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On July 25 2013 03:19 Z-BosoN wrote:
Actually I think Lazermonkey makes a fair point. As a townie, the best play is to kill your mason pair before he kills you... "agreeing" to die if you are townie is pretty damn stupid. And scum will just do the same.
Let's just leave the mason-kill as a vigi-shot and move on?
I guess you're right. I just really don't want scum to use it as free KP. Oh and I think Rayn is scummier than Shaio because the VT claim is null.
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On July 25 2013 03:16 Rainbows wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 03:10 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 25 2013 02:59 Rainbows wrote:On July 25 2013 02:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Well, that is a retarded policy Why? Regarding double lynch. If you are about to get mason-killed, then the correct play, no matter what alignment you, is to kill your mason partner before he kills you. If he flips scum, then whop-whop you are suddenly town once again. No townie would NOT do this making the move alignment unindicative (because scum would obviously do the same thing). Regarding policy lynching the mason who kills his partner and he flips town. Well, this is just bad. The same way you wouldn't lynch a vigi who kills town. Even though he might not kill scum he saves us one misslynch if he kills a top suspect. If he kills someone without a very good reason and that person flips town, then we should obviously look into that player. But policy lyncing someone who kills town is a big no-no! I think you're making Koshi's policy bigger than it is. He proposes we only kill random mason kills not on towns consensus. And that's fine, as long as nobody random kills. I want to use the mason-KP as a way of double lynch, and hopefully nobody fucks with that. Even if you are town and about to get lynched don't martyr-KP your mason, we can always do that later if he's suspicious. If you're about to get mason killed by the consensus of town and are town, think of it as a double lynch --- you're denying town information by denying your flip. Anyway, I think scum have more motivation to mason kill if they are about to be killed in any way lynch or otherwise. If you're town and strike town with your mason kill martyr-KP then only shit can ensue imo.
Well this is wrong IMO. Unless I'm really sure that my partner is town (and to be realistic, this is D1 noone is going to be THAT certain) then the correct play is to kill your partner and hope that he flips scum. If not, bad luck but at least you've got yourself 72 extra hours to argue yourself out of the lynch.
But let's ignore that for the time being. Too much setup speculation and policy talk and too little scum hunting...
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Well only scum will mason kill if they are about to be lynched. That much is true because town can always do it later.
But yeah I guess the policy doesn't really work because people love vigging other people. Especially on dates.
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On July 25 2013 03:10 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 02:59 Rainbows wrote:On July 25 2013 02:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Well, that is a retarded policy Why? Regarding double lynch. If you are about to get mason-killed, then the correct play, no matter what alignment you, is to kill your mason partner before he kills you. If he flips scum, then whop-whop you are suddenly town once again. No townie would NOT do this making the move alignment unindicative (because scum would obviously do the same thing). Regarding policy lynching the mason who kills his partner and he flips town. Well, this is just bad. The same way you wouldn't lynch a vigi who kills town. Even though he might not kill scum he saves us one misslynch if he kills a top suspect. If he kills someone without a very good reason and that person flips town, then we should obviously look into that player. But policy lyncing someone who kills town is a big no-no!
No, in that case the best play for a town who is going to get mason viged is to talk his way out of it before the shot. If it is clear that using the vig unless authorized by town is treated as a scum claim than any town who shoots so he doesn't die is throwing the game and I don't think anyone in this is that dumb.
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On July 25 2013 03:22 Rainbows wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 03:19 Z-BosoN wrote:
Actually I think Lazermonkey makes a fair point. As a townie, the best play is to kill your mason pair before he kills you... "agreeing" to die if you are townie is pretty damn stupid. And scum will just do the same.
Let's just leave the mason-kill as a vigi-shot and move on? I guess you're right. I just really don't want scum to use it as free KP. Oh and I think Rayn is scummier than Shaio because the VT claim is null.
If scum use it as a KP that is literally the best case scenario for us(unless we were going to vig the scum and they shot before they get lynched). And even in that scenario we come out ahead/even (1 town, 1 scum die and scum losses a kp probably, 1nk) compared to (mislynch, 2nk).
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On July 25 2013 03:34 Stutters695 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 03:10 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 25 2013 02:59 Rainbows wrote:On July 25 2013 02:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Well, that is a retarded policy Why? Regarding double lynch. If you are about to get mason-killed, then the correct play, no matter what alignment you, is to kill your mason partner before he kills you. If he flips scum, then whop-whop you are suddenly town once again. No townie would NOT do this making the move alignment unindicative (because scum would obviously do the same thing). Regarding policy lynching the mason who kills his partner and he flips town. Well, this is just bad. The same way you wouldn't lynch a vigi who kills town. Even though he might not kill scum he saves us one misslynch if he kills a top suspect. If he kills someone without a very good reason and that person flips town, then we should obviously look into that player. But policy lyncing someone who kills town is a big no-no! No, in that case the best play for a town who is going to get mason viged is to talk his way out of it before the shot. If it is clear that using the vig unless authorized by town is treated as a scum claim than any town who shoots so he doesn't die is throwing the game and I don't think anyone in this is that dumb. Its inplicit that you try to argue yourself out of the lynch. But if you are about to die you really shoul kill your partner. Even if we would introduce stupid policy about lynching anyone who doesn't kill scum with mason kill, then so what? It is a situation where you have nothing to lose. Either you hit town and you might die, which you would've done anyway this day. Or you hit scum and its party time.
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I want to talk about sylencia for a little bit.
Here he posts asking about anonymity, demonstrating an interest in discussing such aspects of the QT mechanic.
On July 24 2013 13:17 Sylencia wrote:
Firm, thoughts about anonymity in the qts?
However, later on, when there was some discussion about whether or not it is worth it to mass claim the mason partners, he blatantly tells us his own:
On July 24 2013 23:46 Sylencia wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2013 21:28 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On July 24 2013 21:26 Lazermonkey wrote:
Artanis, do you even have anything relevant to say? Your only not-troll comment was towards Malongo basically telling him his arguments was bad, yet not taking a stance on what you thought about him or anyone else in the game. I said Rayn and Firm are scum because kenpachi gambit. That's two scum already. You guys can find the rest. Your stuff is weak. Having 2 people fall for the same gambit in such a short period seems quite unlikely. I'm pretty sure rayn has been in a game with an attempted Kenpachi gambit anyways so he would know better than to fall for it along with his teammate. Show nested quote +On July 24 2013 22:09 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 24 2013 22:03 ShiaoPi wrote:
@rayn:
We can agree to disagree on the interpretation of your posts. Still you and FirmTofu were the only persons to really react in a suspicious manner to the claim so that is the point where I am standing.
Who is your lynch-choice now that you have unvoted? FirmTofu or Sylencia. Explain thx. Also, Artanis is my current partner (don't think he mentioned it)
This is very inconsistent, and in my experience is much more likely to come from scum.
Add to that the zero amount of scumhunting he has done. All his talk is related to game mechanics, which is very easy and comfortable for scum to talk in.
Thoughts?
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Can we just set the kill mechanic aside and label it as a vig shot? If you think about it, it's not a discussion that's going to be productive.
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On July 25 2013 02:17 Stutters695 wrote:
Anyway I'd totally be game to lynch Mal until he explains better why he thought it was a good idea to try and get someone killed so early in the day. If this was an attempt at a play from a town to force discussion the obvious choice is to not actually PM the host and just say you did so he'd contribute before he died.
Something doesn't add up.
##vote: Malango And Malago's play is scum indicative because...? I agree his early play was WIERD. But why the actual fuck would he do stuff like that if he would be scum? It would be even wierder. And bolded part: how do you know this was not the case?
This is the only time you've ever scum hunted despite having several posts where you discuss policy/setup/defending random dudes/fluff. I'm not impressed at all.
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On July 25 2013 03:50 Z-BosoN wrote:
Can we just set the kill mechanic aside and label it as a vig shot? If you think about it, it's not a discussion that's going to be productive. THIS GUY
HE KNOWS HIS STUFF!
I'm not even kidding, we are really discussing unimportant matters at the moment.
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On July 25 2013 02:24 Rainbows wrote:Can someone meta me on Dandel? Is he always like this? Z-BosoN says generic pro-town stuff, passively finger-points then goes to bed. Rainbows no like. Show nested quote +On July 24 2013 15:21 Z-BosoN wrote:On July 24 2013 15:14 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 24 2013 15:10 Z-BosoN wrote:
Also, @rayne
You seem a little disgruntled that ShiaoPi claimed VT. Why the negative reaction? Because the claim is either stupid or scum. Its a pointless claim no matter what alignment he is. However, I dislike the fact that he just waltzed into the thread with that pointless post and has not posted anything since...
I'm already hard-confirmed town just based on my meta.
Deal with it.
But I do want to make zboson dead too.
On July 25 2013 02:33 Rainbows wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 02:30 Koshi wrote:On July 25 2013 01:20 Lazermonkey wrote:
So guys, apparantly I'm masoned with Koshi. I'm interested in this guy and will try to have a nice little chat with him trying to figure out what alignment he is later on today. I'm getting some bad vibes from his play this far. I agree with you that I was a bit fluffy in my post. I find it strange that so many people jump on this FT wagon with the only reason being the "Kenpachi rule". I pointed out 2 people that went on that wagon really easily. But in 1 hour I will have a 1 on 1 with Lazermonkey, we will see what happens there. I generally don't like the Tofu wagon atm. Rayn was way more vocal about the VT claim than Tofu was, I find it strange that everybody wagoned onto Tofu instead.
So you think it's only about the kenpachi?
eyo
When there is stuff, there is always stuff, you see. Some stuff is stuffier than other stuff but it's never alone. Unless it's not there, you see, but if it's not there it can't be alone either because it's not even there, you see.
Artanis is also scum.
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I can tell because of tells
And the monkeycarrots told me.
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VOTE COUNT:
FirmTofu (3): Lazermonkey, ShiaoPi, Dandel Ion
ShiaoPi (0): raynpelikoneet
Deadline is in ~12 hours. Currently FirmTofu is set to be lynched!
Reminder: Voting is mandatory!
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Or you don't want to be temp-banned again dandel 
@Lazermonkey Fuck yea.
tell me more about sylencia
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Hmyhea, Sylencia looks bad. No scum hunting at all. Sadely he is somewhat of a lynch bait. I managed to get him killed D1 once as scum : /. But he really need to step up his posting.
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On July 25 2013 03:43 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 03:34 Stutters695 wrote:On July 25 2013 03:10 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 25 2013 02:59 Rainbows wrote:On July 25 2013 02:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Well, that is a retarded policy Why? Regarding double lynch. If you are about to get mason-killed, then the correct play, no matter what alignment you, is to kill your mason partner before he kills you. If he flips scum, then whop-whop you are suddenly town once again. No townie would NOT do this making the move alignment unindicative (because scum would obviously do the same thing). Regarding policy lynching the mason who kills his partner and he flips town. Well, this is just bad. The same way you wouldn't lynch a vigi who kills town. Even though he might not kill scum he saves us one misslynch if he kills a top suspect. If he kills someone without a very good reason and that person flips town, then we should obviously look into that player. But policy lyncing someone who kills town is a big no-no! No, in that case the best play for a town who is going to get mason viged is to talk his way out of it before the shot. If it is clear that using the vig unless authorized by town is treated as a scum claim than any town who shoots so he doesn't die is throwing the game and I don't think anyone in this is that dumb. Its inplicit that you try to argue yourself out of the lynch. But if you are about to die you really shoul kill your partner. Even if we would introduce stupid policy about lynching anyone who doesn't kill scum with mason kill, then so what? It is a situation where you have nothing to lose. Either you hit town and you might die, which you would've done anyway this day. Or you hit scum and its party time.
Being irresponsible with a vig shot because "you have nothing to lose" is not a good play at all. If you don't let it happen and don't hit scum you're responsible for a mislynch+1 town death and wasted the entire day. We don't have to use the vig but shooting unless you're sure someone is scum is straight retarded if you are town.
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On July 25 2013 04:03 Ange777 wrote:
VOTE COUNT:
FirmTofu (3): Lazermonkey, ShiaoPi, Dandel Ion
ShiaoPi (0): raynpelikoneet
Deadline is in ~12 hours. Currently FirmTofu is set to be lynched!
Reminder: Voting is mandatory!
I voted a couple pages back. Was there something wrong with how I voted?
Thanks
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On July 25 2013 04:08 Stutters695 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 03:43 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 25 2013 03:34 Stutters695 wrote:On July 25 2013 03:10 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 25 2013 02:59 Rainbows wrote:On July 25 2013 02:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Well, that is a retarded policy Why? Regarding double lynch. If you are about to get mason-killed, then the correct play, no matter what alignment you, is to kill your mason partner before he kills you. If he flips scum, then whop-whop you are suddenly town once again. No townie would NOT do this making the move alignment unindicative (because scum would obviously do the same thing). Regarding policy lynching the mason who kills his partner and he flips town. Well, this is just bad. The same way you wouldn't lynch a vigi who kills town. Even though he might not kill scum he saves us one misslynch if he kills a top suspect. If he kills someone without a very good reason and that person flips town, then we should obviously look into that player. But policy lyncing someone who kills town is a big no-no! No, in that case the best play for a town who is going to get mason viged is to talk his way out of it before the shot. If it is clear that using the vig unless authorized by town is treated as a scum claim than any town who shoots so he doesn't die is throwing the game and I don't think anyone in this is that dumb. Its inplicit that you try to argue yourself out of the lynch. But if you are about to die you really shoul kill your partner. Even if we would introduce stupid policy about lynching anyone who doesn't kill scum with mason kill, then so what? It is a situation where you have nothing to lose. Either you hit town and you might die, which you would've done anyway this day. Or you hit scum and its party time. Being irresponsible with a vig shot because "you have nothing to lose" is not a good play at all. If you don't let it happen and don't hit scum you're responsible for a mislynch+1 town death and wasted the entire day. We don't have to use the vig but shooting unless you're sure someone is scum is straight retarded if you are town. Like I said, I don't care about this anymore. Feel free to keep this opinion of your but keep in mind that this policy is useless unless everyone accepts it. And there are already alot of guys doing so. This really feels like post game discussion TBH. Its very likely that someone will use this power during the day anyway, no matter if you like it or not. Now, comment on something else.
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On July 25 2013 04:06 Lazermonkey wrote:
Hmyhea, Sylencia looks bad. No scum hunting at all. Sadely he is somewhat of a lynch bait. I managed to get him killed D1 once as scum : /. But he really need to step up his posting.
I see. How would you compare his playstyle/activity in that game and in this one?
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On July 25 2013 04:12 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2013 04:06 Lazermonkey wrote:
Hmyhea, Sylencia looks bad. No scum hunting at all. Sadely he is somewhat of a lynch bait. I managed to get him killed D1 once as scum : /. But he really need to step up his posting. I see. How would you compare his playstyle/activity in that game and in this one? Don't know really. Maybe I'll look it up later. Here is the link anyway: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=404818
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EPT
