced for failing to vote and inactivity (D1, D2). - Warning requested for Geript / TicaTica - Modkilled for failing to vote once, but was active and seemed to have just forgotten. (Just to be clear this is regarding the game players are discussing above, not a second ban request) | ||
GMarshal
United States22154 Posts
On July 01 2014 11:13 Amiko wrote: I have been provided with ban-request authority from [UoN]Sentinel for Order 66 (I was a cohost and pm'd him about the thread and he asked me to send it in his stead). Game Link: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451310-tl-order-lxvi-mafia - 1 Game Ban requested for Gumshoe - Modkilled at end of D3 for failing to vote twice (D2, D3). - 1 Game Ban requested for Sandroba - Modkilled at end of D3 for failing to vote twice (D2, D3). - 1 Game Ban requested for Erandorr - Replaced for failing to vote and inactivity (D1, D2). - Warning requested for Geript / TicaTica - Modkilled for failing to vote once, but was active and seemed to have just forgotten. (Just to be clear this is regarding the game players are discussing above, not a second ban request) Approved! | ||
|
Blazinghand
United States25558 Posts
Game link: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/460423-a-fire-upon-the-deep-mini-mafia 1 game ban requested for Tehpoofter for failing to vote, and for inactivity. 1 game ban requested for EchelonTee for failing to vote, and for inactivity. 1 game ban requested for strongandbig for failing to vote, and for inactivity. Players were aware of the rule that you must vote before the (very generous 72 hour) deadline. I also PMed them a clearly marked official warning all at least once (snb and ET were pmed twice) and posted in the thread reminding them of the mandatory voting. The Day 3 was only 1 page, there's no way they missed it. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
Blazinghand
United States25558 Posts
Your personal distaste for the rule doesn't do anything to change the fact you violated it. I don't see how that's relevant. Even more, you complain about the IML mechanics at LYLO, but I'd note that if you as a townie choose not to vote by the end of the day at LYLO, your team 100% loses because you can't reach a majority without all the townies. You can argue about what the correct action is, but I'm pretty sure the correct action isn't "none of the townies make any posts for the entire day, and none of them vote, resulting in a no-lynch that guarantees scum victory"... just saying. Even that is all irrelevant though: I was super clear with the rules and warned you twice. The rules require you to cast a vote before 72 hours are up. The rules require you be active. This was clear in the OP. It was clear in numerous posts I made throughout the game. I went out of my way to reach out to you twice, and you didn't make any posts. | ||
|
Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
| ||
|
Tehpoofter
United States2911 Posts
On July 09 2014 14:14 Blazinghand wrote: A Fire Upon the Deep Mini Mafia Bans Game link: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/460423-a-fire-upon-the-deep-mini-mafia 1 game ban requested for Tehpoofter for failing to vote, and for inactivity. 1 game ban requested for EchelonTee for failing to vote, and for inactivity. 1 game ban requested for strongandbig for failing to vote, and for inactivity. Players were aware of the rule that you must vote before the (very generous 72 hour) deadline. I also PMed them a clearly marked official warning all at least once (snb and ET were pmed twice) and posted in the thread reminding them of the mandatory voting. The Day 3 was only 1 page, there's no way they missed it. I will be formally protesting this ban (I think by posting in here thats how you do it but if thats not the case I guess I'll find out later) for reasons along the same lines as SNB was saying. I did post during the day as the requirements were 1 post which I met(thus the inactivity portion of the ban is untrue). I did however not vote. I didn't vote because at the end of day period the votes were only on SNB whom I felt was very townie. I also shared the same concerns that if I voted for someone who was town I would instantly lose the game. I didn't wish for this to happen. I think IML games are a rarity on this site, for me at least they are, so handling the voting is much different. I considered instantly voting for Chariman Ray but this could have resulted in an instant town loss if I was wrong. So the best time to vote is after some discussion. Having hammered wrong at lylo in my previous only experience with IML I was skiddish. The game felt like it was going to be a loss in either way but I was shy to be the one to "Cause" it. I accept I should have voiced this concern in the thread but it felt like a dialog that wouldn't help others progress the game to me. I feel we may have violated the letter of the law but in no way the spirit of it. I was the first one to post on Day 3 and was demoralized by the general slowness of the thread and the fact our most likely only PR died the night before with no info. I felt the game was lost in either fashion. I feel like failing to type in something like "##Vote: X" to possibly lose the game is the only instance of me violating any rules and I feel like an official warning is the highest possible applicable punishment. I attempted to resolve the matter with BH directly but we disagree about the process and the correct punishment. The TLDR of my case: I feel no voting at best in the situation would result in a warning and doesn't deserve a full game ban. I also never violated the inactivity portion (1 post per cycle) so that part of the accusation should be thrown out entirely. I'm not asking to be absolved just warned as opposed to banned. | ||
|
Blazinghand
United States25558 Posts
Moreover, this isn't even the point. My rules clearly state you need to vote before deadline. Tehpoofter, SnB, and ET did not vote before the deadline. It doesn't matter that it was LYLO, or what their motives were. Though honestly at LYLO I can't imagine a motivte for not voting. Not voting at LYLO as town literally always loses the game unless there is a doctor, and even then it's a long shot. In any case, it's not like these guys were like, chatting and having discussions and weren't warned. It's not like the rules I laid out were unclear. They were warned (some of them repeatedly) via PM and in thread. I literally told them I'd modkill them if they didn't vote, and that voting is mandatory by the deadline. The day ended and the three of them hadn't voted. The case is open and shut: voting is mandatory. If you don't vote, you get modkilled. None of these guys were even close to being active or playing the game, they all had like 2, maybe 3 posts in 96 hours, so it's not like they were actually active and I'm pushing this on a technicality, as it might be implied. Tehpoofter has intimated to me in PMs that he believes this is emotionally driven. I will concede, I'm not pleased with the low activity in the game. I originally was quite angry and considered pushing for a 2 or 3 game ban for ruining my game (as I have in the past, for coag and marv from the getmoript hydra). However, a disproportionate punishment would not be reasonable. Standard 1 game inactivity is the way to go. I'll also note, for the record, that in the past I've let people off the hook when they had good IRL reasons for being AFK or inactive. Tehpoofter and SnB seem to not have these good reasons, but I have not heard from EchelonTee; it's possible something came up for him, since he hasn't posted since the end of the game. If it turns out he had a good reasoning for bailing for several days without telling me, I'd like to not ban him, but for now I believe we should stick with a 1 game ban on him as well. | ||
|
phagga
Switzerland2194 Posts
On July 11 2014 09:42 Tehpoofter wrote: I will be formally protesting this ban (I think by posting in here thats how you do it but if thats not the case I guess I'll find out later) for reasons along the same lines as SNB was saying. I did post during the day as the requirements were 1 post which I met(thus the inactivity portion of the ban is untrue). I did however not vote. I didn't vote because at the end of day period the votes were only on SNB whom I felt was very townie. I also shared the same concerns that if I voted for someone who was town I would instantly lose the game. I didn't wish for this to happen. Voting gives you a chance to win. Not voting always loses you the game because a.) lylo b.) modkill Also, did you voice those concerns in any way during the game (e.g. PM to Blazinghand) I think IML games are a rarity on this site, for me at least they are, so handling the voting is much different. I considered instantly voting for Chariman Ray but this could have resulted in an instant town loss if I was wrong. So the best time to vote is after some discussion. Having hammered wrong at lylo in my previous only experience with IML I was skiddish. The game felt like it was going to be a loss in either way but I was shy to be the one to "Cause" it. I accept I should have voiced this concern in the thread but it felt like a dialog that wouldn't help others progress the game to me. It still would have been better than not doing anything at all. I feel we may have violated the letter of the law but in no way the spirit of it. I was the first one to post on Day 3 and was demoralized by the general slowness of the thread and the fact our most likely only PR died the night before with no info. I felt the game was lost in either fashion. I feel like failing to type in something like "##Vote: X" to possibly lose the game is the only instance of me violating any rules and I feel like an official warning is the highest possible applicable punishment. I attempted to resolve the matter with BH directly but we disagree about the process and the correct punishment. This is the only post of you in Lylo: On July 07 2014 08:37 Tehpoofter wrote: Wow we're in lylo and the cop is dead. This is shit. How is this in the spirit of the rules? You are not trying to figure the game out, you are, in fact, not playing at all. You are not playing the game during lylo. You are not playing towards your win condition. And the fact that in lylo you have to vote to win as town, and you did not vote, also means you were not playing towards your win condition. The TLDR of my case: I feel no voting at best in the situation would result in a warning and doesn't deserve a full game ban. I also never violated the inactivity portion (1 post per cycle) so that part of the accusation should be thrown out entirely. I'm not asking to be absolved just warned as opposed to banned. Again, you were not playing the game anymore, and your non-actions made sure that town loses. | ||
|
marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Bh the thing is it feels like you're being arbitrary here by banning poof and me but not cr. when a townie (ET) literally doesn't show up at lylo the game is clearly lost and the emotional incentive to post is very low for town. and the rule about official voting in an instant majority game is just stupid. It's a bad rule. I feel like this is unfair cause I didn't ruin the game for anyone else with my inactivity. No one was playing this game. Everyone responded to each other's level of investment. IMO if you're going to ban anyone you should ban everyone, including players who died. This letter-of-the-law required-vote-in-iml thing is bullshit. Like think about it - if any townie had voted and scum had hammered, it would have been impossible for townies to vote since the game would have ended. A rule that can't be applied evenly to all players is a bad rule to judge people by. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On July 11 2014 13:18 Blazinghand wrote: I believe that the case here is pretty clear. Thepoofter was not in fact following the "spirit" of the rules. He wasn't in the thread rallying people and trying to keep the game moving; he made 2 posts in the 96 hours of N2 and D3, and no posts in the final 48 hours of D3. If Tehpoofter was following, as way say, the "spirit" of the law, I expect he would have made a non-zero number of posts in the final 48 hours. Moreover, this isn't even the point. My rules clearly state you need to vote before deadline. Tehpoofter, SnB, and ET did not vote before the deadline. It doesn't matter that it was LYLO, or what their motives were. Though honestly at LYLO I can't imagine a motivte for not voting. Not voting at LYLO as town literally always loses the game unless there is a doctor, and even then it's a long shot. In any case, it's not like these guys were like, chatting and having discussions and weren't warned. It's not like the rules I laid out were unclear. They were warned (some of them repeatedly) via PM and in thread. I literally told them I'd modkill them if they didn't vote, and that voting is mandatory by the deadline. The day ended and the three of them hadn't voted. The case is open and shut: voting is mandatory. If you don't vote, you get modkilled. None of these guys were even close to being active or playing the game, they all had like 2, maybe 3 posts in 96 hours, so it's not like they were actually active and I'm pushing this on a technicality, as it might be implied. Tehpoofter has intimated to me in PMs that he believes this is emotionally driven. I will concede, I'm not pleased with the low activity in the game. I originally was quite angry and considered pushing for a 2 or 3 game ban for ruining my game (as I have in the past, for coag and marv from the getmoript hydra). However, a disproportionate punishment would not be reasonable. Standard 1 game inactivity is the way to go. I'll also note, for the record, that in the past I've let people off the hook when they had good IRL reasons for being AFK or inactive. Tehpoofter and SnB seem to not have these good reasons, but I have not heard from EchelonTee; it's possible something came up for him, since he hasn't posted since the end of the game. If it turns out he had a good reasoning for bailing for several days without telling me, I'd like to not ban him, but for now I believe we should stick with a 1 game ban on him as well. I was clearly following the thread and waiting for townies to show up so we could vote. There was no point in "trying to rally votes" since et was simply completely absent. Me posting in. A thread he wasn't reading was not going to magically get him to read it. In a game where no one posts, it's not reasonable o expect individual players to go out and search for activity, nor is it reasonable to expect townies to put additional emotional energy into a game that is clearly lost, as this game was 100% lost unless et showed up. In addition, applying this rule in this way is unfair; it punishes town vs scum. As town, the longer I wait the better the chance is that et shows up and we can find a consensus town lynch. Until he shows up, voting can only hurt me and never help me. | ||
|
justanothertownie
16322 Posts
On July 11 2014 21:19 strongandbig wrote: I was clearly following the thread and waiting for townies to show up so we could vote. There was no point in "trying to rally votes" since et was simply completely absent. Me posting in. A thread he wasn't reading was not going to magically get him to read it. In a game where no one posts, it's not reasonable o expect individual players to go out and search for activity, nor is it reasonable to expect townies to put additional emotional energy into a game that is clearly lost, as this game was 100% lost unless et showed up. In addition, applying this rule in this way is unfair; it punishes town vs scum. As town, the longer I wait the better the chance is that et shows up and we can find a consensus town lynch. Until he shows up, voting can only hurt me and never help me. Even if all of this should be true - if there was a clear deadline and you did not vote before it your whole argument fails. Maybe voting late is good but not voting at all is never good and explicitly against the rules AND the spirit of the game. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Plus, it's still an impossible standard - if some people do vote, then the day will end with other people not having voted. There's literally no reason a vote in the voting thread should be required instead of expressing an intended vote in the game thread. | ||
| ||
