• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:55
CEST 07:55
KST 14:55
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins Maestros of the Game 23ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7
Community News
MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon275.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes33Weekly Cups (June 22-28): Zergs thrive in new patch2[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)99
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon Serral wins Maestros of the Game 2 HomeStory Cup In Early July 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)
Tourneys
Vespene Cup #1 — $300+ USD, July 10 HomeStory Cup 29 Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
First season(s) of tastosis gomtv gsl vods? BW General Discussion Starcraft vs Retro Category on Twitch ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered?
Tourneys
The Casual Games of the Week Thread [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Path of Exile
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Men's Fashion Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard? Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4319 users

Ego Mini Mafia - Page 17

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 15 16 17 All
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-11 16:04:30
April 11 2013 16:04 GMT
#1835
On April 12 2013 01:02 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2013 01:00 marvellosity wrote:
I just like lynching people, what can I say :<

what game did I lynch you in?


Paranoia.


Oh, well then. I was under retarded pressure all day, my pushes in those situations are always diabolical. Collateral damage babe <3

P.S your jokes were different
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 16:10 GMT
#1837
On April 12 2013 01:09 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2013 01:03 marvellosity wrote:
On April 12 2013 01:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On April 12 2013 00:56 DarthPunk wrote:
On April 12 2013 00:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:
DP have you ever been lynched in a game?


Yeah. Twice. The first time was my first newbie. The second time it was marvs fault but Bugs yelled at him a lot and pm'd me apologising for letting me get lynched. So that made me feel better.

Yeah then your record is very impressive. What i mean is even if you got a record of 100-0 it doesn't really mean anything if you are lynched in 80% of the games. And then you are clearly doing something wrong.

After all this is a game where not only what you say matters, but who are the people analyzing what you are saying and do they believe you. If nobody believes you it doesn't matter how right you are and you are doing something wrong. :D


Yeah, stats in mafia are a very interesting thing, for reasons you mention and others. I've played 40 (!) games here and been lynched once as town and twice as mafia.

I've only been lynched once, and it was right at the end of LX. Does that mean I'm a good player too?


It sure does.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 16:13 GMT
#1839
Bears a remarkable resemblance to you, oddly.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-11 16:20:15
April 11 2013 16:16 GMT
#1843
I was going for truthful

edit: oats, not sure you know what 'sheeping' means dear
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 16:36 GMT
#1848
On April 12 2013 01:29 wherebugsgo wrote:
I disagree still.

There is nothing that indicates a scumteam of sciberbia/DP/whoever would necessarily have been better than what we had.

You know why? Cause people like Axle, who play very differently dependent on alignment, are unlikely to get lynched as town.

It's all just conjecture, saying that you would have been able to balance the game better on that basis without considering those 3 vets. The argument is based on seeing the results, but there is no empirical evidence that it actually holds in practice (also there's no evidence that the reason the scumteam lost was because of player imbalance either!)

And to top it all off there's no measure of skill that says the scumteam you proposed is better than the one that was in this game, or that the change would have kept town level the same.

E: this was @ DP and whomever else was talking about the teams


I'm kinda tempted, in a completely arbitrary manner, to do some kind of ELO rating for players with both a town and a mafia ELO, with results in games averaged across the team's ELO. Just for curiosity of how it looks.

On a speculative note, you could say that you'd expect games with a higher proportion of players with large disparity between town and mafia ELOs to have more positive town results, regardless of 'objective' rating.

For example a game of 12 iamperfections would more often result in a town win than a game of 12 wbgs.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-11 17:00:58
April 11 2013 16:55 GMT
#1858
Just as an arbitrary example for this game, if we take 1500 ELO to be 'starting' ELO with 2500 being totally exceptional and 500 being very poor, you might see something like the following (apologise in advance for over/under estimating players, more for shits and giggles)

1. iamperfection; town ELO 2000 mafia ELO 1000
2. WaveofShadow; town ELO 1500 mafia ELO 1500
3. Ace; town ELO 2100 mafia ELO 2500
4. prplhz; town ELO 1600 mafia ELO 1200
5. DarthPunk; town ELO 2000 mafia ELO 2000
6. Oatsmaster; town ELO 1400 mafia ELO 1300
7. Tunkeg; town ELO 1500 mafia ELO 1500
8. Palmar; town ELO 2400 mafia ELO 2000
9. marvellosity; town ELO 2100 mafia ELO 2400
10. Axlegreaser; town ELO 1300 mafia ELO 1300
11. raynpelinkeet; town ELO 1600 mafia ELO 1600
12. sciberbia; town ELO 2100 mafia ELO 1700

Average strength of mafia team in this game: 4100/3 = 1366.6
Average strength of town team in this game: 17400/9 = 1933.3

Best theoretical mafia team: 6900/3 = 2300
Worst theoretical town team: 15000/9 = 1666.6

Average town ELO: 21600/12 = 1800
Average mafia ELO: 20000/12 = 1666.6
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 17:00 GMT
#1860
On April 12 2013 01:58 syllogism wrote:
While you are doing arbitrary math, can you factor in the advantage town gets from knowing that teams aren't RNGed


Well the thing is, it becomes much less arbitrary if I go back many games and factor in results of each game, because ELO by its nature is self-correcting.

So if I make a guess that's originally too high, if they lose games then their rating would fall quite quickly.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 17:01 GMT
#1863
see my last post
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 17:08 GMT
#1871
On April 12 2013 02:04 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2013 02:00 marvellosity wrote:
On April 12 2013 01:58 syllogism wrote:
While you are doing arbitrary math, can you factor in the advantage town gets from knowing that teams aren't RNGed


Well the thing is, it becomes much less arbitrary if I go back many games and factor in results of each game, because ELO by its nature is self-correcting.

So if I make a guess that's originally too high, if they lose games then their rating would fall quite quickly.

Yes but the point I'm making is, there is no REAL mathematical way of estimating skill like this. Any numbers you come up with or what a win or loss does to this arbitrary number is still just that, arbitrary.

As a player plays more and more games in a team setting, elo becomes more accurate supposedly, but with a sample size like TL Mafia, there is absolutely no way a skill rating like elo would come close to being an accurate representation. There are WAY too many mitigating factors such as the hosts, style of game (mini/normal/themed/whatever), roles available, who is playing in said game, etc. Theoretically this would matter less if people could play hundreds of games but that doesn't happen here.


Well, 'who is playing in said game' is something that would indeed be factored in

It would be more a project of curiosity rather than something that absolutely establishes skill, obviously.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 17:48 GMT
#1878
btw, i'm not saying at all the ELO would be 'accurate', but it would be kinda interesting to see how the scores measured up to how the playerbase perceives different players. And then also to see how good the rating system was at predicting results of games...

like pretty sure Palmar's town ELO would be way lower than how he is perceived; he lost YANMM and LVIII as town, and as mafia I've handed him 4 other losses besides that in the last year (LIV, Death Note, NMM3, Hero), so his ELO would be relatively low for someone of his stature.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 17:56 GMT
#1881
On April 12 2013 02:55 wherebugsgo wrote:
talking about Elo like this is more evidence that your entire mentality is results-based.

winrate is not everything in a game like this, because there are so many factors that go into a game. You can't compare a win in one game to a win in another; it's the same reason people fuck up meta all the time. Games are not strictly comparable one to one.

There are plenty of worse players who get carried and plenty of better players who get brought down. Yes, winrates may correlate with skill, but not nearly as strongly in other team games, because the sample sizes are so small. Average games played is probably less than 10. Good luck getting anything statistically significant out of samples that small.

(for the record; I have 7 mafia games. You think you're gonna get anything useful out of those from an objective standpoint?)


how many times do i have to repeat that it wouldn't be an objective measure?

why are you taking it so seriously???
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-11 17:59:27
April 11 2013 17:59 GMT
#1883
As I said when I first mentioned it, just curiosity for how it would look...

edit: and i guess curiosity for how well it measured future games (not well, i imagine)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 18:00 GMT
#1886
It came about because of the discussion on game balance, but nowhere did I even begin to suggest it should have anything to do with balancing games.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 18:37 GMT
#1891
well why not, right?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 18:42 GMT
#1894
Can't argue with 100% as mafia. Teach me!

The sheer number of stats there are like your 1-6 town record would make ratings quite amusing.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 18:45 GMT
#1896
You could go into games dismissing his opinions entirely out of hand because your rating is 500 points above his which obviously means he's a scrub and you're a god and he should bow down before you immediately.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 19:07 GMT
#1898
I was trying to and then bugs took me all serious and called me toxic for no reason :<
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
April 11 2013 19:26 GMT
#1906
spr srs.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Prev 1 15 16 17 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 5m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft511
Nina 124
ProTech112
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3443
GuemChi 3040
Shuttle 376
Hyuk 181
Leta 142
Dewaltoss 123
Mind 54
ZergMaN 42
Bale 17
Icarus 7
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm346
League of Legends
Doublelift2950
JimRising 755
Counter-Strike
summit1g8050
Coldzera 1036
C9.Mang0221
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King123
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream177
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 35
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1347
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
4h 5m
HomeStory Cup
5h 5m
Replay Cast
18h 5m
HomeStory Cup
1d 5h
Replay Cast
1d 18h
HomeStory Cup
2 days
OSC
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
6 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

YSL S3
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
Escore Tournament S3: W1
SCTL 2026 Spring
HSC XXIX
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
Escore Tournament S3: W2
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Eternal Conflict S2 E2
Heroes Pulsing #3
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.